My new TILTON 8lb Flywheel
10-31-2003, 03:50 PM
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Originally posted by KONVERTER
Here is a link to the exact set up in his car... Its going in mine hopefully next week now...
$983.00!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Most gains per dollar i think... or effective...
Here is a link to the exact set up in his car... Its going in mine hopefully next week now...
$983.00!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Most gains per dollar i think... or effective...
Wait this complete setup is only 983???? clutch and flywheel???
-non
10-31-2003, 07:23 PM
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Im thinking, Im going to get used to the clutch... Even the clutch in the stock Z needed getting used to for me from my past cars...
I wonder if you can use different clutch plates?
I wonder if you can use different clutch plates?
10-31-2003, 07:33 PM
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Originally posted by g356gear
Does the Tilton set-up have the same "grinding sand" sound that the guys have reported with the JWT flywheel?
Does the Tilton set-up have the same "grinding sand" sound that the guys have reported with the JWT flywheel?
11-04-2003, 08:49 PM
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Originally posted by Jeff@Performance
Haven't heard anything on the JWT, I'm sure there must be a number floating around somewhere. The number Tilton gave us was taking on testing done with our race car.
Haven't heard anything on the JWT, I'm sure there must be a number floating around somewhere. The number Tilton gave us was taking on testing done with our race car.
nissan performance magazine 7.5rwhp on the JWT flywheel here is the site
http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/october03/350z_fly/
11-05-2003, 07:27 AM
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Lighter flywheels, etc., are excellent upgrades, though this particular one is marginal for everyday use. But noone has mentioned the coolest aesthetic associated with this mod: the engine shut off NOW! Very race -- very cool.
11-05-2003, 07:51 AM
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This was givin to us here at Performance Nissan from TILTON's Managing Engineer Michael O'Neil. It is explaining the Mass Moment Of Inertia Difference.
---------------------------------------------
The MOI Difference
The flywheel by literal definition is an energy storage device. It takes energy to spin the flywheel and clutch up to speed. If it is heavier or larger in diameter it takes even more energy to spin up to speed. This energy comes from the engine in the form of horsepower. Every horsepower that it uses to rotationally accelerate the flywheel and clutch assembly is a horsepower that does not make its way to the rear wheels to accelerate the car when on the throttle.
The rotating energy in the flywheel and clutch does not disappear. As we said before the flywheel is an energy storage device. It releases the stored energy when you are on the breaks. Just when you are trying to slow the car down that energy is pumped back into the drivetrain trying to push the car forward. Therefore, you have to work the breaks a little harder. Reducing the MOI (mass moment of inertia) of the flywheel and the clutch that rotates with it can increase the car's acceleration and aid in braking.
Determining the MOI of a part takes a special measuring device that is not found in the average race shop. Weight is a factor in determining the MOI. But, how far the weight is located from the axis of rotation is even more important and often overlooked. The MOI rating, usually measured in lb-in^2, is a figure that accounts for the weight and the location of that weight. When comparing two different components the one that has the lower MOI is the one that robs the least amount of horsepower during acceleration. So, when comparing two different parts one should ask what the MOI is, not the weight.
Doubling the weight of an object without changing how far the weight (technically mass) is from the axis of rotation doubles the MOI, which follows common sense. Doubling how far the weight is from the axis of rotation quadruples the MOI, which is not as intuitive and demands a closer look. Since it is twice as far out it must be bought up to twice the linear speed to reach the same RPM. To do that in the same amount of time requires twice (2) the linear acceleration. And, being twice as far away from the axis of rotation we lose half of our leverage and it takes twice (2) as much torque to reach even the same linear acceleration. Accounting for needing twice the acceleration and twice the torque we see that 2 x 2 = 4 times the horsepower robbing effect or MOI. Likewise, moving the weight to three times as far from the axis of rotation multiplies the MOI nine times!
How large of an effect the diameter has is shown by the fact that the MOI of a 168 tooth Chevrolet flexplate is more than that of a good small block Chevrolet racing crankshaft. Yet, look at the difference in weight!
It is the combined MOI of the clutch and flywheel together that matters. When comparing look at the whole package. Looking at the clutch alone does not reveal the entire situation. And, remember that diamater has a much larger effect than weight.
Work by Tilton Engineering, Inc. to reduce the MOI on the Dodge Viper clutch and flywheel assembly allows an increase of 30 horsepower at the rear wheels without a single internal modification or additional stresses on the engine. This is how you find reliable horsepower.
Michael O'Neil
Managing Engineer
Tilton Engineering, Inc.
---------------------------------------------
The MOI Difference
The flywheel by literal definition is an energy storage device. It takes energy to spin the flywheel and clutch up to speed. If it is heavier or larger in diameter it takes even more energy to spin up to speed. This energy comes from the engine in the form of horsepower. Every horsepower that it uses to rotationally accelerate the flywheel and clutch assembly is a horsepower that does not make its way to the rear wheels to accelerate the car when on the throttle.
The rotating energy in the flywheel and clutch does not disappear. As we said before the flywheel is an energy storage device. It releases the stored energy when you are on the breaks. Just when you are trying to slow the car down that energy is pumped back into the drivetrain trying to push the car forward. Therefore, you have to work the breaks a little harder. Reducing the MOI (mass moment of inertia) of the flywheel and the clutch that rotates with it can increase the car's acceleration and aid in braking.
Determining the MOI of a part takes a special measuring device that is not found in the average race shop. Weight is a factor in determining the MOI. But, how far the weight is located from the axis of rotation is even more important and often overlooked. The MOI rating, usually measured in lb-in^2, is a figure that accounts for the weight and the location of that weight. When comparing two different components the one that has the lower MOI is the one that robs the least amount of horsepower during acceleration. So, when comparing two different parts one should ask what the MOI is, not the weight.
Doubling the weight of an object without changing how far the weight (technically mass) is from the axis of rotation doubles the MOI, which follows common sense. Doubling how far the weight is from the axis of rotation quadruples the MOI, which is not as intuitive and demands a closer look. Since it is twice as far out it must be bought up to twice the linear speed to reach the same RPM. To do that in the same amount of time requires twice (2) the linear acceleration. And, being twice as far away from the axis of rotation we lose half of our leverage and it takes twice (2) as much torque to reach even the same linear acceleration. Accounting for needing twice the acceleration and twice the torque we see that 2 x 2 = 4 times the horsepower robbing effect or MOI. Likewise, moving the weight to three times as far from the axis of rotation multiplies the MOI nine times!
How large of an effect the diameter has is shown by the fact that the MOI of a 168 tooth Chevrolet flexplate is more than that of a good small block Chevrolet racing crankshaft. Yet, look at the difference in weight!
It is the combined MOI of the clutch and flywheel together that matters. When comparing look at the whole package. Looking at the clutch alone does not reveal the entire situation. And, remember that diamater has a much larger effect than weight.
Work by Tilton Engineering, Inc. to reduce the MOI on the Dodge Viper clutch and flywheel assembly allows an increase of 30 horsepower at the rear wheels without a single internal modification or additional stresses on the engine. This is how you find reliable horsepower.
Michael O'Neil
Managing Engineer
Tilton Engineering, Inc.
11-05-2003, 07:52 AM
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Originally posted by Lateapex
Lighter flywheels, etc., are excellent upgrades, though this particular one is marginal for everyday use. But noone has mentioned the coolest aesthetic associated with this mod: the engine shut off NOW! Very race -- very cool.
Lighter flywheels, etc., are excellent upgrades, though this particular one is marginal for everyday use. But noone has mentioned the coolest aesthetic associated with this mod: the engine shut off NOW! Very race -- very cool.
11-05-2003, 09:35 AM
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Originally posted by hypersonicaz
Will the tendency to stall with this (and even heavier) flywheels affect autos any differently?
Will the tendency to stall with this (and even heavier) flywheels affect autos any differently?
auto's as in automatic tranny cars? AT's dont have flywheels.
with a light weight clutch like the Tilton. taking your foot off the gas and leaving it in gear the car slows its self down very quickly without even using the brakes. engine braking. with a heavier clutch it takes more time for the inirtia to leave the flywheel and slow the car down.
with a lighter flywheel you have to be quicker on the clutch and with your gas pedal. it responds MUCH quicker
11-05-2003, 10:19 AM
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Originally posted by hypersonicaz
Thanks for the clarification; I was never clear on the matter.
Thanks for the clarification; I was never clear on the matter.
Its not to rare for someone to order a flywheel and then go to get it installed and the tech saying... umm.. you have an auto matic car...
its ok though
11-05-2003, 10:25 AM
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I do not own a 350 but i do have a Ford probe, i went fomr the stock 24 Lb flywheel to a 9Lb unorthodox and all the talk of driveability issues sounds like bunk to me, it took me roughly 1 week beofre i forgot it was there. It is NOT that painful on the PROBE and I would think that with far more low end torque the 350 would not be hurt that much.
11-05-2003, 10:35 AM
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Originally posted by Ben Davis
I do not own a 350 but i do have a Ford probe, i went fomr the stock 24 Lb flywheel to a 9Lb unorthodox and all the talk of driveability issues sounds like bunk to me, it took me roughly 1 week beofre i forgot it was there. It is NOT that painful on the PROBE and I would think that with far more low end torque the 350 would not be hurt that much.
I do not own a 350 but i do have a Ford probe, i went fomr the stock 24 Lb flywheel to a 9Lb unorthodox and all the talk of driveability issues sounds like bunk to me, it took me roughly 1 week beofre i forgot it was there. It is NOT that painful on the PROBE and I would think that with far more low end torque the 350 would not be hurt that much.
The Rally Clutch we offer with the Tilton FLywheel kit is a Toggle Clutch. You cant pull it. its either ON or OFF...
Thats where the driveablitiy issue is.
