You might be ****-retentive if...

you eat the M&Ms in color order.

you fold your dirty clothes before putting them in the hamper.

you have to have all boxes in the kitchen facing the same way and in order by size.

you have all your canned goods organized by type, flavor, and use. and they're all facing the front.

all you books, CDs, and movies have to be alphabetical order.

you require no less than 200 threads per inch on your sheets. and they are tucked so tightly that you really could bounce a quarter on them.

you alphabetize your spices.

you actually bother trying to convince someone that the 3rd millenium hasn't begun yet

you organize your closet by color, season, and fabric.

you flame every person who sent you email because the emails weren't spelled correctly or gramatically correct.

you remove the tires to wash inside the wheel-wells of your vehicle.

you collect the little postcards in magazine issues...
...for recycling.

every e-mail reply that you send has been through a grammar checker...
...and you correct the original message.

you're on a "calorie-counting" diet and you count the calories in the hot sauce on your "Big Beef Burrito Supreme"

 

No no thats totally cool. I have given up VW like you are giving up Nissan. I guess what I am saying is don't expect anything better from other huge companines either. You may have to go to a small company like Porsche to get what you want. Maybe a DeLorean? Service comes down to your DEALER. Some warranty policies are in place by the manuf. but they are not RULES or LAWS. Policy can be overridden based on circumstance. As far as the car not being BUILT properly, well then that is another thing. Ghosn may have cut a few of the wrong costs. But is seems like that is across the board these days, no?

 

DeLorean , HUH? Porsche, overpriced and maintenance will kill you. Acura/Honda, Toyota/Lexus seem to be on top. I had 2 Preludes and an Accord, excellent cars. I've had a 91 (first year of production)Toyota MR2 Turbo, 7 years and 128,000 miles on the original turbo. I disagree that it comes down to the dealer only, production flaws are not their fault. Ghosn seems to be acting like an HMO, refusing service is much more profitable than fixing customer cars. This not my experience with Toyota and Honda. Nissan used to be right there with them, not anymore.

Your suggestions are not helpful nor solicited and defintely not funny either. Why don't you keep them to yourself? There's nothing funny about getting screwed by a car manufacturer.

 

Porsches aren't w/o flaws as well. As far as reliability and refinement goes, Toyota / Lexus is #1. But that rank also comes w/ a sterile driving experience, IMO.

Michael. <--- hangs out w/ Porsche owners and attends their DE's

 

That's what I am trying to say. Sorry, Boomer. You know I'm not trying to make you mad. Good luck, bud. I don't think life should be taken so seriously. Especially when we are talking about toys. Maybe if we were talking about where to find food or shelter that would be one thing. We are talking about 350Z's. Important topic. Geez.

 

POTATO HEAD... were in a z forum... OF COURSE THE Z IS SERIOUS TO US.... and it is hell when you drive your car... and the problems you expirience everyday aren't being solved. i talked to several z owners here in MD and they too feel the same way... we love our cars to death... but the lil problems and the big ones that just isn't being solved... is now starting to push us to the edge...

 

PH, I know you are just trying to help, but as others have said, its depressing to learn how many owners continue to be ignored or just plain lied to by Nissan repeatedly. I'm lucky, so far, but I don't have confidence Nissan will repair my car if it develops the tire problem again. This experience has never happened to me with my other Nissans, and I preordered the Z 18 months ago! Mine has 7100+ miles on it, but its over a year old. If a problem develops, I may be out of luck under the warranty.

My enjoyment of the car has been seriously undermined by the tire problem w/no fix in sight. The same thing has happened to others and they have just bailed out of anger and frustration, losing several $1000s doing it. I had planned to drive the Z for 7-8 yrs, but I seriously doubt I will now.

 

Good luck to everyone. I have window streaking on both sides, bose problem, tire feathering and a noisy tranny (not grinding.....yet). Despite all these problems, I enjoy the hell out of my Z. I jump in and drive. If the little things get on my mind, I push the gas harder

 

Well, back to Mr. Potato Head's long post about the value of $30K. I make a fair amount of money, and bought my $35K Touring. I didn't buy a super car, a Porsche, or whatever else, but I didn't buy a YUGO either. $35K might seem like play money to you, but it isn't to me...

I might be alone on this, but I think cheap cars go for under $18K. From $18K to $25K or so, you are buying up on quality... from $25K upwards you are buying luxury/specialty/sport features. In either range, quality is expected. My son's FOCUS at $13K has been a great car, dependable, runs good, no major problems, couple of recalls. At $32K I had a conversion van that never had ANYTHING go wrong with it for 3 years AT ALL (GMC Savanna).

I bought a V6 car, not a super V12 or whatever. I bought a car with a reasonable 267HP (or abouts)... I don't think I bought the greatest sport car ever made, but a compromise sport car for the street use.

As much a sport car as it might be compared to others in the price range, I DO expect the tires to last well over 8K miles, I DO expect the tranny to last well over 10K miles. This is my daily driver to work, over normal roads, at normal city speeds. I have never "tracked" it, I might just push it over 100 on the turnpike once or twice. I definetly do not call it abuse.

And yes, year one, so I gave it time. I have had mine since January, didn't bother the dealer. Have been waiting patiently for them to get the suspension right, or whatever is killing the tires. But, humm, time goes by, no?

Boils down to, every time I write that monthly check to send it in, am I getting that much from owning this car? Because the fact is I can get to work and reach 120mph for a lot less money...

ALL THAT SAID, I love my little redhead. The noise is getting on my nerves, but I might just stop by and get tires myself and screw the dealer. The tranny worries me because it is starting to get hard to go in gear, 2nd and 3rd mostly. The window streaks, the BOSE, I know how I can solve those ($$$)... BUT, If I had to do it again, I think this is more like a $27K car. Style gets a 10, quality, a 7.5...

 

You do understand those are totally non-equal situations, correct? Your 240Z was already broken in and proven to be a reliable vehicle. Your Maximas were not the first year of a totally, completely new vehicle design.

Yeah it sucks that some people are having problems with their Zs, but you can't expect it to be as reliable as a Maxima in its first year of production. That's just unrealistic.

 

The 89 WAS a completely new design except for the drivetrain. I had 0 problems with it. My 84 and 88 Preludes had 0 problems, my 1991 MR2 Turbo had no problems until 100,000 miles. My Japanese cars have had almost no problems before the Z. I think I am being realistic, based on my 19 years of owning Japanese cars.

The Z still isn't right for me and 1000s of other owners, the Bose isn't fixed, an owner had 11,000 miles and THEN developed the tire wear problem. I have 7100+ miles. I don't think I'm being unrealistic at all.

 

I totally understand what you guys are saying. I guess that after a lot of experience with numerous brand new and less than satisfactory vehicles the Z seems pretty good. Also, I stay pretty layed back when it comes to certain things. My Ford Ranger was like $10K, is a 2003, and has had no problems after 17K miles. I got it in Feb with the Z which now has about 5200 miles. I only drive the Z about once a week if that (road trips mostly) and as a result, I probably don't have the everyday familiarity that you do with your annoyances. I know that my STB in the back rattles like anything and I still have window grease streaks after 2 different fixes to both windows. My tranny doesn't shift as confidently as I would want it to. But if it goes it goes and there is warranty. I guess I am too busy enjoying the scenery whizzing by to get caught up in the little spot of grease on the window. I look past it at the rest of the world. There are a ton of great autos out there. The Z is one I think. I am only saying, don't be surprised that the grass always looks greener on the other side and it usually isn't. You don't know what you got till it's gone. Every rose has its thorns and every garden has some weeds. Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you react to it. The throttle and steering wheel work real good and that is what I bought. If this were an Audi A8 or BMW 745 I may have some trouble accepting rattles but the price you pay for this car is for the performance and looks which aren't half bad, you know. Just MO.

 

"You don't know what you've got till its gone". Copyright infringement?

I would have to agree with you, sometimes the car is absolutely thrilling, like a 4 wheel jet. Then I run into a stretch of road that shakes my entire body and its painful, literally. It galls me to HAVE to change the struts to improve the ride NOW. I usually do that on a car when it has 30,000 miles on it and I am freshening it up.

Paying $2000 more to make the car right may be common for a lot of people, but its a new, very irritating experience for me and my $35K car is no longer such a bargain. Whatever, I will probably fork over the extra $ to improve the ride, when the struts of my choice come out.

 

Oh I thought that was just a popular saying! Who has copyright? Anyways, I agree that you shouldn't have to change something about a car to make it right. But, it is the "baseline" so to speak from the factory. Sort of a compromised ride for better handling. A medium rating of each. I want to make the car handle as good as I can (for less than a certain dollar amount) and want to change the parts to do that. Some might want a more comfy ride and change to parts that allow that. To me, this would oppose the purpose of the Z. I don't think it has ever been known for it's cushy ride. I beleive in specialization. Everything is better with it. Compromises just give up too much to make something good out of anything. So yes, the Z's ride is a compromise, which, I think, would be expected from the factory. Specialize it and handle great or dedicate it to comfort. I want to specialize the Z for performance and get another car like an A4 or something for the comfortable cruising (lots of problems to put up with there too, ). To try and do both with the Z is only asking for frustration and mediocre results, IMO.

 

Paved Paradise and put up a parking lot? Joni Mitchell

Thats why I will buy premium adjustable struts. Koni or Tokiko will provide the rebound control I need along with a very firm ride. You do not need a car that handles like a buckboard to get max performance, BMW remember? The M5 has incredible handling w/o a punishing ride, my 91 Mr2 Turbo did too and rode as smooth as silk on stock struts. IMO, the Z is set up to feel like its on its tiptoes at all times and gives the impression it will eat anything on the road, track or drag strip. The payoff is a harsh ride over many surfaces I drive over every day, so a change is in order for me; and, the handling will NOT be compromised. On public roads, bouncing and crashing along are not the fastest way through a curve, having a suspension that takes bad pavement in stride is faster, IMO.

 

I'm done with this car now, but one last post. It is amazing to me that so many guys think that it is acceptable to blow off the complaints and concerns of those of us who have had ongoing problems by simply saying things like "You must not know how to drive a manual transmission", or "It's just normal first year problems", or "You drive it like a sports car and wonder why the transmission fails". Comments like that are the mark of a dumb-*** in denial. I am quite certain that most of the failures we are dealing with were either known or predicted by engineers at Nissan, but were summarily blown off with a statement along the lines of "low probablity of occurance". I hope you guys have fun with your cars, but as far as I'm concerned these things are an example of what can actually go wrong when a sedan company attempts the development of an aggresively designed perfomance car. Unlike the morons who like to feel self important and minimize the problems I and others like me have experienced, I have enough technical expertise to actually know what I'm talking about. Next time, I don't think I'll let emotion drive me to purchase a "cheap" sports car. I'll buy the Porsche instead. So enjoy your cars until you actually run enough miles to have the problems start on yours. Then we'll see how loyal you are to the Z.

 

I'm at 12K. No probs. streak fixed. Happy camper.

 

Oh, Nissan won't get away with their inattention much longer. Road and Track is probably the most respected sports car mag out there and they have punched a small hole in the Z. Harsh ride, too noisy, some editors won't drive it any more because of those characteristics. If it happens some more and it will, Nissan's star will lose its luster if they fail to respond then. I will read the signs and if devaluation starts, I'll lose it fast. I like Toyota/Lexus and Honda/Acura too.

 

Hah yeah! I only got the Z because we have a Nissan dealership but not a Honda dealership. I was ready to get the S2000 but just got too sweet of a deal on a Z. Anyways, smcgee, all the technical knowledge of the problems you have won't erase the fact that it is better to enjoy life than to fret over its technicalities. The things you own end up owning you. (Copyright - Fight Club? )

 

Ah, yes. Schizophrenic apocalyptic dream, a candidate for the forensic unit in our Mental Health system. Amorality, sociopathic and really good. Best line: Wow, I haven't been f...ed like that since grade school! Not for the faint of heart.

Just drive the damn car, don't borrow trouble by futuristic nightmares.