Got It Tuned, Na 2003
05-09-2008, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by dave3529
The weather doesn't affect it, does evey time but maybe its pulling timing? It is very noticeable. If I floor it from a stop it won't even chirp the tires, it just kinda rolls forward as if it was 15-20% throttle then once it hits about 4k rpms it takes off like a bat outta hell, (fast). Any ideas?
05-09-2008, 08:22 PM
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I'm not sure how to data log but i'm sure i can figure it out. But also you remember my solid engine brace, and how you said it could make the utec pull a false knock code. Well I pulled it off tonight and drove it and it did seem much much better, but it was raining so all i was doing was spinning but I will definitely test it tommarrow and let you know if that solves it.
05-09-2008, 09:25 PM
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Originally Posted by dave3529
I'm not sure how to data log but i'm sure i can figure it out. But also you remember my solid engine brace, and how you said it could make the utec pull a false knock code. Well I pulled it off tonight and drove it and it did seem much much better, but it was raining so all i was doing was spinning but I will definitely test it tommarrow and let you know if that solves it.
If you have a wideband and want to integrate your A/F with Utec then you can download a trial version of the MPS software http://www.mpsav.com/MPSUTECLogger/M...r_Download.htm
05-10-2008, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by UpRev
Thats CAPTAIN Obvious to you sir. 
I just try and point that stuff out because too many people think Dyno numbers are serious business. You know better so I'll let it be. You do have some good questions though and it would be good information to post so that others know what they are in for when/if they should go to that tuner. I'm also kind of interested on the true loss of the Auto on these cars. Maybe next time we do a push on newer cars we'll try and get that info from our data, would make for interesting comparisons.
I just try and point that stuff out because too many people think Dyno numbers are serious business. You know better so I'll let it be. You do have some good questions though and it would be good information to post so that others know what they are in for when/if they should go to that tuner. I'm also kind of interested on the true loss of the Auto on these cars. Maybe next time we do a push on newer cars we'll try and get that info from our data, would make for interesting comparisons.
I didn't expect the AT loss to be so low but I guess in a static gear situation, on a dyno, that makes sense.
05-10-2008, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Julian@MRC
Sorry for forgetting to respond to you..And I appologize for UpRev trying to answer a question asked to me...I will respond now.
What we tend to find on the N/A 350Z is that test pipes,exhausts and plenums will make power, when combined...When you begin to introduce more bolt ons like headers and intakes,cams Ect..The stock ECU can not compensate properly for the Airflow under WOT. Thus robbing the car of added HP it should have seen..Plus we all know how honest parts manufacturers are when they claim HP gains on their products..
The OPS car asctually had a decent A/F but the car went super rich when the trottle was initially mashed. We leaned it out, smoothed the curve and added some timing and put in power he lost with the addition of the headers and then some.
Also keep in mind the OP's car has fairly high mileage on it, and is a 2003 the lower HP on the baseline may have been a combination of several factors..The only thing one needs ot take into account is the before tune and post tune and the gains that day on that dyno...
Comparing Dyno to dyno is useless..
What we tend to find on the N/A 350Z is that test pipes,exhausts and plenums will make power, when combined...When you begin to introduce more bolt ons like headers and intakes,cams Ect..The stock ECU can not compensate properly for the Airflow under WOT. Thus robbing the car of added HP it should have seen..Plus we all know how honest parts manufacturers are when they claim HP gains on their products..
The OPS car asctually had a decent A/F but the car went super rich when the trottle was initially mashed. We leaned it out, smoothed the curve and added some timing and put in power he lost with the addition of the headers and then some.
Also keep in mind the OP's car has fairly high mileage on it, and is a 2003 the lower HP on the baseline may have been a combination of several factors..The only thing one needs ot take into account is the before tune and post tune and the gains that day on that dyno...
Comparing Dyno to dyno is useless..
You confirm a suspicion I've seen borne out on my other Nissans, the I/H/E opening up the airflow only works so well with any stock ECU, and even less well w/o cams, etc. And, if you don't use the combination, the individual mods will just at best post modest gains. That's what I really see here, is the before/after gains through the tune, the before being somewhat modest despite a lot of good mods.
It has always amazed me how many $$$ people will spend on bolt-ons w/o addressing their tune, as if somehow they expect their stock EM to just be magic. Nissan compensates better in general than some other makes, but also a lot of the stock tune ECU's have tragically flawed problems (like my SR20's and KA24DE's stock ECU's).
Again, nice work, and thanks for taking the time to share your insight.
05-10-2008, 10:51 AM
#27
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Originally Posted by dave3529
I finally got it tuned. I had it done at MRC MOTORSPORTS in NJ and they did a awsome job. The car definitely is quicker and has much much more midrange response. overall worth getting to hold me over until i go FI
keep in mind this is a 2003 automatic with 90k miles
272.9 corrected ( dyno jet#'s )
241.5 (dyno dynamics)
keep in mind this is a 2003 automatic with 90k miles
272.9 corrected ( dyno jet#'s )
241.5 (dyno dynamics)
Strange that the Dyno Dynamics printout doesn't even mention that it's some kind of DynoJet up-conversion. That's confusing.
I would think the Dyno Dynamics company would get in trouble (be sued) for creating something like this.
Glad you're happy with your car though. That's the most important thing.
05-10-2008, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by __jb
I don't understand how you got a Dyno Dynamics print out with two numbers? Does a Dyno Dynamics dyno have the capability to calculate DynoJet numbers somehow?
Strange that the Dyno Dynamics printout doesn't even mention that it's some kind of DynoJet up-conversion. That's confusing.
I would think the Dyno Dynamics company would get in trouble (be sued) for creating something like this.
Glad you're happy with your car though. That's the most important thing.
Strange that the Dyno Dynamics printout doesn't even mention that it's some kind of DynoJet up-conversion. That's confusing.
I would think the Dyno Dynamics company would get in trouble (be sued) for creating something like this.
Glad you're happy with your car though. That's the most important thing.
Lets not turn this into a dyno vs dyno debate...A dyno dynamics dyno has the ability to add a correction factor of any precent to the numbers if the end user chooses..It also allows for "Shoot out mode" which will display calculated flywheel HP.
The correction factor is a percentage, and since Dyno Jet does not have a current US patent on the the word "Percentage"
, the possibilities of a lawsuit is simply not there....We normally see a 13% higher reading on a local dyno jet, therefore to "simulate" for a point of reference for a customer, what his/her car might make on a Dyno Jet or "OTHER" type of dyno, we add 13% to out Dyno Dynamics numbers..
05-10-2008, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by __jb
I don't understand how you got a Dyno Dynamics print out with two numbers? Does a Dyno Dynamics dyno have the capability to calculate DynoJet numbers somehow?
Strange that the Dyno Dynamics printout doesn't even mention that it's some kind of DynoJet up-conversion. That's confusing.
I would think the Dyno Dynamics company would get in trouble (be sued) for creating something like this.
Glad you're happy with your car though. That's the most important thing.
Strange that the Dyno Dynamics printout doesn't even mention that it's some kind of DynoJet up-conversion. That's confusing.
I would think the Dyno Dynamics company would get in trouble (be sued) for creating something like this.
Glad you're happy with your car though. That's the most important thing.
All dyno's use some form of calculation to match the DynoJet numbering. Another reason why dyno numbers are not to be trusted from one brand to another, especially when the base numbers they use are skewed to begin with.
Here is Shawn Church's write up on how he calculates DynoJet (industry standard) numbers from his DynaPack dyno, because the calculations that DynaPack uses are slightly off.
http://home.earthlink.net/~spchurch/...ting/id12.html
05-10-2008, 12:33 PM
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nope the engine brace didn't solve it, but it is worse when it gets hotter out so i will do a data log and see if theres and knocks or anything and let you guys know. But so theres know confusion the tune is still overall very good and i do love the overall performance otherwise. And I greatly appreciate everyones help so far.
05-13-2008, 04:47 PM
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ok guys im confused, I data logged and theres no knocking, but when I first floor it from a stop, the timing goes from 14, 14, -3.4, -4 , 25, 29 , it retards it at right about 1800rpms and then again to 4degs at 4000rpms, but know knocks. any ideas?
05-13-2008, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by dave3529
ok guys im confused, I data logged and theres no knocking, but when I first floor it from a stop, the timing goes from 14, 14, -3.4, -4 , 25, 29 , it retards it at right about 1800rpms and then again to 4degs at 4000rpms, but know knocks. any ideas?
Are you looking at stock ECU Timing and UTEC Timing also??
05-14-2008, 04:21 AM
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My 2003 5 AT made 218 to 221 on dyno jet. Stage 2 stillen on it with headers made 272. Stage 3 made 292. Stage 4 302.
These are good #s for a 5 AT. The headers cost me 10 rwhp.
The drive line loss is around 23 to 24 %.
Going twins soon.
I have never seen a stock 6 mt (2003) dyno over 233 rwhp.
All my #'s where on the same dyno.
These are good #s for a 5 AT. The headers cost me 10 rwhp.
The drive line loss is around 23 to 24 %.
Going twins soon.
I have never seen a stock 6 mt (2003) dyno over 233 rwhp.
All my #'s where on the same dyno.
05-14-2008, 04:30 AM
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Originally Posted by dave3529
just the utec timing
Sales@racemrc.com
But if the issue is right when you floor it and as the car down shifts, this leads me to believe its TQ converter related..
05-14-2008, 03:38 PM
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Hey everyone, i played around with the rpm closed to open loop settings and thats what it was. After fooling around with the crossover point for a while I finally got it perfect. I set the cross over to 2300rpms instead of the 2000rpms it was at and it is perfect now, pulls nice and smooth. Thanks everyone for all your help. And thank you Julian for a great tune and all your help, I will definitely give you a call when i'm ready to go FI
05-14-2008, 08:34 PM
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Originally Posted by dave3529
Hey everyone, i played around with the rpm closed to open loop settings and thats what it was. After fooling around with the crossover point for a while I finally got it perfect. I set the cross over to 2300rpms instead of the 2000rpms it was at and it is perfect now, pulls nice and smooth. Thanks everyone for all your help. And thank you Julian for a great tune and all your help, I will definitely give you a call when i'm ready to go FI
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