kit looks great! sorry for topic shift but is that the trial front lip on that CS z? beautiful!!

-justin

 

sorry to dissappoint you, but that intercooler design wasn't invented by APS. SEVERAL twin turbo V motors utilize an intercooler design like that. it's nothing special, and definitely nothing new.

this is a great looking kit. i'd love to hear some more specific specs on the turbos if possible. it looks like a GREAT alternative to the GReddy and APS kits. the tubular manifolds, large diameter piping, real tubular downpipes, and external wastegates are extremely promising and are components of EVERY HIGH horsepower turbo setup.

but, slightly off topic, why on earth does everyone hear think the APS kit is gold?? do they really do that great a job of marketing that has everyone up thier behinds?

 

but, slightly off topic, why on earth does everyone hear think the APS kit is gold?? do they really do that great a job of marketing that has everyone up thier behinds? [/B][/QUOTE]

I think the APS's quaility is as good as any and better than many. Actually I lied.... I believe APS has the best TT system out there thus far for the 350z. Sure APS does and a great job at marketing and that is smart on their part. In all that marketing they done I also sensed that Peter and his company had a great deal of pride in what they had developed. So maybe it is more than just the dollars with these Aussies from down under and their turbo business.
Many people on this forum and other forums appreciate that Peter (APS) has been a great source of F.I. knowlege, helping out F.I. people regarless if they have Greddy, Stillen or whoever's F.I. product on their car. So I believe it goes past marketing and into customer service. I don't know about you.... but my experience with customer service is that too often it sucks azz and many businesses have forgotten it all together. It seems that once they are turning a profit many a company could care less.
So do people have their nose up APS's azz you ask? I think is simply a matter of credit where credit is due. Time will continue to tell the story of how good APS quality is.

 

Yeah though with the APS TT system you do get the very lastest and greatest Dual ball Bearing Garrett water cooled turbos...............much improved spool and turbo durability at high power than older technology turbos with sleeve bearings.

If APS was prepared to compromise on performance and turbo durability (and we won't ) and use 30 year old turbo technology, the MSRP of the APS TT system would be reduced from $7500 to approx $6000.

Thanks

Peter

 

Obviously people have no idea the labor costs involved in actually manufacturing a turbo kit.

S/C's are less expensive for a reason - there is far less involved

 

when I have offers from tuners in new york and in boston to build me a custom twin or single turbo for my car with tuning and everything included for under 5 grand and new everything... I believe there must be something wrong.... it has to be more expensive to do a one off kit.

 

Its no different with anything else though. When you buy a computer, its cheaper to buy all the pieces and put it together yourself rather than have a company do it for you. Building a PC with all the top components costs you like $2k, whereas having a company do it for you can cost $4k+.

 

ahhh now secret angent is on the boards, no he is too smart. I do think the SSR design can be made for big pwer like 1k hp. The internal wastegate turbos do provide greater spool up but external wasegate are more suitable for large horsepower.

 

Not sure why you believe the wastegate design has any influence over the turbos spool up performance (wastegates are closed during this phase) and external wastegates don't neccessarily produce any higher power potential than an integral wastegate design.

Thanks

Peter

 

thought this thread was about SSR/SFR turbo system?

 

it is because the SSR/SFR turbo system uses external wastegates. however they can be route back in if you like.

 

Hehe

 

Seems very similar to the JoTec setup.

 

Keeping the wastegate out of the turbine housing can help with spool, but anymore the sizing and bearing tech is more crucial. I'd say it would be very difficult to build a set of internally gated turbos (mounted on the sides of the motor) with the same power potential as what is possible with something like the the SFR/SSR kit wherein the turbo and gates can be sized up without as much concern for fitment since they move them down and rearward. <shrug>
The SFR kit can be built with many different options for turbos; including the GT BB stuff like APS has.

 

Well look at what you get with the kit compared to other kits, you don't get life time warranties with any other kit out there (ours you do) and supercharger systems are very basic, no manifolds, minimal fuel upgrades, and optional intercoolers.

 

I believe that is a very debatable comment, I've utilised both integral wastegates and remote watsegates on identical engines and the difference in turbo spool/engine response is not measurable to the human butt dyno


Agreed, I believe the rotating group (comp and turbine wheel sizing) and the turbine housing matching to be far more crucial.


It's the turbochargers (amount of mass air flow combusted efficently) which produces the power not the wastegate or wategate type.

Thanks

Peter

 

True, but my point is, you can get a bigger turbo down there than on the side of the motor since it's already close (fitment wise) with the kits out there (PE, APS, GReddy). A bigger external gate will let you keep smaller turbos from choking the motor at higher rpms.
I'm sure we are in agreement on these things. I guess since I'm not a direct vendor for either, I can play devil's advocate so my customers know precisely what the advantages and disadvantages are of each.
BTW, since you're on the thread right now, do you think there will be any negative long term effects of running serial water cooling on your turbo kit (versus parallel)? Say, in an endurance situation?

Mark

 

speaking of the water cooling turbos peter, is a turbo timer needed with the APS TT kit?

 

No, unless you just like gadgets.

 

Yes it's possible to physically package larger Garrett dual ball bearing turbos in the APS TT system (up to 1100 Horsepower) there's sufficient space to do so



Bigger gates where required provide additional control of boost presure in some circumstances, they are not be all end all in terms of wastegate operation.

Mark I think it's more prudent and wiser to conduct the actual engineering work on the wastegate designs and operation rather than making a generic comment, what may prove to be true in one application may not prove to be true in another application

In short no. Water cooling the turbos bearing housing is the Ultimate solution for all high performance Gasoline turbochargers (this is the exact reason why all Garrett GT series turbos utilise water cooled bearing housings) this eliminates the need to idle down the turbochargers as the engine coolant continues to thermo syphon via the turbochargers after engine shut down, it's all good.

Thanks

Peter