Zivman

iTrader: (19)

calling me ignorant shows you are ignorant.

How many autos are running 500+??? Please list them up for me.

I have seen people run VB upgrades and still have issues at sub 400 power levels. Flat out, if you abuse either trans it will fail. When it comes to 400+ the manual is the better choice. The auto, even with a VB upgrade, may not keep up or hold up.


I am not trying to say that the auto is a bad choice. WTF do I care if you have an auto??? I have no stake, nor do I give a ****. The question was in reference to the manual mode for the auto. I very clearly stated that is basically nothing more than the standard auto - It's all gimmick because it is no different than a standard auto that allows you to downshift without stopping or the use of the brake. standard autos have the sequence 1-2-3-D and you can upshift just like the slapstick autos on the Z.

What do you want me to say???? The auto is just that, an auto.... calling it anything else is not true. it has a slapstick feature that makes a **** poor attempt at making you feel like you are driving a manual. In which case, why not just by the damn manual tranny??? It isn't the 'best of both worlds', it isn't 'just like a manual'... it is a freaking automatic transmission.

Like has been stated, if it were a dsg tranny it would be completely different

Black Duck

I have the auto but never use it in full auto mode because the tiptronic works well and I can change when I am ready.

It is not a gimmick and slightly different from just a regular auto box.

Cube

iTrader: (7)

Since I don't pay attention to the Z's and G's, I know of 1 FX35 that has ever broken 500 rwhp and his tranny is holding up just fine. Snaped an axel, didn't harm the tranny. I think you know what FX35 I'm referring to. You're still ignorant, and saying that doesn't make me ignorant. Me saying things about the 6MT that I have no clue about would make me ignorant.
Gimmick... lmao. You're stating the difference and reason it was made and then calling it a gimmick. It wasn't meant to be a manual transmission. If it were meant to be a manual transmission, it would be a manual transmission. It's meant to be an automatic transmission (hence 5AT and the need for ATF) that you can force to shift up or down within certain ranges (it won't upshift if you're too low in the RPM band in the current gear, and won't down shift based on what it considers a safe range to downshift). I'm not going to argue with you on 6MT vs 5AT, you can go ahead and start a thread of your own for that and get flamed for being the 342nd retard to debate it.

Nothing... about the 6MT, he could give a rats *** about it.

Zivman

iTrader: (19)

Can you make a direct downshift from 5th to 3rd? or upshift from 3rd to 5th.

I have owned these types of trans before, they are all gimmick

Zivman

iTrader: (19)

Please get over yourself.

Black Duck

I don't ever much feel the need to shift from 3 - 5 and never did in the all the years I had manual cars in England. 5th to 3rd... sure you cannot go direct with the auto but to be honest I won't loose sleep over it....I mean it just means I knock the shifter back twice or let the car do it for me if I so wish.

Hardly a gimmick....but we all have our opinions I suppose.

Zivman

iTrader: (19)

how is it much different from a standard auto?? I have owned trans like this before. Driven them for thousands of miles... it is all gimmick. at the end of the day, whether you want to believe it or not, it is just plain jane auto. Oh boy, I can rev out gears..... could do the same thing in any auto I have owned. sure it is slightly different, but as the OP asked:
It is nothing more than a paddle that tells the auto to shift. It is not the same as a regular manual; not even close

Black Duck

I never said it was like driving a manual. All I am saying is I don't have a problem with the tiptronic in the Z. Trust me, I thought I would never be seen dead in an auto but because of the tiptronic I find it actually is acceptable. I have spent all my life driving manuals so maybe the change is just as novel as an American driving a manual.

.....So you can dip a clutch. Blip the throttle in between gearchanges and launch the car. I agree manual is loads of fun and who knows maybe I'll switch back when I buy my next car but for now I think the tiptronic is great with the amount of traffic in the DC area.

jonnylaw

iTrader: (3)

the answer to the op's question is yes all autos have a triptronic feature but NO it is nothing like an actual manual. Dsgs may outperform manual in many apps but such is not the case with the g/z b/c it is not a dsg nor Is it a clutchless manual

Bottom line is be comfortable with you choice of transmission bc everyone had their own reasons. There are pluses and minuses for both choices of tranny. But don't try to argue that the triptronic Is close to the mt bc its not.

Cannysage

iTrader: (29)

Zivman, tiptronic makes a world of difference and you can't sum it to say it's just gimmicks. In full auto mode, you do not have control of when in the rpm range you can shift. it can shift at 3k, while cruising, in full auto mode. in tiptronic mode, you can shift, right at redline. Also, tranny will slip when FI'd on full auto mode. when in tiptronic, gears have far less chance of slipping.

Zivman

iTrader: (19)

You can do that on just about every auto tranny - without having the slapshifter

chriskabobbers

iTrader: (13)

you guys argue too much over repeated issues.

rcdash

iTrader: (18)

My G coupe is the first auto car I have had - I guess I just wanted something more comfortable for the intended use of 95% street driving.

The ninth revision of the 6MT looks pretty stout so I would not consider reliability to be an issue with those anymore (that did factor in when I was buying in late 2004 though).

The auto is not a gimmick zivman. It is certainly not perfect though. There is about a 1/4 second electronic delay in stock form, which can be completely elminated with a good grounding kit (you will see the electronic display on the console change instantly after the kit is installed). There is about another 1/4 - 1/2 sec mechanical delay that can only be addressed by a valve body upgrade.

Also, not all versions of the auto tranny are the same (particularly between coupes and sedans I have noticed). The firmware version might be the only difference, but it makes a big difference. My 2004.5 5AT coupe can do a true double downshift. Double click down and it drops right from 4 to 2. You cannot double upshift (do you do this in a 6MT? maybe to save gas?). My auto will hold the gear just like a manual till you slow to almost a stop (10 mph?). It will not let you shift if it will put you past redline (good safety). I do miss not being able to pop the clutch and coast.

The 2003 G sedans had horrible 5AT programming. The gear you set was essentially a "top gear" setting and that was it. I don't think they come like this anymore. A recent 2005 sedan loaner worked much like my coupe but it had a bigger delay (no grounding wires) and it did NOT do a true double down shift. I could double down shift, but it would go from 4 to 3 to 2 with the pause between each one. Not nearly as nice!

Little did I know how fun this car would be and how much I would love to drive the car in general, let alone getting hooked onto FI and spending gobs of $$$ to add power. You will spend *less* going FI with an auto if you stick to 400 whp ($1000 for a VB upgrade and tranny cooler and you're done).
You will spend *more* going FI with an auto for more power. At least there are options now. I can't believe I've spent as much as I have. Worse I can't believe it's been so long without driving my car... still waiting on it - and in large part it's because of the full tranny build. It's takes time and money but anything is possible (including a 5AT that will be faster and more responsive than a 6MT). Porsche's 911 turbo triptronic is a good example.

Black Duck

Thats not what the regular auto trannys were designed for. The option to move to a lower gear is so you can hold in a gear if needed ie on a steep gradient. The tiptronic was designed with the idea that people would be shifting regularly.

Think we have exhausted this debate already.

Zivman

iTrader: (19)

I read as far as you recommending a grounding kit and everything from then on is not even remotely credible

Zivman

iTrader: (19)

regular autos will handle the upshifting part just fine, just not downshifting. Whether you slap the shifter or the tranny does the downshifting; It is irrelavent. you are still only allowed to shift if you are within the parameters of some computer program. At which point, you start adjusting the way you drive to compensate for the delays here and there -> which puts you at the mercy of your auto tranny.

I am sorry, as far as the question posed by the op, the auto slapstick is much more gimmick than it is standard manual. <- please try to argue that

Black Duck

Ok....it is not a gimmick but rather an alternative for someone who wants some of the fun you get from a manual without the hassle of a clutch.

Agreed? Phew.

rcdash

iTrader: (18)

ok zivman, i was giving you the benefit of the doubt - but you are just being obstinate. And I am calling you out as a moron on this issue.

What experience do you have with the 5AT. Any?

Do you have any experience driving both? Don't refute what you don't know.

A "gimmick" defined as "gim·mick n. A device employed to cheat, deceive, or trick..." has nothing to do with the 5AT.

The 5AT works as well as most triptronics on the market - it does what it is designed to do, and does it well.

Try to use your brain next time - sheesh...

Zivman

iTrader: (19)

By the definition in your post it is a gimmick -> it is tricking/deceiving in it's attempt at being a manual. It is not "almost" like a manual. It is nothing like a manual.

I have driven both the 5AT and the 6MT in the Z car application. Why are you assuming I know nothing about the auto?

I have personally owned these slapstick trans in other cars. There is no difference from the cars I have had and the Z's variation. I have even driven Nissan's CVT with the slapshifter as well. What's more gimmicky than a tranny with no gears trying to fool you into thinking it has gears, and then even more deceitful as it makes you think you are actually changing those gears??? Really nothing different. the whole purpose behind the "manual mode" is all deceit. It trys to fool you into thinking it is a manual and you guys fall hook like and sinker for it. Like I posted before, why not just get the manual if you want a manual?? With the slapstick you are still limited to what the ECU will allow you to do. in the end, it decides if you can make that shift or not <- it is in control, not you.

Say what you will, in the end it sides more closely with gimmick than an actual manual transmission and that my friends is what the OP started this thread about.

rcdash

iTrader: (18)

How is the auto tranny deceiving or fooling us exactly? Because it's a more advanced technological development?

Is it not changing the gear ratio between the engine and the driveshaft? It is.

Does it not allow you to change said gear ratio on demand? It does (despite your protests).

I don't want the manual because the automatic is better for the two purposes I'd like to use it for: in traffic, on the street, and occasional drag racing. The top two drag times on this board are in autos. Wonder why?

The only thing you cannot do with the triptronic is go directly to neutral from within manual mode. Otherwise a 5AT provides very good control of the car and the taller gears are particularly well suited for forced induction applications.

You have not made one constructive or even logical argument to date in this thread. Try, really try this time...

And I think the OP is clear that the automatic is not a computer controlled manual (ala DSG). Stop beating a dead horse already.

EDIT:
If this were true, you would not have posted the questions you did in this thread. You would already know that you can double down shift, etc. Let me guess: you drove around in "D" fully automatic mode? The 5AT is more advanced, you've got to slide the "slapstick" over to engage the manual mode - lol . Ok, j/k with you there - seriously though it takes a lot of getting used to coming from a manual to really learn its potential and its limits (like any piece of technology).

Because I really think you just need to be educated on the matter, here is a short course on tiptronic (that's the style of transmission we have in our 5AT):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiptronic

If you compare to the cars listed in this article, you will find that ours is quite admirable, not upshifting at redline in any gear and not downshifting until you nearly approach a stop. The transmission of the future I predict will be far closer to this technology than the "classic" manual.