Why do it if the engine's going to blow?
Originally Posted by Noah@AAM
that's what i am saying...then these people blow something up and blame the manufacturer...then people say "this kit" or "so and so's twin turbo" blows motors....this all goes back to my first point that motors will last longer if placed in compitent hands....i personally know of a friend back home who blew his motor from this....i am not knocking the kit or I wouldn't sell as many of them as I do....but people want to know what they can do to make sure their motor doesn't blow...and the most important thing(i was a 350Z owner modding my car well before I ever worked in a shop) is get it installed properly....i have had customers from all over bring in cars that had kits installed by places claiming "we can do turbos" elsewhere and they messed things up....i'm not knocking a kit or any shops....just stating an obvious point.....besides freak stuff....weak motors, bad ring...i think competance in an installer adds to longevity.....
Not arguing anything in this post. My point plain and simple is:
Please stop mis-informing people by claiming instructions are written incorrectly. You have now admitted twice they are written correctly. Myself and numerous people here have verified they are correct and are able to be understood. I am not arguing your other points here about shops, experience, blah, blah. You incorrectly posted and have incorrectly informed other people the instructions are wrong. They are not, you have now stated that fact twice. I'm simply asking you to stop mis-informing people.
Originally Posted by Noah@AAM
that's what i am saying...then these people blow something up and blame the manufacturer...then people say "this kit" or "so and so's twin turbo" blows motors....this all goes back to my first point that motors will last longer if placed in compitent hands....i personally know of a friend back home who blew his motor from this....i am not knocking the kit or I wouldn't sell as many of them as I do....but people want to know what they can do to make sure their motor doesn't blow...and the most important thing(i was a 350Z owner modding my car well before I ever worked in a shop) is get it installed properly....i have had customers from all over bring in cars that had kits installed by places claiming "we can do turbos" elsewhere and they messed things up....i'm not knocking a kit or any shops....just stating an obvious point.....besides freak stuff....weak motors, bad ring...i think competance in an installer adds to longevity.....
i think i already stated it when i said this "....all FI is a gamble....life is a gamble....who's to say with your perfectly running FI set-up a truck blows thru an intersection....some of us take gambles....some of us don't....FI is like everyother decision....like a house....if you cannot afford the renevations don't buy the house...or deal with replacing the roof when it leaks.....i'd say it's worth the risk....FI is a definate boner inducer....."
All i know is people have misinterpreted instructions and made mistakes....and my job to my customers is to inform them that mistake has been made and they don't do it....
All i know is people have misinterpreted instructions and made mistakes....and my job to my customers is to inform them that mistake has been made and they don't do it....
Originally Posted by Noah@AAM
All i know is people have misinterpreted instructions and made mistakes....and my job to my customers is to inform them that mistake has been made and they don't do it....
Just for reference here is a cut and paste from the said instructions:
85. Install (1) 1/8” NPT x 5/32” hose fitting into the bottom port of the wastegate, and (1) 1/8” NPT x 5/32” hose
fitting into the top port of the blow-off valve, pointed out in FIGURE 78.
86. Cut approx. 2.5 feet of 5/32” vacuum hose (P/N 30542-BK), and route the hose from the upper intake plenum
(port shown in FIGURE 79) to the blow-off valve fitting. Cut approx. 2.5 feet of the same hose, and route it
from the fitting on the wastegate to the fitting on the compressor housing (installed in step# 60). Loosely zip
tie the hose as desired. NOTE: The operation of these turbocharger control devices rely on these hoses for
pneumatic signals, so do NOT pinch or crimp the hose in any way.
Those statements are 100% accurate.
Last edited by MIAPLAYA; Jun 21, 2006 at 09:58 AM.
Originally Posted by Noah@AAM
i think i already stated it when i said this "....all FI is a gamble....life is a gamble....who's to say with your perfectly running FI set-up a truck blows thru an intersection....some of us take gambles....some of us don't....FI is like everyother decision....like a house....if you cannot afford the renevations don't buy the house...or deal with replacing the roof when it leaks.....i'd say it's worth the risk....FI is a definate boner inducer....."
All i know is people have misinterpreted instructions and made mistakes....and my job to my customers is to inform them that mistake has been made and they don't do it....
All i know is people have misinterpreted instructions and made mistakes....and my job to my customers is to inform them that mistake has been made and they don't do it....
miaplaya when are you gonna come out the closet and admit who you work for? or they should start paying you! for real! ne-ways offtopic thread hijack any updates on the 06 civic si kit?
lol
lol
that would be awsome if we can purchase a warrenty package for a turbo install much like a extended warrenty for a car. However, many things have to be considered, yes they can warrenty the turbo install but what if this individual choose to push and abuse the motor after the install causes it to blow only because this person knows that it will be replaced since its under warrenty? I know my friend blew his e46 M3 motor due to excessive abuse and after some research form the mechanics they concluded that they will not offer a motor replacement because of obvious abuse of the motor from the parts they looked at. While that is said, i think it will be hard to investigate an abused blwoned FIed motor to a regular blown FIed motor.
i believe its been determined that hes an uncover agent for TN
Originally Posted by paranormal
miaplaya when are you gonna come out the closet and admit who you work for? or they should start paying you! for real! ne-ways offtopic thread hijack any updates on the 06 civic si kit? lol
lol
Warranty on a stock block Z? Keep dreaming that wouldnt be smart for any business. Like playing roulette with a 1/2 loaded gun and guaranteeing you'll be ok after you pull the trigger
actually not trying to be a troll but i believe reading a few thread back in the days when i was looking for agood Z tuner shop in my area, Scott Performance offers some warrenty to their install. To what degree i dont know. However im going back to his shop hopefully this weekend for some installs and tune. I'll ask about it for you guys and perhaps he can shine some light in the whole warrenty thang.
I really want to go FI, i can buy a TN or SC kit but i dont think i can afford to rebuild a blown motor. Well i can but it would put me in what i think major credit card debt. Sigh..... i envy you guys.
I really want to go FI, i can buy a TN or SC kit but i dont think i can afford to rebuild a blown motor. Well i can but it would put me in what i think major credit card debt. Sigh..... i envy you guys.
Originally Posted by paranormal
miaplaya when are you gonna come out the closet and admit who you work for? or they should start paying you! for real! ne-ways offtopic thread hijack any updates on the 06 civic si kit? lol
lol The kit is being looked at heavily. Turbocharger selection is going to change to be more accomodating though...
Registered User
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 402
Likes: 0
From: Sydney, Australia
<rant>
1 point:
As the scene matures people will find out what is reliable FI, and what isnt. I personally think everyone is pushing WAYY too much power through there stock motors. Whos at fault? The kit manufactures giving people a false sense of security using massive turbos that flow WAYY too much.
Too the person above who blew his APS TT kit --> you were pushing 440whp. Why would an experienced tuner push that much through a stock motor *sigh* Tuning is all about recognising the limits and working within.
I know u guys hate parallels but in the honda scene (d-series) the line is very clear these days. anything upto 200whp on a stock motor is consider fine. This could mean 12psi from a small t25, or 7psi from a GT30. 200-215whp is a grey area were anything can happen. 215whp+ means u are living life on the edge. That extra 20whp means ALOT. People are throwing rods. This means components are being OVERPOWERED. If they were cracking ringlands or blowing headgaskets (like alot of the built motor guys), this means incorrect tuning. U cannot avoid throwing a rod with tuning, no matter how hard u try.
People have gotta get over the fact that without 400whp, FI cannot be fun. Do you know the reason why vortech users hardly ever blow a motor? Because they produce so little power, so late. They are also boost controlled by a pully. This means no boost spikes, ever (i garentee everyone has spiked during a dyno tune)! Nothing to weaken components because the kit is so predictable and simple to tune.
Oh and building a motor means nothing because people get greddy. Put a new set of pistons and rods in a stock motor and u can run 400whp all day, everyday and abuse it as much as u want. On the correct tuning it would be 100% reliable. But people who build motors want more. They want 500whp-800whp. This means u are stessing other components now way outside there service limits. Such as the sleeves. Such as the head bolts. Such as the oiling and cooling systems, fuel systems, and error systems. Tuning must be accurate because there is alot less margin of error when pushing the engine that hard.
</rant>
2 point
MIAPLAYER: No matter how much u agrue about the TN install instructions, the fact that 1,2,3 people have gotten the instructions wrong MEANS that the instructions are worded ambigiously. Right or wrong, it doesnt matter. I suggest TN revise them then u wont need to defend yourself constantly.
1 point:
As the scene matures people will find out what is reliable FI, and what isnt. I personally think everyone is pushing WAYY too much power through there stock motors. Whos at fault? The kit manufactures giving people a false sense of security using massive turbos that flow WAYY too much.
Too the person above who blew his APS TT kit --> you were pushing 440whp. Why would an experienced tuner push that much through a stock motor *sigh* Tuning is all about recognising the limits and working within.
I know u guys hate parallels but in the honda scene (d-series) the line is very clear these days. anything upto 200whp on a stock motor is consider fine. This could mean 12psi from a small t25, or 7psi from a GT30. 200-215whp is a grey area were anything can happen. 215whp+ means u are living life on the edge. That extra 20whp means ALOT. People are throwing rods. This means components are being OVERPOWERED. If they were cracking ringlands or blowing headgaskets (like alot of the built motor guys), this means incorrect tuning. U cannot avoid throwing a rod with tuning, no matter how hard u try.
People have gotta get over the fact that without 400whp, FI cannot be fun. Do you know the reason why vortech users hardly ever blow a motor? Because they produce so little power, so late. They are also boost controlled by a pully. This means no boost spikes, ever (i garentee everyone has spiked during a dyno tune)! Nothing to weaken components because the kit is so predictable and simple to tune.
Oh and building a motor means nothing because people get greddy. Put a new set of pistons and rods in a stock motor and u can run 400whp all day, everyday and abuse it as much as u want. On the correct tuning it would be 100% reliable. But people who build motors want more. They want 500whp-800whp. This means u are stessing other components now way outside there service limits. Such as the sleeves. Such as the head bolts. Such as the oiling and cooling systems, fuel systems, and error systems. Tuning must be accurate because there is alot less margin of error when pushing the engine that hard.
</rant>
2 point
MIAPLAYER: No matter how much u agrue about the TN install instructions, the fact that 1,2,3 people have gotten the instructions wrong MEANS that the instructions are worded ambigiously. Right or wrong, it doesnt matter. I suggest TN revise them then u wont need to defend yourself constantly.
Originally Posted by Weqster
<rant>
1 point:
As the scene matures people will find out what is reliable FI, and what isnt. I personally think everyone is pushing WAYY too much power through there stock motors. Whos at fault? The kit manufactures giving people a false sense of security using massive turbos that flow WAYY too much.
Too the person above who blew his APS TT kit --> you were pushing 440whp. Why would an experienced tuner push that much through a stock motor *sigh* Tuning is all about recognising the limits and working within.
I know u guys hate parallels but in the honda scene (d-series) the line is very clear these days. anything upto 200whp on a stock motor is consider fine. This could mean 12psi from a small t25, or 7psi from a GT30. 200-215whp is a grey area were anything can happen. 215whp+ means u are living life on the edge. That extra 20whp means ALOT. People are throwing rods. This means components are being OVERPOWERED. If they were cracking ringlands or blowing headgaskets (like alot of the built motor guys), this means incorrect tuning. U cannot avoid throwing a rod with tuning, no matter how hard u try.
People have gotta get over the fact that without 400whp, FI cannot be fun. Do you know the reason why vortech users hardly ever blow a motor? Because they produce so little power, so late. They are also boost controlled by a pully. This means no boost spikes, ever (i garentee everyone has spiked during a dyno tune)! Nothing to weaken components because the kit is so predictable and simple to tune.
Oh and building a motor means nothing because people get greddy. Put a new set of pistons and rods in a stock motor and u can run 400whp all day, everyday and abuse it as much as u want. On the correct tuning it would be 100% reliable. But people who build motors want more. They want 500whp-800whp. This means u are stessing other components now way outside there service limits. Such as the sleeves. Such as the head bolts. Such as the oiling and cooling systems, fuel systems, and error systems. Tuning must be accurate because there is alot less margin of error when pushing the engine that hard.
</rant>
2 point
MIAPLAYER: No matter how much u agrue about the TN install instructions, the fact that 1,2,3 people have gotten the instructions wrong MEANS that the instructions are worded ambigiously. Right or wrong, it doesnt matter. I suggest TN revise them then u wont need to defend yourself constantly.
1 point:
As the scene matures people will find out what is reliable FI, and what isnt. I personally think everyone is pushing WAYY too much power through there stock motors. Whos at fault? The kit manufactures giving people a false sense of security using massive turbos that flow WAYY too much.
Too the person above who blew his APS TT kit --> you were pushing 440whp. Why would an experienced tuner push that much through a stock motor *sigh* Tuning is all about recognising the limits and working within.
I know u guys hate parallels but in the honda scene (d-series) the line is very clear these days. anything upto 200whp on a stock motor is consider fine. This could mean 12psi from a small t25, or 7psi from a GT30. 200-215whp is a grey area were anything can happen. 215whp+ means u are living life on the edge. That extra 20whp means ALOT. People are throwing rods. This means components are being OVERPOWERED. If they were cracking ringlands or blowing headgaskets (like alot of the built motor guys), this means incorrect tuning. U cannot avoid throwing a rod with tuning, no matter how hard u try.
People have gotta get over the fact that without 400whp, FI cannot be fun. Do you know the reason why vortech users hardly ever blow a motor? Because they produce so little power, so late. They are also boost controlled by a pully. This means no boost spikes, ever (i garentee everyone has spiked during a dyno tune)! Nothing to weaken components because the kit is so predictable and simple to tune.
Oh and building a motor means nothing because people get greddy. Put a new set of pistons and rods in a stock motor and u can run 400whp all day, everyday and abuse it as much as u want. On the correct tuning it would be 100% reliable. But people who build motors want more. They want 500whp-800whp. This means u are stessing other components now way outside there service limits. Such as the sleeves. Such as the head bolts. Such as the oiling and cooling systems, fuel systems, and error systems. Tuning must be accurate because there is alot less margin of error when pushing the engine that hard.
</rant>
2 point
MIAPLAYER: No matter how much u agrue about the TN install instructions, the fact that 1,2,3 people have gotten the instructions wrong MEANS that the instructions are worded ambigiously. Right or wrong, it doesnt matter. I suggest TN revise them then u wont need to defend yourself constantly.
Registered User
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
From: Studio City
this is sad... this thread is making me wanna get a different car. you guys keep saying you need to have enough money to replace the engine, but if it keeps blowing how often are you replacing the engine? isn't it like an cycle where you can't just replace it one, cause it will just blow again?
makes me wanna go back to a pushrod v8 in a light car. but then the stupid car is falling apart, while the engine lasts forever.
I think i'm just gonna wait for the next supra, or maybe evo X.
ther are no fast japanese cars right now
makes me wanna go back to a pushrod v8 in a light car. but then the stupid car is falling apart, while the engine lasts forever.
I think i'm just gonna wait for the next supra, or maybe evo X.
ther are no fast japanese cars right now
dont just jump in the ring with ali cuz you think you can box......... i say do a ****load of research and understand all the aspects of the turbo kit and know what the hell ur doing then to just jump straigt into f/i ........ and yeah go to someone reputable.... that has done installs before..... i know some amout of f/i just dont have the $$$$$ to do it..... plus my cousin is like a turbo freak so he helps out...... ( 91 3rd gen mr2) but damn i love F/I
Originally Posted by sq40
The Stillen Stg 2 Kit has a warranty if you are really worried about it.
However I can guarantee you that soon thereafter you will feel the need to get more power...it's an addiction
I would recomend saving a bit longer and get a basic short block as recommended earlier. You can still run the lower power and have room to move up for a while.
I'm still running strong on stock internals (475whp) but I also have a healthey amount set aside for when the time comes and I'm planing out right now exactly what I will get, hopefully I have a while to go on that.
Bottomline, FI kicks booty, it's the best decission I've ever made in regards to cars and I looooooooooooooooooooooove my monster Z
Do the research, save money and make sure you go to a great tuner shop for the install....do NOT save money on that because a bad tune can blow any engine no matter how weak or strong.
Good Luck
Originally Posted by Kam350z
I'm done with doing all the N/A bolt ons, and I'm pretty satisfied with the results. But, as you all predicted, I want to go F/I now for that extra boost.
I told my tuner (GT Motorsports in Rancho) that I'm planning on getting a Vortech with the 9lb pulley (goal of 380-400 rwhp), and he told me it would be attainable. But, with all the threads I've read about engine's blowing due to F/I, I've been having second thoughts. Alberto's engine blowing put me over the edge, and I'm considering not even doing F/I and stop modding my car ( I love modding the car, but not if its ultimately going to blow the engine).
I need some reassurance. With stock internals, Utec, A/F gauges, and a knock sensor that my tuner suggested, would my engine be safe with 380 rwhp? Would I have to be worried constantly if I push the car that something will malfunction?
I don't want to rebuild the engine. I don't have the money for that. I want 380-400 hp safely and without worry. Should I save up and get F/I, or is all this just a lost cause?
I told my tuner (GT Motorsports in Rancho) that I'm planning on getting a Vortech with the 9lb pulley (goal of 380-400 rwhp), and he told me it would be attainable. But, with all the threads I've read about engine's blowing due to F/I, I've been having second thoughts. Alberto's engine blowing put me over the edge, and I'm considering not even doing F/I and stop modding my car ( I love modding the car, but not if its ultimately going to blow the engine).
I need some reassurance. With stock internals, Utec, A/F gauges, and a knock sensor that my tuner suggested, would my engine be safe with 380 rwhp? Would I have to be worried constantly if I push the car that something will malfunction?
I don't want to rebuild the engine. I don't have the money for that. I want 380-400 hp safely and without worry. Should I save up and get F/I, or is all this just a lost cause?
TODD
Originally Posted by o snap its eric
that would be awsome if we can purchase a warrenty package for a turbo install much like a extended warrenty for a car. However, many things have to be considered, yes they can warrenty the turbo install but what if this individual choose to push and abuse the motor after the install causes it to blow only because this person knows that it will be replaced since its under warrenty? I know my friend blew his e46 M3 motor due to excessive abuse and after some research form the mechanics they concluded that they will not offer a motor replacement because of obvious abuse of the motor from the parts they looked at. While that is said, i think it will be hard to investigate an abused blwoned FIed motor to a regular blown FIed motor.
