V2 *IDLE coolant overheat*
06-02-2010, 05:15 PM
#21
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Might sound silly but when you checked the fans, they were spinning in the direction that pulls air through the radiator from the front of the car, and not pushing air into the radiator from engine side? I've noticed that with my Vortech setup the water temps heat quickly at idle and low speeds, but once the water temps reach 100'C the thermo-fans kick in and bring it down to 90'C in about 30 seconds.
06-02-2010, 06:40 PM
#22
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ok, here's what i'm going to lay out. If you dont believe if then destroy your car or whatever. You came here and asked a question and seems like you're just arguing with people that try to help.
it's the thermostat not opening. either failed or not opening due to a bubble behidn the thermostat. I know this because it happened to me when i did my last head gasket change a few months ago.
symptoms: driving temps are normal, idling temps increase. Had plenty of hot air, temps were lowered when turning the heater on (because the heater core dissipates the heat, common sense). Coolant lines bulge out do to the increase in pressure of hot coolant and the thermostat not opening.
if your thermostat opens, that small bypass hose on the front of the motor has very little flow. it all flows through the radiator when tstat is open.
you can have a small buble behind only the thermostat and no air in your heater core causing there to be plenty of heat. this makes you think it's bled.
get a spill free funnel and use that to bleed the systme. You have to rev it higher than 3k rpms to get those air bubbles to move and the heater has to be on full blast when you are bleeding it. I would hold mine at 5k for 30 seconds, let it idle, then go higher. You also have to pump the gas so it jars the air bubbles loose.
basically, your symptoms are EXACTLY that of a stuck thermostat. could be a failure, could be an airbubble. Mine was an air bubble. bled it for a few hours on multiple days but as soon as i used a spill free funnel and revved it higher, problem solved.
it's the thermostat not opening. either failed or not opening due to a bubble behidn the thermostat. I know this because it happened to me when i did my last head gasket change a few months ago.
symptoms: driving temps are normal, idling temps increase. Had plenty of hot air, temps were lowered when turning the heater on (because the heater core dissipates the heat, common sense). Coolant lines bulge out do to the increase in pressure of hot coolant and the thermostat not opening.
if your thermostat opens, that small bypass hose on the front of the motor has very little flow. it all flows through the radiator when tstat is open.
you can have a small buble behind only the thermostat and no air in your heater core causing there to be plenty of heat. this makes you think it's bled.
get a spill free funnel and use that to bleed the systme. You have to rev it higher than 3k rpms to get those air bubbles to move and the heater has to be on full blast when you are bleeding it. I would hold mine at 5k for 30 seconds, let it idle, then go higher. You also have to pump the gas so it jars the air bubbles loose.
basically, your symptoms are EXACTLY that of a stuck thermostat. could be a failure, could be an airbubble. Mine was an air bubble. bled it for a few hours on multiple days but as soon as i used a spill free funnel and revved it higher, problem solved.
06-03-2010, 01:49 PM
#24
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hahah
well i just hate seeing people ASKING a question then when people tell them what they know they argue. it's like, if you knew it, why are you asking us?
anyways, my advice/knowledge is take it or leave it. I've built enough bike engines and experienced enough of my g35 to have had these problems already.
If what i laid out doens't fit his problem to a T then i dont know what does. he can choose to ignore it or use the advice and at least test it to see if it was a simple fix. the other alternative means there is engine damage so i'd go with my suggestion first.
well i just hate seeing people ASKING a question then when people tell them what they know they argue. it's like, if you knew it, why are you asking us?
anyways, my advice/knowledge is take it or leave it. I've built enough bike engines and experienced enough of my g35 to have had these problems already.
If what i laid out doens't fit his problem to a T then i dont know what does. he can choose to ignore it or use the advice and at least test it to see if it was a simple fix. the other alternative means there is engine damage so i'd go with my suggestion first.
06-03-2010, 01:59 PM
#25
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this really does sound like an air pocket issue since you're confident in your fans. the t-stat may be the culprit, but I believe that is unlikely since you get adequate cooling once the car is at highway speeds. the t-stat restricts coolant flow from the radiator until the coolant reaches 170F (nismo is 154F, btw), so if the t-stat had failed to open, you wouldn't see any cooling benefits from driving at highway speed.
as the days go by i'm leaning toward the air in the system. i'm thinking that the first time it happened, there wasn't enough fluid in the reservoir and air entered from the reservoir into the system via overflow line. Then the second time was probably because air entered through the system because the radiator cap didn't sit perfectly on the radiator and through movement air entered that way. (this is purely questionable, its just whats going through my head because i cant figure out how/why air got in the system so im thinking of crazy suggestions)
so im going to be purging the coolant system today and im going to see if bubbles consistantly come up into the funnel.
06-03-2010, 02:05 PM
#26
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ok, here's what i'm going to lay out. If you dont believe if then destroy your car or whatever. You came here and asked a question and seems like you're just arguing with people that try to help.
it's the thermostat not opening. either failed or not opening due to a bubble behidn the thermostat. I know this because it happened to me when i did my last head gasket change a few months ago.
symptoms: driving temps are normal, idling temps increase. Had plenty of hot air, temps were lowered when turning the heater on (because the heater core dissipates the heat, common sense). Coolant lines bulge out do to the increase in pressure of hot coolant and the thermostat not opening.
if your thermostat opens, that small bypass hose on the front of the motor has very little flow. it all flows through the radiator when tstat is open.
you can have a small buble behind only the thermostat and no air in your heater core causing there to be plenty of heat. this makes you think it's bled.
get a spill free funnel and use that to bleed the systme. You have to rev it higher than 3k rpms to get those air bubbles to move and the heater has to be on full blast when you are bleeding it. I would hold mine at 5k for 30 seconds, let it idle, then go higher. You also have to pump the gas so it jars the air bubbles loose.
basically, your symptoms are EXACTLY that of a stuck thermostat. could be a failure, could be an airbubble. Mine was an air bubble. bled it for a few hours on multiple days but as soon as i used a spill free funnel and revved it higher, problem solved.
it's the thermostat not opening. either failed or not opening due to a bubble behidn the thermostat. I know this because it happened to me when i did my last head gasket change a few months ago.
symptoms: driving temps are normal, idling temps increase. Had plenty of hot air, temps were lowered when turning the heater on (because the heater core dissipates the heat, common sense). Coolant lines bulge out do to the increase in pressure of hot coolant and the thermostat not opening.
if your thermostat opens, that small bypass hose on the front of the motor has very little flow. it all flows through the radiator when tstat is open.
you can have a small buble behind only the thermostat and no air in your heater core causing there to be plenty of heat. this makes you think it's bled.
get a spill free funnel and use that to bleed the systme. You have to rev it higher than 3k rpms to get those air bubbles to move and the heater has to be on full blast when you are bleeding it. I would hold mine at 5k for 30 seconds, let it idle, then go higher. You also have to pump the gas so it jars the air bubbles loose.
basically, your symptoms are EXACTLY that of a stuck thermostat. could be a failure, could be an airbubble. Mine was an air bubble. bled it for a few hours on multiple days but as soon as i used a spill free funnel and revved it higher, problem solved.
the coolant purging/bleeding is what i have been planning on doing and now i can do it because i have the right materials which i didn't before.
06-03-2010, 02:17 PM
#27
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Thread Starter
hahah
well i just hate seeing people ASKING a question then when people tell them what they know they argue. it's like, if you knew it, why are you asking us?
anyways, my advice/knowledge is take it or leave it. I've built enough bike engines and experienced enough of my g35 to have had these problems already.
If what i laid out doens't fit his problem to a T then i dont know what does. he can choose to ignore it or use the advice and at least test it to see if it was a simple fix. the other alternative means there is engine damage so i'd go with my suggestion first.
well i just hate seeing people ASKING a question then when people tell them what they know they argue. it's like, if you knew it, why are you asking us?
anyways, my advice/knowledge is take it or leave it. I've built enough bike engines and experienced enough of my g35 to have had these problems already.
If what i laid out doens't fit his problem to a T then i dont know what does. he can choose to ignore it or use the advice and at least test it to see if it was a simple fix. the other alternative means there is engine damage so i'd go with my suggestion first.
everything you said except the purging of the coolant system was good/new information to me. i appreciate your input as well and hopefully when i purge it (after she cools down) the problem will be fixed. of all people i'm hoping it's a simple fix too.lol...
from wednesday to today i haven't had it overheat like it did before, since i added fluid to the radiator (till it was overfilled) and to the reservoir (right below the high mark)
06-03-2010, 03:03 PM
#28
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answer me this because i'm not 100% sure to where i would bet my life on it....
you know how toilets, kitchen sinks, ect work where there is a "U" shape passageway to either prevent the toilet from overflowing or prevent smell/bugs from exiting the sink? well thats used in most reservoir systems to regulate the amount of fluid (or whatever it may be) in the main container. (sorry if it's not detailed enough for you but i'm trying to explain what im talking about....keep this in mind though for the end of the post)
with our coolant overflow system it has the line begining at the highest point of the radiator connecting to the lowest part of the reservoir via a line/hose. the reservoir purposely sits below the highest point of the radiator so that when the fluid level in the radiator gets high (after you turn your car off and the fluid cools down) it drains out through the overflow line. it's connected to the bottom of the reservoir so that no air can enter the system (because air can't break through the fluid and swim into the radiator. which is also why there is a low mark on the reservoir because when it swishes around when your driving it doesn't leave the fluid "passageway" open letting air in)
now that i have that said maybe you guys are on the same page as me and now you can envision the setup. now back to the "U" shape i said. it's sort of the azzbackwards way a kitchen sink works.
now if the radiator overflow hose/line was above the highest point of the reservoir making a little area where there can't be any fluid that could be a potential air pocket entering the system. on the stock setup the line never goes above the highest point of the reservoir so this wouldn't have an effect on that kind of setup; although, with mine i have a overflow hose thats too long for the current location of the reservoir. (i hope your following my path still)
now the reservoir is below the highest point of the radiator so that when the car is off and you open the radiator cap fluid doesn't come spilling out non-stop.
i'm thinking that with that "U" shape the hose makes it causes a misreading of the fluid level in the radiator creating an air pocket because it's above the high point. so that creates air in the line then it enters the system when you start the car again. (if you don't catch what i'm saying then im sorry, i'm trying to write out my complicated way of thinking) i drew a picture of what im explaining in case someone is confused. it looks like im 10 years old but i'm a diesel mechanic...not an artist.
since i fixed that "U" shape it was making it hasn't overheated....i'm thinking that is what caused the issues....
you know how toilets, kitchen sinks, ect work where there is a "U" shape passageway to either prevent the toilet from overflowing or prevent smell/bugs from exiting the sink? well thats used in most reservoir systems to regulate the amount of fluid (or whatever it may be) in the main container. (sorry if it's not detailed enough for you but i'm trying to explain what im talking about....keep this in mind though for the end of the post)
with our coolant overflow system it has the line begining at the highest point of the radiator connecting to the lowest part of the reservoir via a line/hose. the reservoir purposely sits below the highest point of the radiator so that when the fluid level in the radiator gets high (after you turn your car off and the fluid cools down) it drains out through the overflow line. it's connected to the bottom of the reservoir so that no air can enter the system (because air can't break through the fluid and swim into the radiator. which is also why there is a low mark on the reservoir because when it swishes around when your driving it doesn't leave the fluid "passageway" open letting air in)
now that i have that said maybe you guys are on the same page as me and now you can envision the setup. now back to the "U" shape i said. it's sort of the azzbackwards way a kitchen sink works.
now if the radiator overflow hose/line was above the highest point of the reservoir making a little area where there can't be any fluid that could be a potential air pocket entering the system. on the stock setup the line never goes above the highest point of the reservoir so this wouldn't have an effect on that kind of setup; although, with mine i have a overflow hose thats too long for the current location of the reservoir. (i hope your following my path still)
now the reservoir is below the highest point of the radiator so that when the car is off and you open the radiator cap fluid doesn't come spilling out non-stop.
i'm thinking that with that "U" shape the hose makes it causes a misreading of the fluid level in the radiator creating an air pocket because it's above the high point. so that creates air in the line then it enters the system when you start the car again. (if you don't catch what i'm saying then im sorry, i'm trying to write out my complicated way of thinking) i drew a picture of what im explaining in case someone is confused. it looks like im 10 years old but i'm a diesel mechanic...not an artist.
since i fixed that "U" shape it was making it hasn't overheated....i'm thinking that is what caused the issues....
06-03-2010, 03:50 PM
#30
^^^
he should NOT be needing to do that at all though...i wonder why you had to do that at all....specially considering he is just using a S/C... an oil cooler maybe, on top....or a rad, but the rest is in the install and tune......
I dont like just keeping buying aftermarket stuff on the "thought" that that is the real issue and it jsut gets people to spend more unnecesary money
he should NOT be needing to do that at all though...i wonder why you had to do that at all....specially considering he is just using a S/C... an oil cooler maybe, on top....or a rad, but the rest is in the install and tune......
I dont like just keeping buying aftermarket stuff on the "thought" that that is the real issue and it jsut gets people to spend more unnecesary money
06-03-2010, 04:28 PM
#31
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a regular funnel won't work though. spend 20$ at napa (or amazon.com) and get a spill free funnel.
i'm telling you all your worries will go away, that thing is awsome. You can rev it to the mood with that on there and no coolant spills at all but the bubbles will come out. Then you shut it off and let it cool completely with the funnel in place. Then start the car and warm it up from cold again and do it again.
I bled my cooling system for a year the hard way. Finally gave up and got the funnel and it literally took 30 minutes, no mess and worked perfectly. I can boost 14.5 psi all day in 90 degree whether and my coolant temps don't go over 200. only thing extra i have to the cooling system is the pathfinder coolant mod. That's it.
06-03-2010, 09:21 PM
#32
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if it's not blown up and the fans are working it's a circulation problem,t-stat,water pump,clogged rad.....back to basics,coolant is either moving too fast or too slow.
or your car hates you because your annoying
or your car hates you because your annoying
06-04-2010, 01:38 PM
#33
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06-04-2010, 01:42 PM
#34
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well im glad you informed me of the first things that go through my mind when it happened....so as far as the annoying part....speak for yourself....
06-04-2010, 04:44 PM
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06-06-2010, 05:35 AM
#38
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i'm not a ***** unless i felt disrespected in some way first. i'm normally informative and helpful but for some reason people like to say things on here that aren't about the OP like "your annoying". If only people would keep their opinions about other subjects other than the OP to themselves. I encourage suggestions and anything helpful toward the OP. If I was a ***** to someone for no reason then for that i'm sorry because i might of misunderstood or misinterpreted something said.
other than that my car overheated a lot yesterday....then my radio/ac controls became unfunctional when i turned my car on last night. i disconnected the battery for 12 hours then i'm going to bleed the coolant system.
other than that my car overheated a lot yesterday....then my radio/ac controls became unfunctional when i turned my car on last night. i disconnected the battery for 12 hours then i'm going to bleed the coolant system.
06-06-2010, 01:57 PM
#39
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so this is what happened when i bled the coolant system. i believe the variables in this situation is time and temperature. first time after it got real hott and it took about 30 minutes or less and the coolant started to uncontrollably bubble/erupt and the level got higher and higher (and it continued after i turned off the car) and it overflowed the funnel. i would rev the engine up to 3000-5000 then let it idle and rev it again over and over. and when i would rev it up the fluid level in the funnel would rise slowly depending on if i would rev it up fast enough for fluid to geyser out and raise the level some.
the thing is after it got really hot which took about 20-30 minutes it would uncontrollably erupt until it decided to stop. it overflowed like this two different times that i bled the coolant system. the fans are coming on and staying on when it gets really hot.
i honestly don't know what the issue could be....most the time when i rev it up nothing happens but when i rev it up fast it funnel fluid level gets higher.
it almost seems like the thermostat just says no at certain times and closes and causes the fluid to erupt out the funnel but if i didn't have the funnel and had the rad cap on then the engine would just overheat. it may be an electrical issue....it may be a tuning issue.....it may be a thermostat issue (even though the first thoughts were it's only air).....
THE FACTS:
1) when ran hard or engine temperature gets to a certain threshold coolant system overheats.
2) oil temp is perfectly normal
3) don't have aftermarket coolant temp gauge so factory one says coolant temp is good when bleeding, although i have to turn off the car due to uncontrollable erupting coolant out of the funnel.
...SUCKS...
the thing is after it got really hot which took about 20-30 minutes it would uncontrollably erupt until it decided to stop. it overflowed like this two different times that i bled the coolant system. the fans are coming on and staying on when it gets really hot.
i honestly don't know what the issue could be....most the time when i rev it up nothing happens but when i rev it up fast it funnel fluid level gets higher.
it almost seems like the thermostat just says no at certain times and closes and causes the fluid to erupt out the funnel but if i didn't have the funnel and had the rad cap on then the engine would just overheat. it may be an electrical issue....it may be a tuning issue.....it may be a thermostat issue (even though the first thoughts were it's only air).....
THE FACTS:
1) when ran hard or engine temperature gets to a certain threshold coolant system overheats.
2) oil temp is perfectly normal
3) don't have aftermarket coolant temp gauge so factory one says coolant temp is good when bleeding, although i have to turn off the car due to uncontrollable erupting coolant out of the funnel.
...SUCKS...
06-06-2010, 02:13 PM
#40
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are you using a spill free funnel?
you're only supposed to have a small amount of fluid in it so you dont splash it everywhere once it gets hot and rises. when you rev it the coolant moves faster thereofre it will shoot up into the funnel.
i don't see what electrical could cause this.
i do'nt see what "tune" could cause this (since you're just idling the car you shoudl be able to see the wideband and it only needs to be 14.7 when doing this)
oil temp has nothing to do with anything since coolant temp doesn't dictate oil temp to a noticable degree.
after you reved it and the coolant was bubbling (which could easily be air leaving your system, it bursts like that when air is released) did you leave the spill free funnel on it with coolant in it and allow it to cool down all the way to cold? that will pull the coolant back into the engine and help remove bubbles. That is a key step in this whole process. leaving coolant in the spill free funnel and letting it cool all the way back to ambient air temps. Then repeat the whole process. leave the spill free in place the entire time, never remove it or let it become empty.
and yes, it sounds like the thermostat isn't opening. reach under the drivers side of the car and feel how hot the lower radiator hose is getting. It should be 200 degrees like the rest of the coolant. if it's not blistering hot then the thermostat isn't opening fully or at all.
also, make sure your heater is on full blast and temp set to 90 when you are doing the bleeding. makes life uncomfortable but it's required to get all the air out.
you're only supposed to have a small amount of fluid in it so you dont splash it everywhere once it gets hot and rises. when you rev it the coolant moves faster thereofre it will shoot up into the funnel.
i don't see what electrical could cause this.
i do'nt see what "tune" could cause this (since you're just idling the car you shoudl be able to see the wideband and it only needs to be 14.7 when doing this)
oil temp has nothing to do with anything since coolant temp doesn't dictate oil temp to a noticable degree.
after you reved it and the coolant was bubbling (which could easily be air leaving your system, it bursts like that when air is released) did you leave the spill free funnel on it with coolant in it and allow it to cool down all the way to cold? that will pull the coolant back into the engine and help remove bubbles. That is a key step in this whole process. leaving coolant in the spill free funnel and letting it cool all the way back to ambient air temps. Then repeat the whole process. leave the spill free in place the entire time, never remove it or let it become empty.
and yes, it sounds like the thermostat isn't opening. reach under the drivers side of the car and feel how hot the lower radiator hose is getting. It should be 200 degrees like the rest of the coolant. if it's not blistering hot then the thermostat isn't opening fully or at all.
also, make sure your heater is on full blast and temp set to 90 when you are doing the bleeding. makes life uncomfortable but it's required to get all the air out.
Last edited by binder; 06-06-2010 at 02:16 PM.