shoulda came to texas...

 

To be up front, VRT has done work for me so I am not be entirely neutral. I don't know VRT's side but from reading your post I have a couple of questions.

I can't read the az350z link so maybe there are details there that answer some of my questions. It does not sound like the kit was new. If this is true, is that why you could not run the reflash? What's the background on the kit?

It isn't cool that you didn't get the mods you paid for when you picked it up, but you got a refund on that? Downtime sucks for all of us (believe me I know), no matter where you go I doubt many projects go exactly as planned.

 

Not sure who posted it, but you did not tell them that you were not happy with the 304 or 307 whatever it was at the dyno. Personally I have had a TON of work done by VRT, was some of it not perfect when I picked the car up, yes, but that will happen anywhere from time to time. I told them and they fixed it.

I know you are in AZ and that makes things more difficult, but I think this is something that could have been fixed easily and I know that if you told Michael the only way to get the car to him was for him to have someone come out a pick it up then he would have done it for sure.

There is no shop in the country that does not have some customer that is not happy. I truly believe that it is not how bad you mess up, but how you recover from it and I know that VRT will stand ebhind what they have done. I do not know all the specifics of either one of these problems, however I know Michael, Scott, Mark, and all the other guys there and they take their work very seriously. If they mess something up then they will fix it, but they certainly need to know that a customer is not happy to fix it.

 

BAck in the 90s, SFP was the only shop I knew of that could put together a 500+ cubic inch big block w/ a blower, back-halved, pro-streeter, and it couldn't even run 10s! ......they were good for a nitrous refill though!!

 

Ok, god I am getting tired of this. Both of these instances happened quite a bit ago. The T-netics kit in question was mine originally. I am not going to get into T-netics right now. To whoever said that it comes with a whatever spring to set it at 8-8.5 psi, thats true. That is what it is SUPOSED to have. When VRT first put a guage on this car to check the boost...it was reading 10psi. Most likely the same 10psi (minimum) that spun a rod bearing in MY car. To all those out there having nothing bu success with the T-netics kit. I envy you. I really wanted that kit. Anyways, back to these "skeletons" comming out. Both of these situations boil down to mechanical issues beyond the control of anyone at VRT. A worn out Tranny wasnt done in a day in a few passes of the dyno. VRT didnt manufacture the T-netix kit. Nor should they be expected to cary a proper wastegate spring for them. Common people. There is no way to please all the people all the time. Go back and actually look over the entire experience with VRT. Put yourself in their possition. Remember that they had several cars, all on a timeline just like yours. No throw in the mix that the kit your customer wanted installed has mechanical flaws inherent from the factory. Buisness sense tells you that this is clearly none of your fault. You can just as easily tell your customer about the bad news and find out what path they want to travel from there. Now the 1 week timeline has extended to at least 2-3 weeks. Now you have an unhappy customer. One who is going to run home and jump onto the net and start posting everything that happened to them in some sort of redemption attempt. Now this is where you will calim it has nothing to do with that but if it truely doesnt, why wait 3 months to come out and start in with it? I am honestly sick and tired of people jumping on the "oh, VRT didnt give me the right airfreshioner" or whatever because people want to come out and embelish their "bad experience". If you have a problem with work done...you bring it up. You say yourself their customer service was top notch. Obviously they wanted you to be happy. Your failure to bring up what you truely wanted was your fault...not theirs.


Now, if this thread hasnt been locked yet, I am ready for everyone who wants to come on and start flaming about how I am biased and how I am only defending my friends. To hell with that. I would stand up and defend any buisness taking this kind of heat. Look at VRT's record of service. They have quite a large number of built cars with owners who can speak nothing but praises. They may not post on the boards. They dont have to. But for a company that relies entirely on word of mouth, your little posts about how horrible it was for you are detrimental to them. Think about what the hell you are doing damnit. Thats all I have left to say.

 

I totally agree with you.....the first post in this thread as I read through it seemed as though it was really not as bad as it was made out to be. I think that there are plenty of people that want to not believe what VRT is doing and they will latch onto anything they can get their hands on.

Bottom line:

VRT puts out a quality product and they stand behind what they do. The place to deal with issues is them first and then if nothing comes of it go somewhere else. There is no need to flame on VRT before trying to work it out with them. I am pretty confident that Michael and the rest of the VRT people will make something come together to get the product right.

 

To me they could have easily got the "proper wastegate spring" from Turbonetics for free (telephone number is right on the instructions).

I have been to many shops within the last couple of years and I know what it has been like. There are differences I have seen while visting many shops talking to the "techs" along with their other workers, and also meeting or talking to the cheerleaders (supporters) for great shops (no negative reps) the so-so shops (hear good things, hear bad things), and the bad shops (terrible reps).

So I am not trying to contribute to a flame war or whatever because of course I like the rest of us do not know the details.

But one thing that I cannot stand is agreement on something (like agreeing on parts to be installed and then to find out they are not)

I paid 1600 hundred for the kit to be installed with gauges, and 6 dyno runs... This did not include tuning since it was the re-flash, but I would have not agreed to paying more than this for the install along with at the time of doing a search this was a common area of what the cost should be. And the shop fudged it up, and they had a great reputation so I was very disapointed.

So I am really sorry to the starter of the thread for your troubles, cause man I have been there and I know what it feels like. To have what you thought a reputable shop quote you and do your work only to find that it wasn't what you agreed on or wanted while they try to give you b*ll answers and expect you to just take what they have to say and that is all.

I would have also not agreed to the split box, for that price other forms of EMS more widely used could have been had.

Also said the overboost problem had been resolved and I don't think your set-up is quite right.

Sadly it would seem you have joined the group of folks including myself that have to take the hard costly road to getting things right.

To bad you are not closer to Forged Performance (Sharif), because once again out of all the shops... He has gone above and beyond while also charging the most pratical/competitive prices then anyone else I have asked or dealt with.

I would contact Sharif@Forged though, I see many out of state'ers being there and I believe he may have access to a trailer.

Of course this would mean more paying on top of what you have paid so far, but I and many others will tell you he will get you right.

Also being in AZ, did you not consider Intense Motorsports (www.intensepower.com)?

 

Tempted, have you spoken with VRT to get this worked out? It seems to me that you just decided to be content with what they gave you. Sometimes things do not come out the way you thought they would, but you have to let the people doing the work know this.

For instance, I am doing a remodel on my house. My contractor installed my refrigerator and scratched the new Travertine floor. So I told him he needed to fix it and he proceeded to inform me that the refrigerator install was not in the contract, and "Not to look a gift horse in the mouth." Well needless to say I told him that he would fix the floor and I was not happy about it. You can't expect the work to be done exactly as you want it unless you tell them what does not suit your needs or wants.

 

To answer more questions and comments posted here we go.

The turbo kit was bought from Justin(sleepyz). He blew his motor after he overboosted when driving for about 300 yards. I bought the kit at a great price and I still stand by my purchase.

As for why I feel the way I do towards VRT. The reason I told them I was happy as they still had work to do to my car and I did not want any confrontation with Michael and VRT in general. My problem is that when it came time to figure out how we would get the other parts installed it was almost like I was just a burden to them. Once Michael had sent me the check to pay back the services that weren't performed he pretty much acted like it was all over. No offer to finish what VRT started and what I had paid for other then the advice to get a boost controller bump the boost up and I would be fine. How do I know where the timing is set at and that the decrease in timing would be enough after I bumped the boost up to keep me from not popping the engine.

Now all of you can go ahead and think I am hating on VRT. That is not the reason I am doing this. I had planned on making this post once everything had been worked out and settled with my car so here I am. As is I was hoping it would be a positive post to show that VRT wasn't just magic with the JWT kit but also with the other kits that are out on the market. I hold nothing against Michael as I would still hang out and BS with him to this very day. I just do not feel that I got what I paid for.

Now to all of you who reply READ THE WHOLE FIRST POST BEFORE POSTING. Notice I state Michaels customer service was great I am just not happy with how the car turned out and especially the response I got once all was said and done with getting the money for services not rendered back.

 

Like I said in the above post navy. There resolution to it all was for me to buy a boost controller bump up the boost to 8lbs and the car according to them would be done.

 

This is very true, though sometimes and saying this in general.

Trying to talk to some of these people at these "Performance" "Tuner" shops they don't listen to what you have to say and prefer you to just take what they say. In my experience the shop I used to install my Turbonetics kit that had a good reputation was so full of themselves that they thought they were above reading the provided instructions and using the provided hardware... Of course I did not find all of this out until after it was done... And when issues/problems came up they brushed me and my thoughts off (which came out I was right with everything) while expecting me to just take what they had to say and talking down to me because I was not as experienced or knowledgable as they thought of themselves

 

I can tell you from experience that VRT does not do this. When I gave them my car I knew about half of what I know now. But even still I told them that I wanted to use my exhaust from my last car(it was totalled) and they told me I should use a different one, but they put on the one I wanted.

They are very upfront and down to earth when it comes to dealing with customers. So, I do not think this is the case here, I think that Tempted just did not tell them there was an issue. Thats what it sounds like form everything he has said.

 

Well how about we take care of all of this...Tempted maybe it would be a good idea to call Michael about this issue

I spoke with him today, and if you don't have his number, pm me and I'll send it over.

A simple call can take care of all of this

 

Wow, european mechanics really suck huh? They can't even follow the instruction to put together a turbo kit? Shame... $hit~ I got several shops in my neighborhood that makes their own turbo kits... I feel bad for you for spending so much money shipping your cars all over the country... I got mine done a block away from my home...

 

Oh they can do it. Your average idiot can do it, that's no great accomplishement that the guys down the block could do it, hell i bet your neighbour could do it. But will it last as long as if it were done properly, by a guy that really knows what he's doing? Chances are, probably not.

I'm talking about tuning as well as install, by the way.

And its not European tuners, its Spanish tuners, because in case you haven't noticed, the brits and germans produce some of the best machines around.

 

Mike (Tempted),

It was nice speaking today. Honestly, I didn't know you were unhappy. Can't Read Minds - Yet..

Thanks to all trying to get the facts. I have been out of town and didn't even know this Thread Existed until this morning.

The last we spoke I called you to-insure you received the check AND you thanked me for the payment and you specifically told me YOU were going to take it to a Phoenix shop and get a Boost Controller to up the boost to 8 PSI. You Never mentioned YOU WERE UNHAPPY - OR EXPECTED ME TO GET YOU A BOOST CONTROLLER - not sure if you don't say so.

Simple, NO RE-FLASH is necessary. The fuel system is fine. The car needs more boost.

PERIOD...

NOTE:
WE ARE TRYING TO COME UP WITH DIFFERENT SOLUTIONS TO TUNE THE TN, Greddy, and additional kits and this is the reason why we used what we used. Hell, the TN system and a re-flash is easy, yet we are trying to find NEW SOLUTIONS.

Boost Controller
I will send you one to be installed and you can pay me when you have the funds.

If you wish, we will install it with no problems and I PROMISE YOU WHEN THE CAR HAS 8 PSI, it will not only make more power, the fuel ratios will be perfect.


Timing:
The Split Second Box already is set to retard the timing so once again the re-flash isn't necessary.

Fuel:
Boost Pressure Regulator and appropriate injectors for this power level.

THE KIT
We received this USED KIT as is...We used a different system as a safety...And what we believe can be a reasonable solution to timing and fuel for ALL TN kits.

Mike (Tempted), I understand IF YOU ARE UNHAPPY with the power...After running the dyno, you knew it was rich and I asked you if you wanted to up the boost, you said, "you were happy with everything and you would wait a few months to up the boost."

Now, Thank you for bringing your issue to the forefront, WE CAN'T SOLVE ISSUES WHEN WE DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY ARE!

Mike, call me so we can get you a boost controller or arrange to schedule your car to up the boost. IT LITERALLY IS THAT SIMPLE! I am not in the business of screwing people, if you stated that my Customer Service was Top-Notch, then let me serve you - let's schedule some time to Up The Boost, yet once again I CAN'T READ MINDS so tell me what you really want to do and let's do it!

M

 

On another note,


Unhappy VRT clients.

Truth
Jame's G35 from AZ with the 2nd gear AT tranny problems, the tranny was thrashed the day we started the car... damaged the day it arrived and James the owner must have known this for he blew his motor with a Greddy kit and boasted how he used to run 10+ PSI with his Greddy. That level of boost with a Greddy will do two things...Blow the motor and destroy an AT tranny.

Fact:
He was suppose to build the tranny when we built the car - on his signed Invoice, yet HE RAN OUT OF MONEY, came to pick up the car short of money, and unfortunately still owes an outstanding balance...

B.S.
Hate this $$it when you have to talk about people's issues on forums, yet I guess if you folks are going to make assumptions we are screwing folks, I want to make sure the facts are on the table. This all sounds to me that he is simply trying to make up excuses how to stiff me for the balance due...Excuses...But to talk trash about VRT when he knows the truth about the tranny and his outstanding balance of $$$ is beyond belief.

NO Skeleton's, just need to get the facts straight. This guy needs a new BUILT TRANNY, needs to pay our balance, and then, knowing him, he still won't be happy.

Be a Man
James - Call me instead of spreading B.S. Rumors or calling JWT and complaining about VRT when they know the whole story, just makes you look $hitty and like a slime-ball.

If you don't want to pay the balance, don't talk $$it. Just stiff VRT and move on...You have to live with that kind of life. We built you a great motor and JWT kit, gave you a 3 inch exhaust, let you use my CE28s for months cause YOUR TIRES were bald, and spent alot of money when you over-boosted the car during the break-in period and had to fly Scott out, rent a Uhaul truck and trailer, pay Scott, pay gas, pay my mechanics, fly you out to San Diego, and ship the car back when all you had to do is drive the car nicely for 500 miles. WTF?

Don't Spread BS if it isn't true!

Sorry to express some $hit that doesn't belong on these forums, just pisses me off if facts are twisted...Particularly when I bend over backwards for customers for a fair price. We are proud of our work and stand behind what we say and deliver. If there are problems and OUR FAULT, we fix them. In the pst, when there are problem and haven't been our fault, we have fixed them AT OUR COST!

Just Business.
These are race-cars and there will always be problems, yet when the problem like a blown tranny prior to our even having the car is REAL and the customer knows this, is suppose to pay for this, and says he is out of money and can't build the tranny, then DON'T SPREAD BS RUMORS. Save up your money, BE A MAN, and enjoy your motor and JWT. It hads been 4 months...BUILD YOUR TRANNY!

Peace...

M

 

Michael thanks for calling me and discussing the issue. Like I said above and we talked about today your customer service was and is still is excellent. I should have let you know I was unhappy with the power and how it was turning out but I am just not one for confrontation and didnt want to stir the waters so to speak (guess I screwed the pooch with this post). Once again thanks for the call and getting things straightened out.

Moderator lock the thread please.

 

Glad to hear it is all worked out for now. I m getting the TN kit upon return from Iraq and am still wondering who to get it from and who to have install it. Hear nothing but good things about VRT.

 

Steps to Turboing your car:

1. Research Research Research
2. Plan it out in your head
3. Plan it out on Paper
4. Find your Tuner
5. Find your Installer
6. Talk to your Tuner and Installer about your Plans
7. Be Clear as to what you want