The problem with Audi's is they are family cars. I was racing up a mountain with a dozen cars in a race a month ago and my little z came in first, with a barely warm engine. The modded Audi's VW's Hondas etc. were out of commision by the top. 2 overheated and died, and the rest had to open their hoods and cool off for an hour. The skyline gtr which was just behind me was just fine as well.

Cars are built for a purpose. If it's a family car, there's nothing you can do to it that in a real race will compete with a proper sports car. And I'm not about to carry groceries/kids etc. in my sports car, either. It's all about purpose.

You want thrown back in the seat, though, my 500hp 68 charger will do that. The little z is faster all around though. And yes, the suspension has ALOT to do with the feeling of going fast. If you feel like your going fast... that's bad. Sorry.

 

well I think feeling like you're going fast at high speed and in cornering is bad - you want a car that can handle what you throw at it with no sweat and the Z does fairly well at that. It has really good aerodynamics so you don't get the air resistence/noise at high speed like most cars - which is an illusion of going fast. Hell driving a convertable makes you feel like you're going faster than you are cause of all the wind noise and wind blowing around you

it's peak torque is around 4000 rpm's so that's where the most power is usually felt when you punch it.

a car like an STI will throw you back in your seat at launch because of the AWD, then again as soon as you get up into boost - that slight boost lag is an illussion of speed, instead of having lots of power all thru the powerband, the STI has less power down low, then more power up high - which is overall a good thing for performance driving cause you tend to stay high in the rpm's. Just saying that boost lag is kinda an illusion of more power cause it all hits you at once instead of easing you into it


There's lots of ways to make the Z feel like it throws you back in your seat more. Just do some mods. Do some FI or a final drive and aftermarket flywheel and ligher wheels.



I argue with people about turbos and superchargers in the regard of feeling fast vs going fast if they both are running the same HP. In a way, the feeling is more important for the fun factor, but you gotta figure out where you want to compromise

 

sorry but i am tired of you saying "I want it to feel fast". Well, the z is fast.
Did you ever think about the balance and suspension(earlier mentioned) in the z. I used to drive a scion tc and it felt way faster because the balance was 70/30(horrible). That car would jerk everywhere when braking and accelerating; felt fast but wasn't fast.

And what do you want for an interior? The interior is made for what the car represents; just like an evo or an sti. You said that you drive an srt4. Try taking the neon apart and tell me what you think. The way the car is put together is so laughable. The z is exactually the way it should be. Most highter priced car's interior are the same material used in the z; it's just dressed up to appear more luxurious. And you know what, this is not a luxury car.

Recently, a customer saw my car and like it. But then, looking like he was sucking on lemon, he said "I was going to buy one, but I didn't like the bumpiness". And you know what, he bought a jetta. What kind of person would not buy a z because of the bumpy ride. Give me a break. Either sports cars are not for him or the z was too much money for him. As goes to all, sports cars are not for everybody. If you want comfort, buy a caddy. If you want value, buy a civic, accord, or scion. If you want luxury, buy a lexus, benz, or bmw. But if you want addrenaline, speed, looks, and the want to drive again after turning the ignition off, buy a z.

 

+1 amen

 

I want decent materials, not hard plastics in a 30k car. If i shouldn't care about the interior of a car i'd buy an EVO RS and do 0-60 in 4.4 seconds and embarass Z's on road courses, in the rain, snow, or any other race. It's designed well, there is just no getting around that materials used are crap.

I've taken my neon apart a few times, and everything fits perfectly. I have no rattles and the interior is as good as the day i bought it (44.4k miles ago). Unlike some Z's I've heard stories about where the door handle comes off at 10k miles LOL. Or the rattling...

 

I'll agree with you on "faster" than a Z, or STi, or EVO, or SRT4, w/o regard to "feeling fast," if you start looking at cars w/over 400 hp AND tq at the crank, and BOTH well over 300 at the rear wheels, with almost all of that available by 2k rpm. In that league, whether or not the car, whatever it is, "feels" faster than the Z or not really doesn't matter, b/c it IS, but it also costs more. But FWIW, I think the "feeling" hypnoZ seeks is coming not just from hp, or even max tq, but for TONS of tq avail LOW in the rpm range, i.e., an American V-8 or blown V-6 w/little or no lag.

OTOH, while I've agreed with a lot of what you've posted up to this point, I think you will struggle to find any remotely objective and knowledgable opinion, from Car & Driver to Consumer Reports, to say that the SRT, quick and nimble though it is, is either more rattle-free or has a more well-made interior than the Z, even with the Zs shortcomings. If you argue that the designers saved some money on the interior and put it elsewhere, I'd agree, but the SRT is not as well made on the inside. I've been in 'em.

And as for all the b****ing on this forum about all the problems w/things that break, squeaks and rattles, keep in mind that on any forum, including those for reliable Hondas (I've owned an S2000, so check out S2KI.com if you don't believe me) have a lot more posts about every little annoying thing about the car. You'll see very few posts like, "Another trouble-free day of driving my Z!"

 

hold on a sec.. the Z is a fast car, one of the best engines in its class, if not THE best... the fact that it doesnt respond too well to aftermarket parts is an indication of that, to me its like a barebone sports car where the rest is up to the imagination and wealth of the owner.

and yes, the STi and EVO come with more out of the box, but put a turbo in and lighten up the body a bit and ur near invincible... no EVO or STi can keep up with u after that in street or track.. interior is arbitrary, wutever u feel comfortable in then wutever. to each his own as anyone would say

but regardless the Z comes in a great package, like ive said in other posts wut ur payin for isnt the quality of of the interior or exterior but the engine and overall handling.. all of those racing games that feature the Z on its cover cant be wrong can they? =P

 

No it has a chip, modded stock intake box, and Cat-back exhaust. He put down 242awhp at DynoComp. Thing is killer off the line, and has EXTREMELY good low-end torque due to the TT setup. I mean like V8 low-end torque... it's good for everyday driving.

 

Youre bashing the interior of the z and then you talk about how well made your dodge neon interior is. okay.

 

Oh, don't get me wrong! The SRT-4 tupperwear interior is heaping pile of crap. No doubt about it, but it works just fine for what the car is. Like the EVO's interior.... nearly as horrible as my SRT-4's just a slightly better design. And I haven't had a rattle.

I also think you may be right about what i'm talking about.... however i think maybe T/C may of been on or it was a factory slug. Who knows, i'll just try another test drive.

And guys, i'm not trying to attack your cars it's just i was dissappointed with power delivery and interior material quality. Other than that, i think this is a great car. Very stylish, excellent handling (and ride quality considering), steering, braking, and clutch/shifter feel.

 

Not the way I see it. Seems like they nearly maxed out the HP in stock form, leaving very little room to modify and make good HP unless you want to spend 4k+.

Your comment on no EVO or STi being able to keep up is rediculous. There are 650whp+ EVO's, and they are the best handling sedan in the world STOCK. I would bet my money on a full road course race car EVO than a race car Z. Either way, that isn't what this thread is about....

And you are right, the Z is a good overall package, but maybe i'd rather sacrifice some looks for some more power...

 

All I said was that my interior is fine... no rattles, nothing falling off or anything and that is a bit different than what i've been hearing about the Z's interior from some members of this board. Could just be overexagerated as the people who don't have problems dont post about not having problems.

 

of course there will be posts on things falling apart on this forum. believe me, there is no perfect car. but how many memebers are their on this forum. i bet there is only .5% who has problems. and when there is one problem, it will appear as if all the z's have the same problem. my car is an 03 and is awesome. interior is not "cheap" material as you mentioned. you call it cheap when the neon feels like rubbermade. go ahead, take the two appart and make a comparison. earlier, you said that you took the neon apart and everythings seemed fine, but i don't believe you. the material is the same as in saturns, and kia's; or at least it feels the same. you either did not take it apart or just don't know how to justify good material from bad material.

and rattles are something that have to be expected with all cars. some z's will have them, and some won't. just the other day, i drove an 04 E500 and was rattleing like crazy. you're lucky that your neon dosen 't rattle. i can't remember the last time i rode in one that was rattle-free; and that goes for all dodge cars.

i hope that you don't buy a z. this car deserves a driver who appreciates its ability, culture, history, and beauty. and for a final thought, it don't matter what car you buy, there will always be a faster one.

 

well the thing i wanted to emphasize was that stock for stock the three cars are nearly even, stick a turbo in a Z and the other 2 will fall behind. i jus wanted to put them all on the same platform so to speak (engine+turbo) while leaving everything else stock... but of course this would never happen =P

yes, theres very little extra u can do by way of engine work and intake but with a lot of money u can transform it into something pretty crazy =P i guess any car would fit that category hehe, but thats jus me i like the Z alot

 

Bottom line, just about everyone who owns a Z loves it. I personally recommend the 2005 models and up. The 2006 interior is tweaked even more, and looks very nice. I believe the 2003 models have the real plastic looking interior. The 2004.5 models and up have the euro-tune suspension that really cuts down on the 'bounciness' of previous models. It all depends on what you are looking for. If you want a rocket that's short on style, go with the evo, sti, etc. Those are a good 5k more than a base model Z. Every car has some issues, and you only hear the bad stuff on the boards. So if the Z doesn't sit well with you, get something else....we like to keep the Z exclusive.

 

The seating position will also "prevent" you from being thrown back. Which is a good thing. My max throws me back but I'm sitting more up right ....

The Z is a great total package as many have said, there will be more cheap faster cars hitting the road soon.

The SRT$ and

 

So you'd rather have a hopped up shitty family sedan than a 2 seat sports car? Suit yourself. I don't care what numbers it has...it's still a family sedan on steroids. I'd rather not Paul Walker, and try something unique.

And best handling sedan? Have you ever heard of the Audi RS4? BMW M3/5?

 

You'd rather try something unique? Like buying the best selling sports car, which has sold over 100,000 units in the US alone?

And I have heard of the RS4 and the M5... the M3 is a coupe genius (EVO still has better handling either way).

The RS4 has tons of understeer, and the M5 doesn't even compare handling-wise.... it's a boat.

And no, i wouldn't necessarily take an EVO over a Z. Just using the logic, "who gives a crap about interior stuff, this is a sports car" if i went by that, i would take an EVO over a Z.

 

How can you say the M3, which WAS in sedan form, or the M5 handle worse than the Evo? Are you aware that the M3 is in the top 5 handling cars in stock form (for a reasonable price, of course!). The M3>Evo.

And if you see more 350z's than Evos, you must be out of your mind. I see, roughly, 5 Evo's today. I average 1 or 2 Z's a day, and one of those is the one in my garage.

 

They are not in the top 5 best handling cars in stock form. You are completely false. They are great handling cars, with luxury and class, but are not to par with an 05 EVO 8 or 06 EVO 9. You must not know that much about EVO's.

There are plenty of exotics that would destroy an m3/m5. Lotus has 2 by itself that would run circles around an m3 or m5.