New vortech dyno charts at GTM 477.8 whp 383 tq
04-22-2007, 12:22 PM
#22
thanks everyone 
Booger, I'm running the same tire setup I had before - which isn't ideal because my front tires are 265 PS2's and rears are 295 pirelli corsa competition tires with a 60 treadwear
The other things I've done in my power to create more traction are:
nismo LSD
solid motor and solid diff mounts - to fight wheel hop
relocated battery to rear
JIC traction and camber arms which have stiffer bushings - to fight wheel hop
My rear camber is -1.6 degrees, which is fairly flat against the street
My rear springs are 8kg, not anything super stiff, just a little stiffer than stock
When running on the road, my spare tire was in the car wedged under the strut bar. I don't normally run with the spare tire, but I do when I drive to CA and back
Sam was also in the car with me if that'd create any extra weight to partially be distributed over the rear tires
So that was the circumstances with traction. I haven't driven out on my own yet to see what the car will do. You have to understand my wife was with me all day and as soon as the car was finished, we took off for home.
Sometime today I'm going to wash my car and do some driving in it to see what it'll do with how I normally would drive it.
As far as the before dyno. I agree I'm not sure how it makes sense. Sam called me and left a message (maybe I still have it on my phone) saying he put the car on the dyno as it was and it did several 380whp pulls, but then after a couple he said it put out 420whp. He said the A/F wasn't really lean or unsafe, but very wavy - which I knew it would be.
My only guess at this point in time is after driving for 6 hours from CA under low load, maybe it took a few runs for the ECU to wake up and throw some higher timing at the engine. I really don't know and I haven't seen the graphs myself yet. I'll talk to Sam at some point this week to see if he can email me some of those original graphs and let him know how the car is running and what correction his dyno uses etc
My original dyno at dynocomp a while ago was around 435whp when the engine was cold and 420 when the engine was warmed up - of which the 420 dyno is the one I posted. That was on their dyno dynamics dyno. GTM uses a dynojet. I'm just stating the facts what the car pulled at each shop. I'm not trying to inflate anything. I don't know what I edited. My 1st post and 2nd post in this thread I added a few things. I didn't really change any info I previously said
Kenk2, I probably won't step foot in Vivid Racing ever again
They charged me a bunch of labor for attempting to install an emanage ultimate which they completely screwed up the unit and never finished the install and I had to dispute the charge with my credit card.
Booger, I'm running the same tire setup I had before - which isn't ideal because my front tires are 265 PS2's and rears are 295 pirelli corsa competition tires with a 60 treadwear
The other things I've done in my power to create more traction are:
nismo LSD
solid motor and solid diff mounts - to fight wheel hop
relocated battery to rear
JIC traction and camber arms which have stiffer bushings - to fight wheel hop
My rear camber is -1.6 degrees, which is fairly flat against the street
My rear springs are 8kg, not anything super stiff, just a little stiffer than stock
When running on the road, my spare tire was in the car wedged under the strut bar. I don't normally run with the spare tire, but I do when I drive to CA and back
Sam was also in the car with me if that'd create any extra weight to partially be distributed over the rear tires
So that was the circumstances with traction. I haven't driven out on my own yet to see what the car will do. You have to understand my wife was with me all day and as soon as the car was finished, we took off for home.
Sometime today I'm going to wash my car and do some driving in it to see what it'll do with how I normally would drive it.
As far as the before dyno. I agree I'm not sure how it makes sense. Sam called me and left a message (maybe I still have it on my phone) saying he put the car on the dyno as it was and it did several 380whp pulls, but then after a couple he said it put out 420whp. He said the A/F wasn't really lean or unsafe, but very wavy - which I knew it would be.
My only guess at this point in time is after driving for 6 hours from CA under low load, maybe it took a few runs for the ECU to wake up and throw some higher timing at the engine. I really don't know and I haven't seen the graphs myself yet. I'll talk to Sam at some point this week to see if he can email me some of those original graphs and let him know how the car is running and what correction his dyno uses etc
My original dyno at dynocomp a while ago was around 435whp when the engine was cold and 420 when the engine was warmed up - of which the 420 dyno is the one I posted. That was on their dyno dynamics dyno. GTM uses a dynojet. I'm just stating the facts what the car pulled at each shop. I'm not trying to inflate anything. I don't know what I edited. My 1st post and 2nd post in this thread I added a few things. I didn't really change any info I previously said
Kenk2, I probably won't step foot in Vivid Racing ever again
They charged me a bunch of labor for attempting to install an emanage ultimate which they completely screwed up the unit and never finished the install and I had to dispute the charge with my credit card.
Last edited by sentry65; 04-22-2007 at 12:37 PM.
04-22-2007, 12:38 PM
#23
The other things I've done in my power to create more traction are:
nismo LSD
solid motor and solid diff mounts - to fight wheel hop
relocated battery to rear
JIC traction and camber arms which have stiffer bushings - to fight wheel hop
My rear camber is -1.6 degrees, which is fairly flat against the street
My rear springs are 8kg, not anything super stiff, just a little stiffer than stock
When running on the road, my spare tire was in the car wedged under the strut bar. I don't normally run with the spare tire, but I do when I drive to CA and back
While all thoughs suspention mods will help with launching the car with no wheel hop . You still would think at 20 or 30 mph in 2nd gear with 3.9 rear gears , the tires arent gong to hold for nothing with all that 477whp and all that gearing .
Your video kinda shows it . If you were in 5th gear , the dyno shows that going from 2500rpm to 6500rpm only takes 3 maybe 4 seconds at most . Geeze , its hardly anytime at all for the dyno to get a good sampling .
nismo LSD
solid motor and solid diff mounts - to fight wheel hop
relocated battery to rear
JIC traction and camber arms which have stiffer bushings - to fight wheel hop
My rear camber is -1.6 degrees, which is fairly flat against the street
My rear springs are 8kg, not anything super stiff, just a little stiffer than stock
When running on the road, my spare tire was in the car wedged under the strut bar. I don't normally run with the spare tire, but I do when I drive to CA and back
While all thoughs suspention mods will help with launching the car with no wheel hop . You still would think at 20 or 30 mph in 2nd gear with 3.9 rear gears , the tires arent gong to hold for nothing with all that 477whp and all that gearing .
Your video kinda shows it . If you were in 5th gear , the dyno shows that going from 2500rpm to 6500rpm only takes 3 maybe 4 seconds at most . Geeze , its hardly anytime at all for the dyno to get a good sampling .
04-22-2007, 12:47 PM
#25
those dyno runs were in 4th gear booger. Sam dynos mostly in 4th gear until he has the tune very close to dialed in, then he'll dyno in 5th gear.
I dunno man, with Sam in the car and a spare tire, I drove the car to redline in 2nd gear I think a few times - it was a part of the tuning process. I also drove to redline in 2nd gear with my wife and 40 or so extra lbs of luggage in the car and it completely hooked then also. Both times had the spare tire in the car
Like I said, I haven't run the car with me by myself with no spare tire yet, but will today probably. Maybe I will break traction in 2nd. I know you doubt me on anything having to do with my traction, but that's how things have been so far. Maybe you should look into a better LSD and tires?
What I saw on the dyno video was the car wanted to leap forward off the dyno...not losing traction. If I was losing traction in 4th gear, I'd have to be making a LOT more power than I am regardless of gearing wouldn't you think?
another thing Sam and I noticed from each of us driving is my upgraded brembos are not up to the task of stopping the car well after braking hard 3 or so times
I dunno man, with Sam in the car and a spare tire, I drove the car to redline in 2nd gear I think a few times - it was a part of the tuning process. I also drove to redline in 2nd gear with my wife and 40 or so extra lbs of luggage in the car and it completely hooked then also. Both times had the spare tire in the car
Like I said, I haven't run the car with me by myself with no spare tire yet, but will today probably. Maybe I will break traction in 2nd. I know you doubt me on anything having to do with my traction, but that's how things have been so far. Maybe you should look into a better LSD and tires?
What I saw on the dyno video was the car wanted to leap forward off the dyno...not losing traction. If I was losing traction in 4th gear, I'd have to be making a LOT more power than I am regardless of gearing wouldn't you think?
another thing Sam and I noticed from each of us driving is my upgraded brembos are not up to the task of stopping the car well after braking hard 3 or so times
Last edited by sentry65; 04-22-2007 at 01:03 PM.
04-22-2007, 12:55 PM
#27
because with the Fcon, only an authorized dealer can install, tune, and sell an Fcon. Once GTM has installed it, to my knowledge only they can tune thier map from now on because they lock it with a password. But if I understand correctly, if something were to ever happen to Sam - who might be the only one who knows the password, I think another authorized HKS shop can create a brand new map if needed
The only authorized HKS dealer in AZ is intense motorsports. I talked to them a long time ago and I know they have a great tuner who has a nice reputation with their supras, but I don't think to date they've installed or tuned the Fcon on a Z - I could be wrong on that though. I wanted my car worked on by one of the best shops in the country by someone who really knows what they're doing with the Fcon. It's a 6 hour drive, not the biggest deal and I thought it was worth the trip
They were also running their $2999 special on the Fcon, which a few other shops have since matched
The only authorized HKS dealer in AZ is intense motorsports. I talked to them a long time ago and I know they have a great tuner who has a nice reputation with their supras, but I don't think to date they've installed or tuned the Fcon on a Z - I could be wrong on that though. I wanted my car worked on by one of the best shops in the country by someone who really knows what they're doing with the Fcon. It's a 6 hour drive, not the biggest deal and I thought it was worth the trip
They were also running their $2999 special on the Fcon, which a few other shops have since matched
Last edited by sentry65; 04-22-2007 at 01:00 PM.
04-22-2007, 01:04 PM
#28
Originally Posted by sentry65
those dyno runs were in 4th gear booger. Sam dynos mostly in 4th gear until he has the tune very close to dialed in, then he'll dyno in 5th gear.
I dunno man, with Sam in the car and a spare tire, I drove the car to redline in 2nd gear I think a few times - it was a part of the tuning process. I also drove to redline in 2nd gear with my wife and 40 or so extra lbs of luggage in the car and it completely hooked then also. Both times had the spare tire in the car
Like I said, I haven't run the car with me by myself with no spare tire. Maybe I will break traction in 2nd. I know you doubt me on anything having to do with my traction, but that's how things have been so far. Maybe you should look into a better LSD and tires?
What I saw on the dyno video was the car wanted to leap forward off the dyno...not losing traction. If I can lose traction in 4th gear, I'd have to be making a LOT more power than I am wouldn't you think?
another thing Sam and I noticed from each of us driving is my brembos are not up to the task of stopping the car well after braking hard 3 or so times
I dunno man, with Sam in the car and a spare tire, I drove the car to redline in 2nd gear I think a few times - it was a part of the tuning process. I also drove to redline in 2nd gear with my wife and 40 or so extra lbs of luggage in the car and it completely hooked then also. Both times had the spare tire in the car
Like I said, I haven't run the car with me by myself with no spare tire. Maybe I will break traction in 2nd. I know you doubt me on anything having to do with my traction, but that's how things have been so far. Maybe you should look into a better LSD and tires?
What I saw on the dyno video was the car wanted to leap forward off the dyno...not losing traction. If I can lose traction in 4th gear, I'd have to be making a LOT more power than I am wouldn't you think?
another thing Sam and I noticed from each of us driving is my brembos are not up to the task of stopping the car well after braking hard 3 or so times
Not sure what you meant by saying the car wanting to leap foward off the dyno or what it has to do with no traction in 2nd gear ???
But mine sure wants to leap around on the dyno when shifting and letting off the gas every time Ive been on one . Then you see a video of the guy coming off the dyno when doing a run and it makes you wonder some times if the same thing isnt going to happen to you..lol
04-22-2007, 01:06 PM
#29
Originally Posted by sentry65
because with the Fcon, only an authorized dealer can install, tune, and sell an Fcon. Once GTM has installed it, to my knowledge only they can tune thier map from now on because they lock it with a password. But if I understand correctly, if something were to ever happen to Sam - who might be the only one who knows the password, I think another authorized HKS shop can create a brand new map if needed
The only authorized HKS dealer in AZ is intense motorsports. I talked to them a long time ago and I know they have a great tuner who has a nice reputation with their supras, but I don't think to date they've installed or tuned the Fcon on a Z - I could be wrong on that though. I wanted my car worked on by one of the best shops in the country by someone who really knows what they're doing with the Fcon. It's a 6 hour drive, not the biggest deal and I thought it was worth the trip
They were also running their $2999 special on the Fcon, which a few other shops have since matched
The only authorized HKS dealer in AZ is intense motorsports. I talked to them a long time ago and I know they have a great tuner who has a nice reputation with their supras, but I don't think to date they've installed or tuned the Fcon on a Z - I could be wrong on that though. I wanted my car worked on by one of the best shops in the country by someone who really knows what they're doing with the Fcon. It's a 6 hour drive, not the biggest deal and I thought it was worth the trip
They were also running their $2999 special on the Fcon, which a few other shops have since matched
04-22-2007, 01:08 PM
#30
we were braking really hard Booger. We were on back roads and there wasn't much room to stop sometimes because the road would curve ahead or just whatever. Both of us would hit the brakes hard - maybe my almost brand new Axis ultimate pads just suck, I dunno. They're not exactly track grade pads intended for hard repeated 80+mph stops
The car stopped fine, but we were noticing after braking hard 2-3 times from 80+mph or whatever it was feeling more spongy than the first time braking
that's all....
The car stopped fine, but we were noticing after braking hard 2-3 times from 80+mph or whatever it was feeling more spongy than the first time braking
that's all....
Last edited by sentry65; 04-22-2007 at 01:12 PM.
04-22-2007, 01:24 PM
#31
Originally Posted by sentry65
we were braking really hard Booger. We were on back roads and there wasn't much room to stop sometimes because the road would curve ahead or just whatever. Both of us would hit the brakes hard - maybe my almost brand new Axis ultimate pads just suck, I dunno. They're not exactly track grade pads intended for hard repeated 80+mph stops
The car stopped fine, but we were noticing after braking hard 2-3 times from 80+mph or whatever it was feeling more spongy than the first time braking
that's all....
The car stopped fine, but we were noticing after braking hard 2-3 times from 80+mph or whatever it was feeling more spongy than the first time braking
that's all....
04-22-2007, 01:34 PM
#32
nice, maybe I should switch my brembos to the stock brakes then with hawk pads 
That'd be a lot cheaper than a full AP racing set
btw i'm assuming you're running hps pads right? I didn't like those on my car at all. They barely stopped my car and had no bite IMO, but maybe they wouldn't fade as fast, I dunno
That'd be a lot cheaper than a full AP racing setbtw i'm assuming you're running hps pads right? I didn't like those on my car at all. They barely stopped my car and had no bite IMO, but maybe they wouldn't fade as fast, I dunno
04-22-2007, 01:41 PM
#33
Originally Posted by sentry65
nice, maybe I should switch my brembos to the stock brakes then with hawk pads That'd be a lot cheaper than a full AP racing set
btw i'm assuming you're running hps pads right? I didn't like those on my car at all. They barely stopped my car and had no bite IMO, but maybe they wouldn't fade as fast, I dunno
That'd be a lot cheaper than a full AP racing setbtw i'm assuming you're running hps pads right? I didn't like those on my car at all. They barely stopped my car and had no bite IMO, but maybe they wouldn't fade as fast, I dunno
04-22-2007, 01:47 PM
#34
hawk makes HPS and HP+ pads of which I've driven on both. I loved the HP+ pads which were meant for autocrossing, but the squeeling really started to get annoying around town, even after bedding them it'd come back within a few days
They've only recently started making their PC pads which I haven't driven on yet. The HPS pads were milder than the stock brembo pads, stopping distances went up - I actually felt flat out unsafe with them and made a few of posts about that in the braking forum a year ago or whatever
Anyway, Sam drove my car and came back telling me my brakes were not quite up to par with the rest of the car. I had no reason to doubt him because I've had similar thoughts since the stock brembos were designed to not fade with the bone stock car. Considering my car is mostly street driven right now I haven't really been concerned with the brakes much. Then I drove the car during tuning and I could feel what he meant.
Anyway I'll probably upgrade the brakes eventually and definetly before going on a road course
They've only recently started making their PC pads which I haven't driven on yet. The HPS pads were milder than the stock brembo pads, stopping distances went up - I actually felt flat out unsafe with them and made a few of posts about that in the braking forum a year ago or whatever
Anyway, Sam drove my car and came back telling me my brakes were not quite up to par with the rest of the car. I had no reason to doubt him because I've had similar thoughts since the stock brembos were designed to not fade with the bone stock car. Considering my car is mostly street driven right now I haven't really been concerned with the brakes much. Then I drove the car during tuning and I could feel what he meant.
Anyway I'll probably upgrade the brakes eventually and definetly before going on a road course
Last edited by sentry65; 04-22-2007 at 01:52 PM.
04-22-2007, 01:49 PM
#35
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I have HP pads and they don't do too well. Too small of a window for perfect temperature range.
Nice power band. With a built motor, reving higher will definately pump up the power.
Nice power band. With a built motor, reving higher will definately pump up the power.
04-22-2007, 01:58 PM
#36
thanks plumpzz,
do you have HP+ or HPS pads? Neither were designed for road courses. I don't think I'd feel comfortable abusing either on the track. The HP+ I've heard are great for low temp, but quickly lose their stopping power and will actually start cutting up your rotors when hot. Someone actually cracked their rotors with them after a 60 minute session.
I know there's more track oriented pads for the brembos to deal with hard repeated stops. I'm not sure if I'll attempt some of those on a road course or put that pad money towards new brakes all together
do you have HP+ or HPS pads? Neither were designed for road courses. I don't think I'd feel comfortable abusing either on the track. The HP+ I've heard are great for low temp, but quickly lose their stopping power and will actually start cutting up your rotors when hot. Someone actually cracked their rotors with them after a 60 minute session.
I know there's more track oriented pads for the brembos to deal with hard repeated stops. I'm not sure if I'll attempt some of those on a road course or put that pad money towards new brakes all together
04-22-2007, 02:02 PM
#37
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I have HP, not the HP+. I was very disapointed by them. My HP pads were actually fading even after the end of one autoX (1 minute of hard braking tops). They fade at high speeds too. They're decent street pads. Horrible track pads.
Ive heard excellent things about ferrado pads, and Ill try them out next. Carbotech (i think thats the name) are also good, ive heard.
Ive heard excellent things about ferrado pads, and Ill try them out next. Carbotech (i think thats the name) are also good, ive heard.
04-22-2007, 02:03 PM
#38
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Sweet #'s Sentry!!
Congrats! ...
Go 6pot front / 4pot rear on 14" rotors... You will stop on a M'F'N dime
Do you have a full fuel return? CJM I think?
Grats on finally getting to the bottom of your fuel issue!!
Still got those 440's?
Congrats! ...
Go 6pot front / 4pot rear on 14" rotors... You will stop on a M'F'N dime
Do you have a full fuel return? CJM I think?
Grats on finally getting to the bottom of your fuel issue!!
Still got those 440's?
04-22-2007, 02:09 PM
#40
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Originally Posted by sentry65
Thanks Triji,
I'm running the CJM stage 2 return system.
I have RC550's for sale, not 440's
I'm running the CJM stage 2 return system.
I have RC550's for sale, not 440's