skyydiver

iTrader: (1)

I keep seeing things about these companies on this forum, but I have never heard them in person.

Are these products a well kept secret to only those with extreme discriminating taste? Are any of these products truly worth a damn? How do they compare to say Focals for speakers and JL audio for amps?

Thanks,
Joe

16psibrick

iTrader: (10)

www.simplicityinsound.com

on the right hand side of my home page, i have a small brief description of all three companies

but basically:

ED: very solid budget priced proiducts that offer mid level or higher performance, espeically in the amps and subs

ID: kinda surprised you havent heard of them, they've been around for a long long time...best known for their horns and subs...their subs i personally prefer over JL, smaller box requirements, easier to install, cheaper and sounds better...with almost the same output level for level.

DLS: Focal is the main competitor... differences is that DLS has a more laid back sound compared to focal, i would say more inline with Morel than Focal. Also line for line much cheaper. Also produces IMO some of the best amps around and also at a very competitive cost...comprehensive line of subs, coaxials, all the way down to a 50 dollar speaker

Ahsmo

iTrader: (13)

JL should stick building speakers.

Their amps ain't worth the price.

skyydiver

iTrader: (1)

Hey B...thanks so much for the input. Could I get some more input from you since I know you are well versed with these product lines.

My current design is the following:

Amps:
JL Audio
300/4 for mids and highs
250/1 for Subs

Speakers
Focal 165A1
of
Focal 165K2P (I know...extreme difference between the two...but cost is a driving factor...and these are what I really want)

JL Audio 10"
10W3v2
or
10W3V3 ( I am not 100% sure if the 250 will be underpowered for this speaker)


Could you please suggest comparable products within the ED, ID, and DLS families.

Thanks a million,
Joe

16psibrick

iTrader: (10)

i sent you a PM...i am assuming you are going by normal authorized prices not ebay...

b

jdohman

iTrader: (1)

Actually for the money the JL audio slash series amps are very very nice. The 300/2 and the 500/1 make up for a very very nice setup with a good set of speakers and like a 10W6. I also am a big fan of the A4300 and the A6450.

16psibrick

iTrader: (10)

jl amps arent bad, though i wish they made a bigger or rather...more ballsy two channel thant he 300/2

b

Dr.Z

iTrader: (2)

Love my IDQ10s...I've heard JLs, and these sound much clearer.

redlude97

iTrader: (11)

for the price of a 500/1, you could get a ED nine.1 with change and do alot more damage with your JL 10w6, or opt for an 11ov.2 and save even more cash and get similar if not better performance. Basically, a nine.1+11ov.2>500/1+10w6, and for significantly less money

dtak59

I own two EU-700 6.5" subwoofers by Elemental Designs (ED). I have to admit that they are pretty decent, given only 250 watts and .33 cu. ft. On the flipside, I am a little skeptical about Elemental Designs products. It seems as if they release their products prematurely. I bought the EU-700 subs about a year (or less) after they came out, and soon after I bought them, ED came out with an "improved" model (I think they include it as in their "O" line". The same goes for their higher end component speakers. They came out with components less than a year ago and already, they have a version 2 of the components. Same goes with the subwoofer line. The amps however have not budged since their first appearance, therefore they either 1) got it right the first time...or 2) didnt bother improving it. Furthermore, ED always has clearance specials on subwoofers...models that I have never seen on their webstie before. The one thing good about ED is that they are very reasonably priced.

Which leads me to my theory...ED makes many speakers that are not perfect the first time(s) which they sell for cheap. Then, when they try to improve the design, they sell that too...though not perfect yet. I suppose this is a good way to make money...selling all your preliminary designs until you finally perfect the product, and then sell that for more. I also noticed that more reputable companies such as JL and Image Dynamics have not changed their design in years, probably because they didnt release it until it was prefect. JL's Slash amps have been around for over 3 year already, and I have been waiting over 3 years for the IDQ v.3 to come out. Though many people stand by ED, I am still a skeptic. (or maybe just sour since they released a newer version of my sub months after I purchased it).

702Fairlady

iTrader: (5)

I like the eD nine.1. 900RMS for like 250 bucks

redlude97

iTrader: (11)

They didn't really change much on the EU, mostly just the speaker clips, and changing the name. They just added it to their KV line. Also, the reason things are always changing or improving in their line is because they are actually listening to feedback from their customers and taking those things into consideration. They could keep building their old sets of components and they would still sell just fine, there isn't really anything majorly wrong with them, people just pointed out small details that could be improved, and guess what? They actually did it! How often do you think JL actually asks its customers what they would like to change about their products etc. I would say its a good thing that they are constantly improving on their designs rather than settling for a perfectly good product.

16psibrick

iTrader: (10)

you are way off on on this one bud

1. the EU700 was around for about a year before a new and improve version, the 7kv.2 came out.(not O line) the differences are limited to functional and cosmetic , very little performance changes. These changes are based on user feedbacks through out the year.

how is changing your product from year to year a weird thing? its the norm in the car audio industry. Pioneer comes out with new stuff every year, so does pretty much most major manufactuers. but the one good thing about ED is that they change their stuff based on USER feedback

2. you said the higher endc omponents changed all the time. when did the EDI-6500 version 2 come out? if it did, that news to me and i am one of a handful of dealers in the country. its been exactly the same for years now... the 6000 series,which is the entry level line, was redesigned this year after a year. again, based on user inputs in what htey'd like to see. Again, whats wrong wtih comingout with a new and improved model during a new year?

3. and this is where you REALLY went wrong. JL and ID hasnt changed their product in years...hmmm...i am not sure if JL or ID would like that statement.

since i have been int he industry, JL has released something new every year or two, has it not? name any two year span that JL stook completely still and didnt improve upon anyhting? if thats the case, they wouldnt be showing their nice new stuff at CES every year

as for ID...being a dealer as well, i can say that the fact htat not much has changed over the past few years is NOT becuase they dont want to, its becuase of other mitigating factors that did not allow them to. but i think you are going to see a slew of new products from ID this year and next, and the next one after htat, improving upon pretty much their entire line up...


overall, i am not sure how many years you have been using ED, or the mobile 12volt industry in general, but i truly view their actions wtih their products as the RIGHT way to do business. Improviing products based on true user feedback, and keeping prices competitive. I usually dont take offense to peoples opinions on a line up, cuase i know everyone has their own listening taste, so if you had said you though ED's stuff didnt sound good, i wouldnt have cared, but honestly, in my opinion, you are blaming ED for precisely the reason why they are good

redlude97

iTrader: (11)

+1

350zspl

iTrader: (3)

the deal is
go with RF power series comps


focal makes a fine speaker though



mainly the installer on any forum take your pick , who has respect of the members can say that a speaker is the best , and the followers follow

generally not always but mostly

dtak59

So basically they changed the clips for the EU-700 and changed the name. And because of this, they are charging $25 more per sub?

eD - Chris

$50 + shipping was the intro pricing that stuck around forever. During that time the sub wasn't a part of the package builder.

$75 shipped is the new pricing. The sub is now a part of the package builder. Buy it with an amp and it's $63.75. Yeah, it still ends up being a couple bucks more if you're buying multiple subs, but the new terminals/larger overall mounting surface/improved packaging had to come from somewhere.

That and we never intended on leaving them at $50...we just did for a lot longer than we originally planned.

dtak59

Ok, sorry, I was mistaken on a few things. Such as...1) they improved on their lower end component system (which is a good thing), but it hasnt been too long since they came out witht he edi6000's. 2) The "V.3" that I recently noticed on their website is simply a cone color option. 3) I know JL comes out with new products constantly, but their higher end lines didnt change for a while. I may be mistaken, but the slash amps and components didnt change for a while, same goes for their W7. Same goes for image dynamics. They are releasing new products this year, but for the past few years, they haven't changed their IDQ line or their chameleon line speakers. It may be good practice to listen to user feedback and improve on your products constantly, but they should have addressed those issues before they released the products. I will not buy another ED product the first year it comes out, because I have a feeling it will not meet its full potential.

16psibrick

iTrader: (10)

1. companys up their price all the time from year to year without ANY changes to a product line. and i mean zero! it has to do with rising costs of materials, inflation, manufactuering cost etc etc. its not rare, or bad, its just how it is. thats with almost any manufactuererd good here in the US. Having been a dealer for many brands over the years, i can tell you that from the norm, from year to year, i expect to see a small jump in price even wtihout any new gear... It seems strange to me you blame ED for raising price WHILE incorporating changes..

2. v.3, does have some other changes othe htan just a coine color

3. Of course, when a company developes a high line, chacnes are it will change less. But i dont think you should put the w7 series, to comapre wtih the Ed KV series...we are talking about jl subs that cost 5 times as much. Why not compare the more natural competitors of one another? KV series versus w3...are you saying that JL is a bad company cause they obviously didnt get the w3v2 right the first time? and they have to now come out with the w3v3 to make up for it? how about w1 woofers? they must have really scrwed up to come out with a version 2 so quickly?

4. again, plaese dont think ID didnt WANT to change their line up, the IDQ is a great sub but i htink lagged behind in some area years ago, the fact that the idq version3 isnt coming out until later has nothing to do with the fact that IDQ is so good it doesnt need to change, it has to do with uh...financial reasons

also, speaking of ID, what would you say to the fact aht idmax went through three versions awfully quickly due to early issues? i guess you must dislike ID as well becuae they obviously didnt come out with products right the first time?

i get your point, but seriously, what you are beefing at is so common in the industry that most would consider the norm...

dtak59

Well, you may be right, but it still seems a little suspicious to me... flooding the market with a whole bunch of stuff...similar to companies like Lanzar, Boss, Pyramid, etc. But also it would be wrong for me to negatively comment on something that I have no real proof, so I'm done "beefing"