E36 M3 vs G35 Coupe VIDEOS!!!
03-13-2003, 07:33 AM
#22
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wierd. I raced an e36 m3 the other day from a light and I was about a car length and a half in front of him by 65 mph. I didn't realize the G35 auto was that much slower than the 350Z 6 speed...or maybe I was just the better driver??
03-13-2003, 10:27 AM
#23
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Originally posted by SCOTTYCS
350Z33: Dynopack Chasis Dyno, can't remember what gear we used in the Z.
350Z33: Dynopack Chasis Dyno, can't remember what gear we used in the Z.
03-13-2003, 03:45 PM
#24
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Originally posted by zeroday
wierd. I raced an e36 m3 the other day from a light and I was about a car length and a half in front of him by 65 mph. I didn't realize the G35 auto was that much slower than the 350Z 6 speed...or maybe I was just the better driver??
wierd. I raced an e36 m3 the other day from a light and I was about a car length and a half in front of him by 65 mph. I didn't realize the G35 auto was that much slower than the 350Z 6 speed...or maybe I was just the better driver??
it was prolly the car..
i dont think a g35 coupe auto can hang with a Z with a 6mt
03-13-2003, 06:37 PM
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Zs tend to dyno all over the place, not sure what causes it. My friend dyno'd 244whp and 245tq on the same Dynojet that another Z dynod 226whp and 232tq... who knows.
03-13-2003, 09:19 PM
#26
Originally posted by SCOTTYCS
Uh NO. This is the key reason Mercedes does not make a manual. Mercedes has tested many of the cars with a manual (E55, etc.) and the cars were SLOWER.
350Z33: Dynopack Chasis Dyno, can't remember what gear we used in the Z.
Uh NO. This is the key reason Mercedes does not make a manual. Mercedes has tested many of the cars with a manual (E55, etc.) and the cars were SLOWER.
350Z33: Dynopack Chasis Dyno, can't remember what gear we used in the Z.
btw, dynopacks over rate HP and are MUCH less accurate then dynojets.
03-13-2003, 09:20 PM
#27
Originally posted by zeroday
wierd. I raced an e36 m3 the other day from a light and I was about a car length and a half in front of him by 65 mph. I didn't realize the G35 auto was that much slower than the 350Z 6 speed...or maybe I was just the better driver??
wierd. I raced an e36 m3 the other day from a light and I was about a car length and a half in front of him by 65 mph. I didn't realize the G35 auto was that much slower than the 350Z 6 speed...or maybe I was just the better driver??
03-14-2003, 06:24 AM
#28
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I am sure you know all the specs. That is why the board members who dynoed at my shop are saying it is "stingy".
One Z with injen intake was pulling 231 whp. The other with a removed resonator was pulling 236 whp. Sounds over-rated to me.
And THEY ARE MUCH MORE ACCURATE. Please stop talking while you are still ahead, before I make an *** of you.
One Z with injen intake was pulling 231 whp. The other with a removed resonator was pulling 236 whp. Sounds over-rated to me.
And THEY ARE MUCH MORE ACCURATE. Please stop talking while you are still ahead, before I make an *** of you.
Originally posted by rodH
btw, dynopacks over rate HP and are MUCH less accurate then dynojets.
btw, dynopacks over rate HP and are MUCH less accurate then dynojets.
03-14-2003, 06:27 AM
#29
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No entirely true. It is one of the reason, the other reason is that they were consitintly slower than the auto counterparts. Please talk about subjects you know something about (i.e. not mb, dynos). My best friend has a 190-2.3 16V, i know all about the car.
Originally posted by rodH
ACTUALLY the reason MB doesn't do a manual is b/c the US market for a manual in a MB has been estimated to be very very little (in demand that is). It has NOTHING to do with the E55 being slower or NOT. There have been a few sticks come to the states (my dad had a 190-2.3 16V that was a stick), but the demand is very low. Again it has NOTHING to do with the 55.
btw, dynopacks over rate HP and are MUCH less accurate then dynojets.
ACTUALLY the reason MB doesn't do a manual is b/c the US market for a manual in a MB has been estimated to be very very little (in demand that is). It has NOTHING to do with the E55 being slower or NOT. There have been a few sticks come to the states (my dad had a 190-2.3 16V that was a stick), but the demand is very low. Again it has NOTHING to do with the 55.
btw, dynopacks over rate HP and are MUCH less accurate then dynojets.
03-14-2003, 06:40 AM
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Considering equal drivers and bone stock cars, which car do you guys feel and/or know is faster in the 1/4, the e36 m3 or the Z 6spd. Even though I beat an e36 already, I submit it's possible the driver could have gotten a bad launch or just plain sucked at driving etc. Timeslips??
03-14-2003, 08:07 AM
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another dynapack vs dynojet pissing match....
i've done this so many times now, that is just isn't as fun anymore, but here goes.
dynojets are less accurate and more generous with numbers than a dynapack or even mustange dyno. this is because of the 3000lb drum that has to be rolled by the vehicle to obtain power measurements. the flywheel effect of this large mass makes a few extra hp as the effort needed to spin the drum becomes less and less the faster it goes.
other factors to take into consideration are these. if the vehicle is not lined up properly on the rollers, it will greatly skew the results by adding imaginary hp to the vehicle. also, the calibration of the units will effect the way the dynojet registers the numbers.
and finally, the way the dynojet measures power is flawed. they measure acceleration over time to calculate horsepower. they then take this number and correct it back to find a torque figure by correlating it with engine rpm. everyone knows that hp is just a function of torque, so it's odd that they make torque a function of hp.
on a dynapack, the machine measures actual torque. the work that the vehicle is doing to overcome the load being applied at that given time. since there is no additional mass to spin, the readings are much more accurate as the dynapack can measure the amount of load being applied to the axles and calculate work done by those numbers. this is then translated to a hp figure, which has less than 1% deviation from what a dynojet will report.
we have had several examples of this from various cars.
vehicle/dynojet 248c/dynapack
jetta 1.8t/192/190
vortech sc mustang cobra/405/402
bmw e36 m3's/200-210/200-210 (we've done at least 20 of these)
350z/225-240/231-237 (the two we did during the dyno day)
civic si/125-135/130-132 (we've done 10 of these)
we have many more examples too, if you care to see the charts.
the peak hp numbers are on par with the dynojet, but what about accuracy for the rest of the graph? the dynapack is repeatable to .1% and sensitive enough to register a load from the alternator during steady state dynoing. steady state is where we load up the vehicle so it maintains a certain engine speed regardless of throttle position. this is great for tuning because you can see what is happening with the vehicle when you add more fuel, advance ignition, etc, etc.
also, you don't need to worry about tire slip or spin on rollers, which can also skew the numbers on a dynojet as rolling resistance changes as the tires get warm.
dynapacks also don't need any calibration over inputing gear ratios, and the gear ratios are only used to determine proper wheel torque, but hp will always be correct. to get good dynojet results, you need a experience dynojet operator and a properly calibrated machine. note: the newer dynojets have self calibration, but most of the units out there are the older ones that need manual calibration.
also, check this out as far as the consistency of a dynojet.
http://www.factorypro.com/magazine/m...ojet_dyno.html
please don't throw unsubstantiated information out there as fact, because to do so is pure ignorance. i did over a month of research before i decided on a dynapack over a dynojet. and just about all the tuners in japan use dynapack. you buy their cars but don't trust their choice in chassis dynos?
and no, a dynapack doesn't cost less than a dynojet (a lot more actually) so i didn't just just buy the cheap one.
dynojets are less accurate and more generous with numbers than a dynapack or even mustange dyno. this is because of the 3000lb drum that has to be rolled by the vehicle to obtain power measurements. the flywheel effect of this large mass makes a few extra hp as the effort needed to spin the drum becomes less and less the faster it goes.
other factors to take into consideration are these. if the vehicle is not lined up properly on the rollers, it will greatly skew the results by adding imaginary hp to the vehicle. also, the calibration of the units will effect the way the dynojet registers the numbers.
and finally, the way the dynojet measures power is flawed. they measure acceleration over time to calculate horsepower. they then take this number and correct it back to find a torque figure by correlating it with engine rpm. everyone knows that hp is just a function of torque, so it's odd that they make torque a function of hp.
on a dynapack, the machine measures actual torque. the work that the vehicle is doing to overcome the load being applied at that given time. since there is no additional mass to spin, the readings are much more accurate as the dynapack can measure the amount of load being applied to the axles and calculate work done by those numbers. this is then translated to a hp figure, which has less than 1% deviation from what a dynojet will report.
we have had several examples of this from various cars.
vehicle/dynojet 248c/dynapack
jetta 1.8t/192/190
vortech sc mustang cobra/405/402
bmw e36 m3's/200-210/200-210 (we've done at least 20 of these)
350z/225-240/231-237 (the two we did during the dyno day)
civic si/125-135/130-132 (we've done 10 of these)
we have many more examples too, if you care to see the charts.
the peak hp numbers are on par with the dynojet, but what about accuracy for the rest of the graph? the dynapack is repeatable to .1% and sensitive enough to register a load from the alternator during steady state dynoing. steady state is where we load up the vehicle so it maintains a certain engine speed regardless of throttle position. this is great for tuning because you can see what is happening with the vehicle when you add more fuel, advance ignition, etc, etc.
also, you don't need to worry about tire slip or spin on rollers, which can also skew the numbers on a dynojet as rolling resistance changes as the tires get warm.
dynapacks also don't need any calibration over inputing gear ratios, and the gear ratios are only used to determine proper wheel torque, but hp will always be correct. to get good dynojet results, you need a experience dynojet operator and a properly calibrated machine. note: the newer dynojets have self calibration, but most of the units out there are the older ones that need manual calibration.
also, check this out as far as the consistency of a dynojet.
http://www.factorypro.com/magazine/m...ojet_dyno.html
please don't throw unsubstantiated information out there as fact, because to do so is pure ignorance. i did over a month of research before i decided on a dynapack over a dynojet. and just about all the tuners in japan use dynapack. you buy their cars but don't trust their choice in chassis dynos?
and no, a dynapack doesn't cost less than a dynojet (a lot more actually) so i didn't just just buy the cheap one.
03-14-2003, 11:34 AM
#35
Don’t start this $hit over here too. GO troll some where else.
Everyone here knows I am nice cordial person, especially on the boards. That’s just me . . .but you are starting to **** me off.
I have never seen someone as annoying and persistent as SCOTTYCS on any board. I cant wait till someone in a 350Z hands him his A$$ in a street race (what do you want to bet we wont hear about it unless its one of us who does it). How bout some video of you in your car. How bout some dyno numbers. How bout some weight figures. Put up or shut up. Until you have proof, your trolling on our home ground earns you nothing. Notice I don’t claim I can beat you because I don’t know. But expect that the first time someone in a 350Z beats you, you will be called out on ALL 350Z forums and the BMW forums that now seem to come second to your new found home on our forums.
If you want to go pick on the G35 forums and post your videos there go ahead. This is a 350Z forum. Next time bring videos of 350Z's and don’t forget to mention the mods the M3's have when the win or lose the race. We will find out regardless.
Cheers!
Everyone here knows I am nice cordial person, especially on the boards. That’s just me . . .but you are starting to **** me off.
I have never seen someone as annoying and persistent as SCOTTYCS on any board. I cant wait till someone in a 350Z hands him his A$$ in a street race (what do you want to bet we wont hear about it unless its one of us who does it). How bout some video of you in your car. How bout some dyno numbers. How bout some weight figures. Put up or shut up. Until you have proof, your trolling on our home ground earns you nothing. Notice I don’t claim I can beat you because I don’t know. But expect that the first time someone in a 350Z beats you, you will be called out on ALL 350Z forums and the BMW forums that now seem to come second to your new found home on our forums.
If you want to go pick on the G35 forums and post your videos there go ahead. This is a 350Z forum. Next time bring videos of 350Z's and don’t forget to mention the mods the M3's have when the win or lose the race. We will find out regardless.
Cheers!
03-14-2003, 11:34 AM
#36
Originally posted by SCOTTYCS
rodH ->
rodH ->
I agree with you about the times between the E36 and the Z, my dad use to have a E36 with Dinan chip, intake, and exhaust. he blew a valve so he had head work done on it at that time as well, when the motor was "open". I really feel like the Z and his car (moded) are very similar in many ways.
The E36 is/was a GREAT value and an awesome car.
03-14-2003, 12:04 PM
#38
Registered User
Originally posted by SCOTTYCS
VandyZ
Put up what. I would make a video, but no Zs are willing to. You want a video of me in my car doing what? What other proof do you need. Meet me at windy gap and I will be willing to make a vid of both of cars.
RodH, dynapack is the way to go
VandyZ
Put up what. I would make a video, but no Zs are willing to. You want a video of me in my car doing what? What other proof do you need. Meet me at windy gap and I will be willing to make a vid of both of cars.RodH, dynapack is the way to go
Where's your #s???
fyi - read about an autox this weekend where an E36 and 350Z on race compounds raced... 350Z had him by a second.
more so a 350z and an E46 had it out... both on street compounds... again the 350Z by two seconds.
Whats wrong with these ULTIMATE driving machines???? VERY experienced drivers were in the BMWs...
03-14-2003, 12:48 PM
#39
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Dude 
I didn't change the subject. I told him where to meet me if he wants to get some footage.
FYI - I read about an auto x where a stock Toyota tercel beat a Lamborghini Diablo by 10 sec in an auto X. What does that tell you? The real question is, what is wrong with you?
Here is a short vid for you. I don't have any on the road.
http://www.eurospeedperformance.com/Videos/chris.mpg
I will have the car on the dyno this week again. When I get the chart I will post it up for you all to see.
You guys are funny, keep up the good work
I didn't change the subject. I told him where to meet me if he wants to get some footage. FYI - I read about an auto x where a stock Toyota tercel beat a Lamborghini Diablo by 10 sec in an auto X. What does that tell you? The real question is, what is wrong with you?
Here is a short vid for you. I don't have any on the road.
http://www.eurospeedperformance.com/Videos/chris.mpg
I will have the car on the dyno this week again. When I get the chart I will post it up for you all to see.
You guys are funny, keep up the good work