2009 Z getting N/A VQ37VHR
01-16-2008, 02:16 AM
#41
Nissan just needs to figure out how to fit the VVEL system on the exhaust cam side as well. Right now the VQ37 intake duration and lift is variable but the exhaust cam is still static, so any aggressive profile the intake cam becomes, the power output is limited by the profile of the exhaust cam. A future VQ evolution where VVEL was on both intake and exhaust sides, would mean some serious horsepower figures.
Just from some basic VQ35HR dynos, typically the engine hits peak torque between 4000-5000rpm, drops about 10-20ftlbs up to 6000rpm, and by redline its dropped about 50-60ftlbs from its value @ 4000-5000rpm.
Some theoretical figures:
VQ35HR
306hp @ 6800rpm = 236ftlbs @ 6800rpm
268ftlbs @ 4800rpm
Drops 32ftlbs frmo 4800rpm to 6800rpm, by 7500rpm the torque is down to around 200-205ftlbs.
With a new VVEL system for intake and exhaust cams, if the torque can be maintained to stay within 20-25ftlbs of peak torque. So if torque at 7500rpm could be around 240ftlbs, that would equate to a HP value of 340hp @ 7500rpm. If the new VQ revs up to 8000rpm instead, the same 240ftlbs of torque @ 8000rpm equates to 365hp @ 8000rpm. This is assuming a 3.5L engine with VVEL on both sides.
Even the VQ37 loses about 35ftlbs from peak torque RPM to redline. 270ftlbs @ 5200 rpm, down to 247ftlbs @ 7000 and down to about 235ftlbs @ 7500rpm. If the VQ37 could maintain about 250ftlbs to redline, it would peak at 357hp @ 7500rpm. Stock specs are 330hp @ 7000rpm. Then if the engine held it to 8000rpm, it would be 380hp @ 8000rpm.
The 380RS uses a standard VQ35HR longblock, with increased displacement to 3.8L. 350hp for non race, and 400hp for race motors. Compare that to the theoretical outputs of a future VQ37, and the numbers fall pretty close.
All these numbers are an idealized situation, but it draws a picture of what kind of power increase from the same size motor a new Z could be looking at with an evolution of the current VVEL system.
TK
Just from some basic VQ35HR dynos, typically the engine hits peak torque between 4000-5000rpm, drops about 10-20ftlbs up to 6000rpm, and by redline its dropped about 50-60ftlbs from its value @ 4000-5000rpm.
Some theoretical figures:
VQ35HR
306hp @ 6800rpm = 236ftlbs @ 6800rpm
268ftlbs @ 4800rpm
Drops 32ftlbs frmo 4800rpm to 6800rpm, by 7500rpm the torque is down to around 200-205ftlbs.
With a new VVEL system for intake and exhaust cams, if the torque can be maintained to stay within 20-25ftlbs of peak torque. So if torque at 7500rpm could be around 240ftlbs, that would equate to a HP value of 340hp @ 7500rpm. If the new VQ revs up to 8000rpm instead, the same 240ftlbs of torque @ 8000rpm equates to 365hp @ 8000rpm. This is assuming a 3.5L engine with VVEL on both sides.
Even the VQ37 loses about 35ftlbs from peak torque RPM to redline. 270ftlbs @ 5200 rpm, down to 247ftlbs @ 7000 and down to about 235ftlbs @ 7500rpm. If the VQ37 could maintain about 250ftlbs to redline, it would peak at 357hp @ 7500rpm. Stock specs are 330hp @ 7000rpm. Then if the engine held it to 8000rpm, it would be 380hp @ 8000rpm.
The 380RS uses a standard VQ35HR longblock, with increased displacement to 3.8L. 350hp for non race, and 400hp for race motors. Compare that to the theoretical outputs of a future VQ37, and the numbers fall pretty close.
All these numbers are an idealized situation, but it draws a picture of what kind of power increase from the same size motor a new Z could be looking at with an evolution of the current VVEL system.
TK
Last edited by T_K; 01-16-2008 at 02:38 AM.
01-20-2008, 02:42 PM
#42
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Originally Posted by T_K
Nissan just needs to figure out how to fit the VVEL system on the exhaust cam side as well. Right now the VQ37 intake duration and lift is variable but the exhaust cam is still static, so any aggressive profile the intake cam becomes, the power output is limited by the profile of the exhaust cam. A future VQ evolution where VVEL was on both intake and exhaust sides, would mean some serious horsepower figures.
Just from some basic VQ35HR dynos, typically the engine hits peak torque between 4000-5000rpm, drops about 10-20ftlbs up to 6000rpm, and by redline its dropped about 50-60ftlbs from its value @ 4000-5000rpm.
Some theoretical figures:
VQ35HR
306hp @ 6800rpm = 236ftlbs @ 6800rpm
268ftlbs @ 4800rpm
Drops 32ftlbs frmo 4800rpm to 6800rpm, by 7500rpm the torque is down to around 200-205ftlbs.
With a new VVEL system for intake and exhaust cams, if the torque can be maintained to stay within 20-25ftlbs of peak torque. So if torque at 7500rpm could be around 240ftlbs, that would equate to a HP value of 340hp @ 7500rpm. If the new VQ revs up to 8000rpm instead, the same 240ftlbs of torque @ 8000rpm equates to 365hp @ 8000rpm. This is assuming a 3.5L engine with VVEL on both sides.
Even the VQ37 loses about 35ftlbs from peak torque RPM to redline. 270ftlbs @ 5200 rpm, down to 247ftlbs @ 7000 and down to about 235ftlbs @ 7500rpm. If the VQ37 could maintain about 250ftlbs to redline, it would peak at 357hp @ 7500rpm. Stock specs are 330hp @ 7000rpm. Then if the engine held it to 8000rpm, it would be 380hp @ 8000rpm.
The 380RS uses a standard VQ35HR longblock, with increased displacement to 3.8L. 350hp for non race, and 400hp for race motors. Compare that to the theoretical outputs of a future VQ37, and the numbers fall pretty close.
All these numbers are an idealized situation, but it draws a picture of what kind of power increase from the same size motor a new Z could be looking at with an evolution of the current VVEL system.
TK
Just from some basic VQ35HR dynos, typically the engine hits peak torque between 4000-5000rpm, drops about 10-20ftlbs up to 6000rpm, and by redline its dropped about 50-60ftlbs from its value @ 4000-5000rpm.
Some theoretical figures:
VQ35HR
306hp @ 6800rpm = 236ftlbs @ 6800rpm
268ftlbs @ 4800rpm
Drops 32ftlbs frmo 4800rpm to 6800rpm, by 7500rpm the torque is down to around 200-205ftlbs.
With a new VVEL system for intake and exhaust cams, if the torque can be maintained to stay within 20-25ftlbs of peak torque. So if torque at 7500rpm could be around 240ftlbs, that would equate to a HP value of 340hp @ 7500rpm. If the new VQ revs up to 8000rpm instead, the same 240ftlbs of torque @ 8000rpm equates to 365hp @ 8000rpm. This is assuming a 3.5L engine with VVEL on both sides.
Even the VQ37 loses about 35ftlbs from peak torque RPM to redline. 270ftlbs @ 5200 rpm, down to 247ftlbs @ 7000 and down to about 235ftlbs @ 7500rpm. If the VQ37 could maintain about 250ftlbs to redline, it would peak at 357hp @ 7500rpm. Stock specs are 330hp @ 7000rpm. Then if the engine held it to 8000rpm, it would be 380hp @ 8000rpm.
The 380RS uses a standard VQ35HR longblock, with increased displacement to 3.8L. 350hp for non race, and 400hp for race motors. Compare that to the theoretical outputs of a future VQ37, and the numbers fall pretty close.
All these numbers are an idealized situation, but it draws a picture of what kind of power increase from the same size motor a new Z could be looking at with an evolution of the current VVEL system.
TK
Once those two changes have been made, the VQ is basically maxed out in terms of refinements unless they start doing exotic metals or maybe friction/rotating mass reductions.
01-21-2008, 08:33 AM
#44
Originally Posted by Hypnoz
They need to add VVEL to the exhaust, yes but they also need to incorporate direct injection for a (usually) 15% hp increase, better low end and better gas mileage.
Once those two changes have been made, the VQ is basically maxed out in terms of refinements unless they start doing exotic metals or maybe friction/rotating mass reductions.
Once those two changes have been made, the VQ is basically maxed out in terms of refinements unless they start doing exotic metals or maybe friction/rotating mass reductions.
TK
Last edited by T_K; 01-21-2008 at 08:35 AM.
01-24-2008, 10:51 AM
#45
Originally Posted by JCZ33
IF the Z keeps the same size, it NISSAN will need to use less common materials to keep the relative weight or lower it, which drives the profit margin negatively, which means the Z will cost more.
If I were NISSAN I would to this:
Regualr Zs...
1. Lower the body size by 9% using common materials.
a. This lowers the nominal weight to ~ 3100 pounds allowing engine weight increases to compensate for the 3.8L (350hp)
2. Add the 3.8L N/A to all trim levels
RESULT: 8.8:1 weight to power ratio. an improvement over the current 11.4:1 ratio.
Specialty Zs...
1. Keep the previous mentioned reduced body size
2. Use less common (lighter) materials in that body size to reduce weight another 9%.
a. Giving the Z a ~2800lb chassis
3. Two trim options
a. 380Z RS - 3.8L N/A = 8:1 weight to power ratio
b. 380Z RSTT - Add the TT package from the GTR - 400HP = 7:1 ratio.
If I were NISSAN I would to this:
Regualr Zs...
1. Lower the body size by 9% using common materials.
a. This lowers the nominal weight to ~ 3100 pounds allowing engine weight increases to compensate for the 3.8L (350hp)
2. Add the 3.8L N/A to all trim levels
RESULT: 8.8:1 weight to power ratio. an improvement over the current 11.4:1 ratio.
Specialty Zs...
1. Keep the previous mentioned reduced body size
2. Use less common (lighter) materials in that body size to reduce weight another 9%.
a. Giving the Z a ~2800lb chassis
3. Two trim options
a. 380Z RS - 3.8L N/A = 8:1 weight to power ratio
b. 380Z RSTT - Add the TT package from the GTR - 400HP = 7:1 ratio.
01-26-2008, 03:17 PM
#47
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Originally Posted by Sunset350ZR
In winding Road they stated that they will show the Next Gen Z at Paris auto show and it will be a 370Z.
For those that don't follow the link:
A print-only report in Autocar declares the revised Nissan 350Z will appear at the Paris Motor Show this fall, but the car will be powered by the 3.7-liter engine found in the Infiniti G37 and thus become a 370Z. This news isn’t terribly shocking since the G and the Z share a platform and have historically run the same displacement engine. Such a move is good news for fans of the two-seat, more affordable cousin to the G.
We’ll be on the floor in Paris to bring you all the news, but that’s not until October. Meanwhile, enjoy the gratuitous gallery of Nissan 350Z images below.
We’ll be on the floor in Paris to bring you all the news, but that’s not until October. Meanwhile, enjoy the gratuitous gallery of Nissan 350Z images below.
01-26-2008, 07:27 PM
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Originally Posted by CSTrack
I agree (begrudgingly). I'm sure Nissan will tune it so it will be pushing a couple more HP than the G37c (they have up till now). Keeping weight to a minimum is just an added bonus 
1st generation G's & Z's were just rated differently, by a few ponies. But we all know that was just for marketing purposes.
The 07 G Sedan & 07 350Z are rated exactly the same.
The main difference, as it has always been, will be weight. I expect the next 350Z to weight in at ~3450 lbs.
.
01-27-2008, 10:54 PM
#50
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^ +1
With the obvious weight reduction displayed by the mule's ~6-7 inch shorter wheelbase, there just seems to be no possible way the new Z will weigh any more than approx. 3200 lbs.
With the obvious weight reduction displayed by the mule's ~6-7 inch shorter wheelbase, there just seems to be no possible way the new Z will weigh any more than approx. 3200 lbs.
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