jeffw

I was thinking it would be cool to have a complete normally aspirated kit that included the following:

1.) CAI
2.) Intake Manifold/Plenum (probably Crawford)
3.) High clearance strut [sic] brace
4.) Headers (probably Crawford)
5.) Cat back exhaust
6.) ECU upgrade tuned specifically for all of the above mods
7.) Dyno results of a stock MT 350Z vs. a Z will all the above mods

This would be a great way to guarantee that all your parts work together and aren’t destructively interfering with each other. Basically, someone else does all the hard work of coming up with the ultimate combo.

Also, the ECU upgrade could be as simple as a one time reflash. You’d never have to worry about reprogramming because you’d already have the ECU perfectly tuned for every NA mod you could possibly apply.

Another benefit: suppliers might be willing to cut you a good deal since they know that you’re buying every single part from them.

How much would y’all be willing to pay for this?


--
Jeff

joeshow750

I have thought about this too. This way I just make one purchase and get it all. I honestly don't know why more companies don't offer this. I guess I'd be willing to pay, hmmmm...$3K.

rodH

iTrader: (2)

I would think as a package deal, it could be done for $2000

1)CAI-$175
2)intake manifold-$275
3)strut brace-$250
4)headers-$600?
5)exhaust-$700
6)ecu-$500 (COULD BE less though)

=$2000 (the CAIs by themselves are slightly more, the intake/plenum by it self is like $350, Strut tower braces for other cars can be in the $100 range, so $250 should be PLENTY, Headers, I am not familiar with prices there, but I would imagine $400-$800, Exhaust we have seen between $550-$1200-for stainless, so $700 price shold be pretty safe in a "package" situation).

Dang, that would make a nice package, I am willing to bet, that it is ONLY a matter of time, before this happens, and it could get us well over 300 HP, possible 320 (if you add them up individually, I am sure a "claimed" HP would be around 345, but we know that would be a HUGE "claim")?? that would be sweeeeeeeeeeeeet!!!!

SoCalKid86

headers for 600? I wouldn't count on it.

joeshow750

True, true. B&B has the cheapest headers I've seen and the cheapest price for them I've seen is $1,295.00......$2,000 for everything, that would be awesome, but I wouldn't expect to see all of that for that price, atleast not any time soon. You'd think as a package deal the company would take a fair amount of the price down, but I don't see them actually giving any sizeable discount on parts for this car.

Ricky

I wish it could be done for that price. Keep in mind the Z is new, the products are really expensive now. Those prices will be hard to pull even in a few years when it's more common. Headers are more like $1200 and ECU for $500? Man I wish.. I'm guessing the Z ECU when first introduced will be about $1100-1400.

PhoenixINX

Let's go over this...

1) CAI = WASTE of money. Scratch that... stock airbox makes MORE power at speed than the CAI. PROVEN
2) Plenum = $400-600
3) Strut Brace = $300-400
4) Headers = $1200-1500


Let me tell you know... here in Nashville I dyno'd my track, and with only the plenum I made 253 rwhp... at 17% driveline loss that's basically 305 chp. I can nearly guarantee you with the rest of the bolt-ons I'm going to be nearing the 280ish rwhp.

Can I do it for $2k??? LOL... I wish.

I'm budgeting about $3k to get most of it started.

rodH

iTrader: (2)

oops, I guess Headers are MUCH more than I thought.

everything else seems pretty close, so if you could get them as a group buy (maybe in a year, when they aren't so new) it could get more like $2500 (we all know that $400 for a strut tower brace is waaaaaay to much, that price will come waaay down as demand goes up, as will Exhaust and the others, usually ECUs start out about $600-800, so $500 for a discount would be doable, the VW Chips have gone from $600 to $400 real fast).

joeshow750

Yeah, I have noticed quite a bit of price gouging by companies. Of course, they are going to use our seemingly unquenchable-mod- thirst against us and I plan on holding out for a while. I wish that "Insaneamine" guy made turbo/SC kits.

PhoenixINX

For a junk strut tower bar... yeah sub $400 is VERY doable. For quality pieces, similar to what is found in track cars... I wouldn't expect much lower than that.

ITR#203

I dont understand why a stock airbox would be better at speed than a CAI. Can you post the proof that you have? Certainly, I am not a fan of short ram intakes as many times, they really are worse on the street. However, a good cold air intake should have MORE of an advantage at speed than on a dyno, should it not?

Ben Davis

Any one have a link to this crawford Plenum?!?!

Also if you'r gonna do it, do it right: Bored TB should be included as well as igintion of some kind and pullys, then a flywheel....

Ben

PhoenixINX

Bored TB has already been proven as zero gain... too bad.

As for a link? Yeah... I see it everyday. Second build should be done this week! Can't wait to have one back on the car!

As for pulleys and a flywheel... yup, those should be NICE gains!

PhoenixINX

We've already tested the stockair box...

Wait... before we go down this alley... do you own a Z? Okay... if so please look at where the inlet is... If you don't own a Z, let me explain - the inlet is firing forward, hense WILL create an ever so MINOR ramair effect at speed. Too bad you can't dyno this effect without one hell of a fan... Doug has the exact numbers recorded, but he noted the test indicated the tock airbox with stock airfilter was making some .03 lbs of boost. (Which is reality is nothing) Though a cold air... will make ZERO and obtains air strickly on suction.

You tell me which is better?

Little facts these CAI companies are forgetting to tell you... ask the domestic guys... they HATE they can't dyno their nice ramair hoods.

The faster you go, the more power it makes. Interesting eh? The only selling point of the CAI is... "It gets air from a colder area of the car" - No offense... WOOP TEE DOO....

You know how it makes power? It's due to a far longer intake track, that's why many cars lose power down low and make it back up top. By the time the air has traveled through that piping and through a hundred+ degree engine bay its temperature is irrelavant.

Advantage to stock airbox/ram air? It retains the shorter track, thus better torque... though when at speed its beginning to make the "rameffect" hense assisting with topend.

Jeeez Nissan, AEM and INJEN don't think your engineers know what they are doing.

The only time you'll see a CAI make power is when its replacing a VERY restrictive intake. i.e. `02+ RSXs, `00+ S2000, `01+ Celica GTS... period.

rodH

iTrader: (2)

ya, I think it is only a matter of time, and we will see what mods work and which don't and which ones truly have a synergistic effect. I will wait and see before I purchase

TJZ

what about adding a throttle body on that list?

Fëanor

"Advantage to stock airbox/ram air? It retains the shorter track, thus better torque... though when at speed its beginning to make the "rameffect" hense assisting with topend."


I'm in full agreement, and I'd like to further the cause for the stock air intake with this observation- it's plastic. Most aftermarket CAIs I've seen have been metal, which ironically will conduct more engine bay heat into the incoming air than plastic piping.

The slightly warmer air provided by a metallic CAI is going to have an infinitesimally negative effect, but since we're splitting hairs with talk about .03lbs of boost, I thought I'd point it out.

alphaz

I tend to disagree with you Evil on the CAI. I did a baseline dyno on my stock track and recorded a 242.4 hp/238.4 tq . I installed the Injen CAI and two weeks later dyno at 245.5 hp/241.1 tq.
The dyno was at the same shop and the same octane of gas and only 4 degrees warmer on the second dyno.
There is some improvement with a CAI. Was the cost per HP worth it.............only on the track for lapping days.
I hope to have my Zedders and Cats before road Atlanta.

blascelles

iTrader: (3)

Do you know anything about frequency tuning? How manufacturers tune intake manifolds? Exhaust systems? Since dyno testing is irrelevant here, did you test in a wind tunnel? Did you test all systems? You are making very general statements above. There are plenty of Nissan engineers that I respect, Kojima for instance is very knowledgable and I would consult him first on matters.

Try and look at it like this. You can buy a touring model or a track model. CAI is just a name. The touring model doesn't make more power than the track model.


Tell me how it is please.

state

This thread is tough one to reserve comment. :-/ A lot of folks are making really excellent points but a strong voice to stamp out dissenting opinions is not helpful. I've had the opportunity to see a number of project cars from vision to fruition. Specific to CAIs, you will almost ALWAYS see a gain over a stock air box. Yes, cold-air and tuned resonance/harmonics play a huge role here. My SR20DE powered 200SX SE-R in normally-aspirated trim saw big dyno proven gains -- and only got better when I went the FI route via a large Garrett T3/T40E hybrid turbo (yielding over 400HP to the wheels on pump gas BTW).

Not all CAIs are created equally and I personally prefer AEM products. I won't bad-mouth Injen or any other company but I know AEM is a very strong company with real engineers (read real testing and controlled environments).

I didn't hesistate to get the AEM CAI for my 350Z (yes, AEM posts dyno-charts for many of their applications and few other companies do).

YMMV, but stating broadly that CAIs don't work or likening them to a 'snake-oil' modification is unfounded and ignorant. Also the use of mandrel-bent AL instead of plastic is HUGELY better. OEMs use plastic because it offers a cheap mass production platform. AEM CAIs are coated and the thermal characteristics of AL vs. plastic favor AL every time. The stock 350Z air box is forced to breathe through an opening in the cross brace that isn't quite large enough. Couple that with the fact that most CAIs employ a velocity stack on the air filter element, and you get gains beyond simple air volume. I also happen to know with authority that a certain OEM has tested CAIs and affirmed the power gains. ;-)

I for one can't wait to see your testing and development on the new plenum designs! There is room for power on a number of fronts and find this to be an especially exciting time!