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Had a great full day of running! This is my son's best run of the the day! He is starting to get into the "game" in terms of lap times for like cars. A LOT to learn yet, but having a blast! You will hear me telling the driver at the beginning about the previous run where he went at it way too hard and got the car sideways pretty good and also had to hit the brakes hard on another turn to get it recovered. I will post that video in a second it was pretty funny. Smoked a cone for sure. LOL. But, here he is having a great run!
And Michael's worst run of the day. He came up fast on the start cone and that was a sign of things to come... You will see two or three turns in he comes in hot and has to lay on the brakes to not plough into some cones, later a spin and nice recovery and then he got to rushed after and smoked a cone. LOL. His next run(previous post) he was more controlled and ran his best time of the day! The Brembo's were awesome! Way more positive braking and feel. The bummer is, because he only has his learners permit(15), he can only drive with a parent, so I can't get someone who knows what they are doing to sit in with him and give him some tips. Still, lucky he can get out there and run out there at all!
He also though, got to ride in a 650hp 80's mustang with a guy who had more racing stickers on his helmet than I have every seen. LOL Slick tires all around and all business inside. Came back with a huge grin on his face.
Great job with your kid, Jim. I think for 15 he did pretty damm good! How'd your underwear hold up? kidding...
No kidding! You are thinking as the Dad, does he got this under control? LOL. He has shown that he can get it back under control if he losses it and nothing to hit out there except the cones. It was a practice day, so they did give you your times, but did not record anything. The nice thing is they limited it to 40 cars so you can get a LOT of driving in. Today, is the "race" day and three or four times the number of cars will show up.
We both agreed after a certain number of runs your concentration starts to drop. I think that got us way before any physical part. Probably also due to the learning curve as we are new to it and I was struggling a bit early on "seeing" the course with all the cones. It was our first time to run a parking lot as the last race was on a track. Lost count how many times we ran, but it was a lot.
Last edited by Jim Stephens; 03-08-2020 at 08:54 AM.
When I started the car to drive it home after racing I got a service engine soon light. Pictures below. I cleared the code and took it for a ride and the light did not come on. I still have one code though, car is running fine.
Any chance the motor was being starved of fuel? We were down to about 1/4 tank and running hard. I did feel a slight loss of power for just a moment while taking a hard turn. Thought it might the TCM kicking in.
Fill it up, and check again after resetting the codes. Try to run the car with at least half a tank. I always run with a full tank. In the Corvette, half a tank would disappear really fast with 2 drivers.
The wife and I ran today as well.
It's posted in the Autocross and Road Race Section.
Know that dropping fuel levels lighten the car but would try to keep the fuel up to prevent the starvation our z's are known for. Extra weight over the drive tires can help with rear traction as well. Might not hurt to double check vacuum lines since you were in the top of the engine not long ago.
So, after some back and forth with a teenager, I got my hands on some Track Tires V1 Rays. Looking for some tires for them.
What do you think about 245/40-R18-F, 265/40-R18-R
What do you think about the size? Reasonable for these rims or should I just stick with OEM width??
Check out the tires, I currently have on... a mix. Those Patriot tires are 2 years old and lots of tread. One is a Kumo that is 16 years old. Can't remember the other one. Maybe I can sell them off to someone who drifts? Is it worth messing with? I could take them to a local drifting event and sell them?
Last edited by Jim Stephens; 03-09-2020 at 06:16 AM.
Hunting for tires some more today. It seems like 235 or 245 on the front maybe and 255 or 265 on the rear. Just a bit more than OEM.
I was looking at the current tires that I have on the back I am running a 9.5 inch rim with 275's on them. I can't imagine running that size tire on an 8.5 inch Track V1 rim, but I see people are doing it and it is working for them?
I was going to go cheap, but as usual, I am now looking hard at the bridgestone RE-71r, because, well, I don't want to be saying should have bought the better tire. LOL. Thinking 40's on the height?
Last edited by Jim Stephens; 03-10-2020 at 05:02 AM.
I think a 245 40 front and a 255 40 rear would be a good place to start.
With regards to tire choice, a good tire can mask poor driving. In the videos it looks like there is still some learning to be done and a 200tw tire may mask some of those bad habits. It may be a good idea to consider a 300tw level tire for this season to continue learning and developing y'alls skills. Use the money you save on a starting line school or evo school. Then next season jump to the re71r or competitor tire.
I think a 245 40 front and a 255 40 rear would be a good place to start.
With regards to tire choice, a good tire can mask poor driving. In the videos it looks like there is still some learning to be done and a 200tw tire may mask some of those bad habits. It may be a good idea to consider a 300tw level tire for this season to continue learning and developing y'alls skills. Use the money you save on a starting line school or evo school. Then next season jump to the re71r or competitor tire.
Jim,
GreyZ is giving some damn good advice. Look at the Federal SS595 - NOT the 595-RS RR. You can get them really cheap on Flea Bay.
Learn to drive the car FIRST, then step up to better rubber. Seat time is the MOST IMPORTANT thing to get.
The MOST IMPORTANT MOD for a car is the DRIVER MOD!!!
How to handle oversteer/understeer comes with experience, the more the better!!
Guys, I somewhat get the logic on the tires, but still pondering it. I agree the driver is the most important Mod, but why not have the best tool for the job? A valid argument is the money is wasted on a super great tire with a lousy driver certainly has some merit. I will take a look at it some more. Thanks for the feedback.
Guys, I somewhat get the logic on the tires, but still pondering it. I agree the driver is the most important Mod, but why not have the best tool for the job? A valid argument is the money is wasted on a super great tire with a lousy driver certainly has some merit. I will take a look at it some more. Thanks for the feedback.
If you can learn to control a car with bad tires (understeer/oversteer) CONSISTENTLY and you can be competitive with them, then you should step up to race rubber.
Race rubber can and will, cover up a multitude of mistakes that rookie/novice driver's will make.
Let's say you have a sharp 90 turn box, on normal rubber, you have to brake earlier, modulate brake pressure, set the nose for turn in, turn in and then power out of the corner. You COULD trail brake if necessary, but all of the above teaches a novice/rookie to become SMOOTH. Race rubber can inhibit that learning by covering up those mistakes from braking way too late, turning in to sharply and getting on the power too quickly.
Smooth is fast. Doesn't matter if you learn that at Bondurant/Driver's Edge/Barber wherever.
I understand the thinking getting the right tool for the job. However, at this time in your son's autocross experience, race rubber is NOT the right tool.
Using the in car camera (I am still trying to find our Go Pro) will highlight mistakes made, and can be used as a great teaching tool. Watching other people autocross/HPDE in car video (both good and bad) can teach what to do, and what not to do.
I am fairly well experienced at Autocross, been doing it off and on since I was 16 (I am 51 - damn I'm old) and since this is a NEW TO ME CAR, I chose to go with street rubber first, then go to better tires after I have finished all the mods and learned the car's behavior in autocross.
Well, good news, I am older. 55. LOL. So, compelling reasoning for sure. So, what is the issue with the 595-RS RR tire? Is it the same argument even though it is cheaper than the RE71r? I thought that tire might represent the compromise between what you are suggesting and the higher end tire? I am ok with its noise level etc. as this is going to be a set tires only put on for track day. The thing that concerns me a bit are some reviews on the Federal SS595 state while they like the tire, it has a fair amount of sidewall flex. I can feel that flex on my Michellin's that I have on the 19" rims and 35 inch sides and it bothers me a bit already, so figured the 595-RS RR tire might be a good compromise for me.
Hey man, tire selection is as personal as the shoes you prefer. What 1 person finds amazing you might not care for. That's where reviews come in, to average things out. Check out TireRack.com and careful of my Lawn.
Hey man, tire selection is as personal as the shoes you prefer. What 1 person finds amazing you might not care for. That's where reviews come in, to average things out. Check out TireRack.com and careful of my Lawn.
Well, good news, I am older. 55. LOL. So, compelling reasoning for sure. So, what is the issue with the 595-RS RR tire? Is it the same argument even though it is cheaper than the RE71r? I thought that tire might represent the compromise between what you are suggesting and the higher end tire? I am ok with its noise level etc. as this is going to be a set tires only put on for track day. The thing that concerns me a bit are some reviews on the Federal SS595 state while they like the tire, it has a fair amount of sidewall flex. I can feel that flex on my Michellin's that I have on the 19" rims and 35 inch sides and it bothers me a bit already, so figured the 595-RS RR tire might be a good compromise for me.
Because it is also more race oriented than street oriented tire.
The thing to do, especially in autocross is monitor the amount of rollover on the sidewall. You can do this by using white shoe polish in a triangle pattern on the sidewall of the tire where it meets the tread. Using stock tire pressures, adjust up or down until you have no rollover, the shoe polish on the sidewall does not rub off and there is even treadwear on the tire, up to the sidewall as best as you can get. Two driver cars are usually easier, as the first driver is the one who is setting up the car for the second driver.
You can also use a tire pyrometer to measure the tire temperature and try to keep them optimal (using the guide from the tire manufacturer, as they all list slightly different optimal temps, even though they should be within a few degrees of each other).
As was stated previously, some people love the BFG Rival-S, others might like the RE-71R or the 595 RS-RR. To each their own.
I am using Federal 595's until I feel that the wife and I have learned the car well enough (and after I have changed out the shocks, adjusted the front swaybar and replace the endlinks with SPL) to warrant replacing the tires with something more race (but F Street legal) oriented.
We've both been autocrossing for years, so we have some experience. BUT Stitch is all new to us. I am used to using my right foot to rotate the car (throttle induced oversteer) faster. Stitch is somewhere between power and momentum driving. Pure momentum driving in autocross is a Miata.
03-08-2020, 06:05 AM
kidding...
