I called Greddy today concerning their "future Turbo Kit" for the 350Z and G. I was suprised by the persons lack of interest and just kept repeating it will be out at the end ofthe year. I asked how the 6 month longer waiting will effect their sales when considering that Stillen and ProCharger are out and making the same or more power. I was told in no uncertain terms, "That is them, this is." Frankly I am no longer considering the greddy product. Thier delay and the phone guys lack of english skills is pushing towards another company. I do however prefer a Turbo setup for future power upgrades. Maybe in a couple years I could drop the compression and increase boost. Any ideas???

Robert

 

With all due respect, you telling them how to do their business in light of competitor product availability won't change what they're doing. I'd rather have them come out later with something they're continuing to test for reliability and power output. I would say the delay is something i'm more comfortable with than previous posts about tech support and customer service from ATI procharger on malfunctioning products.

And if you have a problem with a Japanese company's employee english skills, i doubt they want your business either.

 

I am not telling them how to do their business. I am, however, asking them a basic marketing question, " How will being a late to market supplier effect sales?" And again, phone sales, person to person sales and any other type of sales that require communiction should be a dialogue. The company may be Japanese, but they are doing business in the US. For my international sales I either learn their language or hire someone who does. I guess, we should be thankful Nissan/Infiniti translates our manuals into english, or places mph instead of Km, or ... Basic principles of marketing. But maybe I am expecting too much...

 

BTW, if the guy onthe other end spoke cajun, I would still feel the same. If you knew me, you would understand. I am still interested in hearing if you have any ideas for FI.

 

I don't have any ideas for FI besides what's been posted. I think for turbo the basics still apply. For big power upgrades, lower compression pistons, forged conrods, injectors, fuel managements, intercooling, maybe head gasket, bumpsticks, heavy duty clutch, retainers, heavy duty valve springs, port and polish, balance & blueprint...some people cryo treat the block or overbore with heavy duty sleeves.

My setup should be a milder setup but for reliability and power upgrades i will probably be doing most of the above if i haven't done so already.

As many people have mentioned, i am also in the camp where i have never seen as good as stock reliability in the NA to FI conversion. You have to have the commitment or willingness to rebuild in my opinion.

 

I don't understand why you care how they choose to implement their market entrance strategy. That's a question that has nothing to due with the turbo kit and they are not obligated to provide you with an answer.

There are benefits to being a first mover and there are disadvantages. I'm sure Greddy weighed their options wisely and chose the correct avenue for their product and their company.

 

Damn straight. (even though I won't be investing in greddy products-but only because I am going full Nismo).

 

about their dissinterest when speaking to you.. they probably get 20 calls a day asking the same thing..i would be dissinterested in explaining that as well

 

the greddy product will be WELL WORTH the wait. being a greddy dealer and product installer that is very experienced with their products... I am definatly qualified to say this.

their kits always fit AWESOME, and work very very well. They have always been great at providing reliable products that are superbly matched to the engines characteristics (turbocharger specs, etc).

those who dont wait for the product will most likely regret it, and those who do wait for the product will definatly fall in love with their car all over again.

as for the procharger and stillen making more HP... who cares. turn up the boost. i dont know if you all are familiar with the turbochargers in the greddy kit... but if your not, each one is good for around 300rwhp and two of them, well, do the math.

the greddy kit is not only tuning fuel but it is retuning your ignition curve... this is most likely where you are seeing the less HP then the supercharger kits that are going to be running stock NA ignition timing on your motor. The greater timing advance is good for more power, but is puting your engine closer to the edge of existence and reliability... especially for those of you on crappy california 91 octane **** water.

the greddy kit will be CARB exempt and pass emmissions in most states. this is a testiment to not only the R&D they put into the kits, but also a testiment into how well the car runs and the state of tune it is in.

another great advantage of the greddy kit is that it is run by an emanage. this means that you are welcome to retune your fuel and ignition calibration/correction via programmable maps in the emanage system via laptop and support tool or via greddy E-O1 boost controller. this is for those of you going the extra distance.

i am very biased towards greddy products, and that is because i have installed forced induction kits countless times. the only ones I have yet to see even FIT RIGHT are greddy kits. Not to mention the greddy ones always run better right off the bat with no additional tuning needed, and they always supply every single little nut and bolt you need. generally the only parts i ever have to add in a greddy turbo kit install are the proper spark plugs.

all in all, when the greddy kit is finally released, it will be the best available setup, regardless of whom else has something on the market. i already have my backorder in.

Greddy has a band of authorized dealers nationwide. your best bet is to contact a greddy dealer for information. greddy does not have 1000 employees, and i would not expect for it to be super easy to always get someone on the line that can tell you everything you want to know. this is why they have authorized dealers. i have never had a problem understanding their english.

As for asking them marketing questions... why do you even care. If someone asked me that question about their kit coming out later then other companies kits and how it will effect sales... i would simply say something like "there is a difference between building a forced induction kit, and researching and developing a forced induction kit. time, money, and quality being the differences"

-charles
cj motorsports (proud to be a greddy dealer)

 

Actually, I wouldn't ATI or Stillen direct competitors to Greddy because they're superchargers compared to Greddy who is doing a turbo setup. Since there are several people waiting for a reliable setup, Greddy will be able to cash in on those individuals immediately and gain a great marketshare over other turbo companies.

 

That is kind of a myopic outlook that I am forced to disagree with. Greddy's competition is anyone making parts for the Z whether it is a power adder or not. They are even competing with themselves.

 

thanks phunk for the info and dismissing alot of the rambling that has gone on about greddy and ati.

 

Phunk,

Thank you. I was looking for insight. I was hoping to get the same info from Greddy.

Robert

 

I'm sure the Greddy kit will be good, BUT(Ahh yes, there is one), as a current RSX Type S owner, I really have been pushed away from their kits. Everyone that has installed their kit(DYI or "Professional") has had problems, and basically has been told that their best bet will be to make their own custom fuel map on the e-manage(which all in all is the best thing to do, tune it to your car, but these are supposed to be basically plug and play type of kits, going by how they advertise them). Everyone was waiting for them, hoping they would be good, but now everyone feels like a sucker for not getting the cybernation motorsports kit(stage II 439 whp untuned, traction problems anyone? haha).

As for me, if/when I switch to a Z, personally I'll probably go for the procharger or hks twins. They just don't leave me with a good taste in my mouth after seeing the problems friends and or fellow rsx community members have had. Hell they took 3 releases of their exhaust to get it right, where it didn't hit the rear sway bar. I also just am not much on a turbo kit that doesn't come with an intercooler.

Just my opinion, not telling anyone to go run out and buy a procharger or hks twins and that greddy isn't good, because they have had great products in the past, just my experiences make me feel differently than most about them. Another thing, an earlier poster said "Just turn up the boost to make more power", works two ways, just get a smaller pully and make some more power. While the greddy kit does have more overall potential, the ati procharger could easily push the engine to its ragged edge before having to replace internals. Albeit I'm more of a fan of turbo's on imports in general, and because of being able to change boost levels with the turn of a ****.

 

Charles,

Your posts are always very informative and reveal alot about what people like me dont know, that is, the details of the install, reliability of the product, quality, and customer service. You mentioned you were getting the ATI procharger kit soon and I would be very interested in observing how it compares in terms of install and quality of build relative to the greddy setup. Its the relative simplicity of a supercharger vs a turbocharger that biases me towards the former.


RaymanZ

 

After reading all the banter for a while now, I think that both the Greddy and the ATI kit are not going to have a problem existing side by side with each other. They are indirect competitors, like Mr. Potato Head pointed out, but I think they each cater to a specific niche. The fact that the ATI reached market first is pretty irrelevant because forced induction consumers as a whole are patient and like to see the market develop. Most people don't want to be the test monkeys.

I think Greddy understands these points and they are taking advantage of them to increase R&D and make a better product. However, that doesn't mean ATI makes an inferior product because their kit simply doesn't require as much R&D.

As a turbo person, I would dismiss the Procharger immediately, regardless of its build quality or price. And I'm sure there are people who would dismiss the Greddy offering because they are supercharger people. Both will do fine, even though they are partially competing with each other.

 

With all due respect, Greddy is a fairly big company. I'm sure the same person that answered your call will not be the marketing director or the same guy calling the shots .

They've been around for awhile and are not going to freely release answers to their marketing strategy. They're playing it smart by just giving you the necessary information.

I've known the reputation of GReddy since I was in grade school. These guys didn't get where they are now by playing dumb and holding back products to financially hurt themselves.

Besides...in 6 months... there will be more Z owners, more people tired of their current bolt ons, more refinements in the GReddy product, and less stock problematic Z's on the road.


Alot of people are pushing their Z's right now instead of prematurely installing some random supercharger, turbo..etc.. because they don't want to second guess a problem rooting from the kit or the car itself.

 

you should all know that greddy runs almost a year behind anyways... first I heard about the turbo was that it would be out around april and I know some of you heard it before that. and now we are lookin at the end of this year... I've said it before and I'll say it now I wouldnt expect it till begining of next year at the earliest.

-non

 

How is it myopic? They're going for a specific portion of a market that is geared towards people that are interested in turboing they're cars. Why do you think the price of a turbo is pretty high? If Greddy were competing with the entire market of companies who were making parts for the Z, then it would benefit them to produce the turbo setup at a low price to gain a bigger piece of the import market, but that would be foolhardy to do for several reasons: 1) turbo parts are high in general and selling them at a loss would hurt Greddy's bottom line, 2) each tuner within the market have different tastes and some prefer different types of setups over others. It would behoove Greddy to even try and market the turbo as a lowcost add on because the majority of tuners out there do not wish to have a turbo setup, 3) Greddy, at its core, is a turbo company which specializes in turboing cars. Their market is indeed different from that of ATI's and Stillen's, who are making superchargers (their competitors are Vortech and Jackson, if Jackson ever decides to make a supercharger for the Z), but is similar to companies like HKS, Power Enterprise, Top Secret, and Turbonetics. Just because they are all part of the import market does not mean that they are all in competition with one another.

 

I agree with most of what you stated. However, I believe that all FI companies compete with one another. I see many Toyotas supercharged, Hondas (S2K for example), the Cooper, Miata's... Not to mention the domestics. All of the aftermarket FI companies are fighting for your (general you) business. The only reason I wanted a turbo setup is so I could get do engine mods and then increase boost easily. However, that’s not say I have discounted the idea of a supercharger, nor does that imply others have either. The ATI seems damn nice and is priced well. The Stillen, while not a favorite hear will undoubtedly find its way on several Z's and G's.

My biggest stumbling block is why the delay in products for the VQ. The engine has been available in its form for well over a year - when did the Altima 3.5 come to market? Also, is the VQ 3 that much different? Besides physical packaging, what's the hurdle then? Again, assuming (yes I know what happens when I do this!) the programming part is similar to others. If I am over simplifying the process it's because I am a simpleton - you can chuckle, just no comments!