spn350z

Nissan will do as little or as much as Nissan's customer will accept or demand.

1) Customer demand fix !

Look at how quickly Nissan fixed the Bose stereo problem. First 350Z's were built in ~July 2002 and delivered in late Aug. The TSB was issued in Oct. The fix was rolled into production in September.

Compare to recall on alternator for Maxima 98 - the TSB was issue in July 2002! for car manufactured as early July '97. That is five years. Would Nissan have issue TSB earlier if Maxima owners got together and identified this problem earlier? Complained to NNA?

2) Would Nissan fix and correct orange peel if more customers complaint and viewed this as a problem rather than accept it? Again whether your particular vechile has orange peel or not viewing orange peel as a problem and providing this feed back to Nissan should assist Nissan correct the problem.

Yes, any manufacturer will attempt to get customers to ACCEPT product as is. But if customers demand better quality then manufacturers generally step up to the plate.

3) Consider this, for Bose problem.... how many would like to have the option to get the Bose stereo replaced with the Bose stereo installed on the G35 that allows for adjustment of Audio Pilot?

I think that the Bose stereo in the G35 benefited from the feed back provided by 350Z owners.

4) Demanding quality should not be viewed as a consumer/customer defect!

P.S.
I would bill the dealer for your time, even if he never pays up.
Point is:
Your time is valuable and as important to you as the dealers manager time is. Ask the manager for how much he bills for his time then send him a bill for your two hours.

dc350z

"Would Nissan fix and correct orange peel if more customers complaint and viewed this as a problem rather than accept it? Again whether your particular vechile has orange peel or not viewing orange peel as a problem and providing this feed back to Nissan should assist Nissan correct the problem."


OK one more time, Repeat after me....

ORANGE PEEL IS NOT A DEFECT!

If it was, every model, of every car, by every manufacturer would be recalled! It's a natural ocurrence, as the paint dries. Water based paints, that we have to deal with today thanks to the AQMD, exacerbate the condition. Hand rubbing the paint is not an option for Nissan, at that price point! Usually, you won't see it in a high end car, but they'll charge you for it on the bottom line.

Had a custom painted 240Z. Single stage, enamel. Rubbed sooo much, the paint looked like it was still in liquid state.
Was it original? No
Did it look better that original? Yes, I couldn't take my eyes off it!

Perhaps Nissan can reduce the orange peel, maybe, but they will never make it go away.

lemans

[QUOTE]Originally posted by sammythebull
[B]Ok, all need your advise...

Many of you may have seen my previous posts or heard that I left several messages from Nisssan Executives regarding my 350Z's Orange Peel situation.

I sent you a private email and did notice the model you had. Now I see you have a black touring. ASSUMING it is a stick they have a black 6m touring model for sale sitting in Sutherlin showroom, at least they did last friday. Also a couple of silverstone 6m touring. Don't know if you would get msrp there though but I think you should be able to. Far as the rest of posters waiting, sure is a lot of unslod z's on GA lots as well as elsewhere I am sure. Good luck with your decision.
Wayne

saccorator

Ask them to buy it back and sell you a new one at dealer cost. If Nissan is directly involved, they can offer you a new car at any price. This way Nissan still makes money and you can cover the tax and tags for the new car. Good Luck, but don't repaint it.

articfury

sammy has already settled with Nissan.

JD

Ez350

I keep noticing all these post that keep insisting that orange peel is not a defect. Okay....maybe not a defect. Maybe it is just an accepted evil.....assuming, that is, that you are willing to accept it. I have never worked in a body shop, but have worked on detailing teams for years and know that a true mirror finish is to be coveted. I love my Z. I love driving it and think that it is an exceptional car. But from someone who has spent a considerable amount of time caring for paint, I must say that I am not overly impressed with the Nissan Factory paint job. Admittedly, the car retails for sub-40K, and most of the cars that I have cared for in the past that I felt had truly exceptional paint jobs were in a different cost-category. That being said, I think the paint is unusually fragile, and to be blunt....thin. The tiniest rock-chip seems to go all the way through the primer. And yes, I was disappointed by the degree of orange-peel on my SB.

I probably would not have gone to the lengths that Sammy went to get my isue resolved, but that is my personal choice. I think the post by GrebMohr poses an excellent question -

"If Orange peel is normal then why does it appear in the defects pages of every painting book? It is the sign a poorly prepped body shot in an abnormal temp/humidity environment. True, most new cars have it. This fact does not make it acceptable but there is a ton of weighing to be done on the issue."

When you have detailed a black car with a mirror finish (by the way....if you want to know if your vehicle has a mirror finish, park under a fluorescent lamp, and see if the relection lines of the above lighting instrument are straight and true....no orange peel bumps.) then you know how amazinbg it can look and why Sammy's feathers are a little ruffled. In short, he had an expectation and the expectation wasn't met. And I don't fault him for trying to what he wants out of his ownership experience.

But please don't try to tell me that orange-peel is not a defect. Normal, maybe. Accepted, maybe. But it is still caused by a flaw in the painting process and is technically a defect.

Your willingness to accept it is your personal choice.

Pooh2002

Ez350,

Nicely put. I just finished a post on orange peel on another thread, but wasn't able to convey my overall feeling as well as you just did. I love the way my car looks and love the car. I am sure if I inspected it with the eye of an experienced detailer or body shop person, I would find flaws. Is my finish acceptable? To me it is completely acceptable. It is a matter of personal experience, expectations and choice.

Would someone else be dissatified with the same quality paint job on their car? Don't know, but it is their choice and they have every right to make it

Glen Masuo Ota

I sent an earlier message stating that I was unhappy with Nissans paint job. I found that after waxing my car with Zymol, the mfr suggests to apply an extra polish to the wax job by applying a very thin coat of water mist than rub it out with a clean cloth. It seriously works!!!!! No visble film whatsoever! My Z is black so I don't know how well it will work on other cars. The paint looks quite nice. By the way, the Z Rocks!!!

knowleqe

sorry for this question, but what is orange peel?

Ez350

Fluorescent lights are the best way to describe this because they provide such a clean line. If you park under a fluorescent light, take a look at it's reflection in your paint. If the line of the light is straight and clean then you have no orange peel (A rarity these days). If the line of the reflection is bumpy around the edges, that is the orange peel effect. In other words, it gives the appearance of a rough instead of a smooth finish....like the peel of an orange.

Stone Z

Not sure if it's because of the color (SS), or because Nissan has fixed the OP problem, but my new Z has *minimal* OP as compared to ones I saw at the dealer a couple months back....I'm very pleased with the finish on my car.

ZTHEWORLD

The way it was explained to me is that orange peel is the bi product of a factory paint job. Almost all new cars have orange peel. Its when the car is repainted due to an accident or restoration that there is no evidence of the orange peel. Keep that in mind when you go to buy a used car.

fotodad

I am amazed at the number of Z owners who happily cover their eyes and bend over with a jar of Vascilene in front of Nissan when they find a defect in their car, and then they have the ***** to tell other Z owners who are dissatisfied in some way to quite their whining and complaining. Why should the purchaser of ANY new vehicle, ANY new product be happy with defects? Orange peel isn't a defect? We should accept a bumpy, pitted finish on a brand new car? Such complaisancy breeds even more defects. Just take a look at domestic vehicles. Blind loyalty has brought American cars to the cellar of workmanship quality in my opinion. If customers choose to look the other way or settle for substandard quality we have no one to blame but ourselves for poorly manufactured goods. So, if you're not happy with your paint job or your transmission or your suspension or the streaking on the windows or the feathering on your tires or whatever other malady you are facing with your car respectfully COMPLAIN, respectfully WHINE to the dealership and to the manufacturer. NEVER SETTLE FOR SUBSTANDARD! Once we settle for second-best that's what we'll always get! We may never attain perfection, but we should always fight for it!

My 2¢
Have a nice day!
Michael

fotodad

By the way, I haven't found orange peel on my car.

Boomer

Down, Michael. Relax, kick back. Here, have a brownie.

fotodad

Boomer,

Thanks, Man. I'm all better now! Whew! I think I lost 20 pounds in that tirade. Mmmm, yummy brownie. I just put five pounds back on!!

Michael

XBS

iTrader: (29)

sorry but.... what is orange peel? can someone post a pic? thanks

ZGone

Basicly, when you look at a reflection in the paint it looks like the skin of an orange with the light ripples like the orange peel. My DB while it does have some orange peel it does look minimal. It results for the application of the paint on the body surface and can only be remove by wet sanding.

Cheers.

guerojo

I ended up just wet sanding my car and came out great. I did it lightly with a professional friend of mine. I posted a thread about the end results. I was happy after it was buffed out.

whosdady

iTrader: (6)

I know the original poster has settled but I am sure there are many others in his shoes. Also please realize that some Z's have problems and others are fine. This post is directed to those with severe problems like myslef.

First off painting the car is not an option. It is true it will destroy your resale value. Second of all, OP problems have become better in age with the 350Z. Mine is an older one and is a darker color, (SS). It looks like I have dried honey on the front and rear bumpers. At least Nissan has accepted this lack of quality and has changed their standard for the later models. Probably due to customer complaints.

I bought my car in Feb. when it was snowing and I saw my car for the first time at about 7:00PM when it was dark outside. I did not wash my car myself for about 1.5 months until it became warm enough to do so. The car had about 1800 miles on it and the first thing I did was call NNA and filed a/many complaint(s). I agree that many high number production cars have this problem. IE accords, civics, miatas etc. But for a $37K car, the extent of OP on my car is unacceptable. My sister recently purchased a 2003 3 series BMW, no OP. My Father has a 2002 Range Rover, no OP. My Mother has a 2001 Jaguar, no OP. My last car was a 94 TT Supra, no OP. Why should I accept OP on my new $37K car?

Secondly, if the paint didn't chip when the wind changes directions I don't think I would be quite as upset about the OP. That and the fact that I have large debris in the paint about 1 inch up from the wheel wells on both sides.

Nissan obviously cut costs somewhere. We know the tranny is an example with all of the problems/new installations needed. We know that 350's have had problems with striping bolts, so we know they used cheap bolts. The seats move and fray so I guess they lowerd costs there. The suspension *bounce* stinks and the tire cupping is unacceptable (must have been cost effective). The engine can handle about 350HP before a rod breaks, compared to 650HP in the Supra. To me it sounds like the only quality part on this car is the actual exterior design which is the first thing people look at.

I have never heard so many people complain about a car. If I didn't have one I wouldn't understand. Nissan needs to step up and offer assistance to those suffering from a sub standard product.