i have a 03 none track edition Z that will be attending several NASA HPDE events along with open trackdays.

so far it has

18/40/245 front 18/40/275 rear KDW G-force T/As
nismo exhaust
K&N drop in filter
nismo clutch/pressure plate
soon to have stoptech two BBK w/ matching pads/lines rear

so is there anything else i should know about or would be a good investment?

alignment spec?

 

is there an easy harness setup for these cars... it might be worth it for some added stability in the seat and safety...

 

I designed a harness bar for the reason you mentioned, and it works great. Info is at: www.BCRLtd.net I have black bars, harnesses & fire extinguishers ready to ship.

Be sure to look into some race brake pads though, and some high temp brake fluid, such as Motul RBF600.

There isn't much you can do with the alignment without spending big $, so just keep your HOT tire temps close to 40 psi, and you'll be fine.

 

from what most ppl say, you should either get a harness with roll protection, or just use your OE seat belts...the main idea is that a harness will allow you to push the car even harder, which increases the likelyhood of rolling the car...if you roll the car, the harnesses will not protect you from the roof caving in.

* there are a few harness bars out there for the Z; this supplies the mounting point for the shoulder straps. (www.bcrltd.net and https://my350z.com/forum/showthread....ht=harness+bar and https://my350z.com/forum/showthread....ht=harness+bar)

I have a set of 6 pt harness that I'll be installing for autoX purposes only (since the risk of roll over is so low, many ppl use harnesses w/out roll protection).

-Peter

 

You would never catch me running 4 or 5 point harnesses without rollover protection. OEM seatbelts allow your body to twist and bend out of the way in the event that the roof caves in on you. With racing harnesses, the only thing that will twist and bend is your neck, and it can't handle much of that. You also should get proper seats if you are going to go that route and disable your airbags, which are designed to be used with oem seatbelts, not harnesses. Next you will need some sort of neck protection, preferably a HANS devise, but the Simpson neck donut things are better than nothing and a whole lot cheaper. Trust me when I say that racing harnesses can do more harm than good if not used/installed properly with the right complimenting parts.

If you just want to keep yourself more planted int the seat, check out www.cg-lock.com and use one of them with your OEM seatbelt.

 

Let's not get into a harness bar versus a roll bar discussion. Most of the people who have installed a roll bar do not properly install their harnesses, nor do many harness bar users. Way too much mis-information has already been posted. I am offering a COMPLETE solution for those that want an approved system of installing a 6 point harness.

BTW, the CG-lock gismo doesn't do squat for holding ones shoulders in place. To each his own.

 

I don't think there is much of a discussion, its pretty simple IMO. Harness bars work great if you don't roll over.

 

I've been on this forum for over 3 years, and I have yet to hear of a 350Z roll over.......at an HPDE.

 

Ok wow, I really have to bite my tongue on this comment...

I never said that they roll over easy, but you cant say that its not possible. I have seen a few cars roll over at HPDEs, none of them 350Zs, but it does happen. IN MY OPINION, harness bars should be used at autoX only, not on the street and not during track events. It is highly unlikely that will will roll over, but you want to make sure that you live to talk about it if it does happen. I understand that you make harness bars and I am sure they work great for what they are intended for, but this is a safety issue that can be life or death in the right situation.

 

I've never rolled a car, but I have been hit a few times and smacked a few walls. I walked away from every incident, because I had proper safety equipment.

I have seen people killed in cars that rolled over. Even one with a 6pt. harness, because they didn't have their belts tight enough, and slipped out of them, their torso slipped out the window and the car rolled over on top of them.

As far as 350Z's rolling over, if you have ever seen the video of Daijiro Inada rolling his Option 350Z in the Nevada desert at the Silver State Classic... no other words are necessary. (BTW, I have run this event four times.) I have a roll bar and properly installed harnesses in my Z and am happy to have them.

Heck, I have even heard of people rolling their cars at autocross events! It's easy to do if you get off pavement and into some soft stuff while going sideways.

 

EnthuZ... I know I've probably seemed like a thorn in your side about the whole roll bar/harness bar issue, and for that I apologoize in advance.

I'll add this to the discussion: There is NO safety system that will prevent injury or death 100% of the time. I think we can all agree on that. Safety equipment manufacturers will also state the same thing. So what it boils down to when deciding on safety equipment, is two things:

1. What is your personal safety comfort level?
2. What are the requirements for the organization you are running with?

If you don't want to spend the money for a roll bar, and you are comfortable with the risks involved (with or without a harness bar or harnesses), then don't get one. This is the level we all start out at when we go to our first HPDE event.

If the organization you're running with has specs regarding safety equipment, you must follow those guidelines, or find someone else to run with.

Some groups have different philosophies regarding participant safety. We choose the pro-active route and require a minimum level of protection, especially for our competitive time trial segment at our events. While we don't require roll bars or harnesses for our HPDE events (even in the advanced groups) except for convertibles, we do reserve the right to inspect and approve any system installed in a car... even though that system was installed voluntarily. We do this to ensure proper installation so that in the event of an accident, the equipment will work as it was designed to and not cause more harm than good.

Specifically relating to harnesses and harness bars, we require that the harness bar only be used as a guide to ensure the proper angle relative to the shoulders... it cannot be used as the mounting point for the harnesses.

Looking at the pictures of EnthuZ's BCR bar, it would not be accepted at our events unless the harnesses were bolted to the subframe of the car, preferably at an agle not to exceed 30 degrees. This ensures that the frame and mounting hardware will take the brunt of the force of an impact, not the harness bar.

 

Hey guys - we should get back to help this guy on his question. For a HPDE event, you will push your car to it's limit, but you will learn how to drive it. I would not upgrade anything. The main things to do is make sure all fluids are ready and your brakes/tires are ready. I put together a check list, and others have added to it, look that over.
I just got back from a all day track day, and there where 26 of us to start with. Within an hour, it was down to half, since people didn't change/bleed there brakes! Within two hours, we where down to a quarter of the group, since there pads where gone. Most of the people where newbee's that didn't bother to get advice before, and just showed up. (I got so much time I burned through a full tank of gas before I had to quit.)
Go over your brakes, tires and wheels carefully!!
The other great thing, is - if your car has any weeknesses, a track day will identify them for you! So, check your car over before!

 

I have an 03 track as well and I would spend most of my money on brakes.

Get a decent race pad that will work well with your street tires and bleed the fluid with something good.

I use Carbotech XP-8's front and rear and use ATE super blue. Not everyone is crazy about the pads, but they work fine for me so far and there not to expensive.

As far as alignment you cant get ant camber in the front so I would try to get the toe adjusted.

A good starting point would be a little toe out in the front (1/8th) and some toe in out back (1/8th or so). That's what I am using and I'm happy with it.

 

Thanks MoodDude - you're absolutely right...

Just think of the event itself as an upgrade (assuming you'll have an instructor with you) - it'll be the best money you could ever spend on the car.

 

Most of what I would say has pretty much been covered already. Your brakes will be the limiting factor for both safety and track time, and a set of track pads and a brake fluid upgrade to DOT4 will be a major upgrade from OEM, and will allow you to experience much more of the track day. OEM pads can overheat, even on a brake-easy track, within just a few laps (especially if it's your first time out, as we all tend to overuse the brakes at first.)

I won't inflame the harness bar/roll bar debate any further, but like Stack pointed out, most organizations have strict rules about this stuff. Many of them require that you provide the same safety gear (seat, harness, etc) for your passenger (i.e. instructor) that you have for yourself. So if you're going to get any type of harness (which I personally think is WAY overkill for a first event), you might need to get two.

Which NASA events will you be attending? Maybe I'll see you out there!

 

I don't know your definition of a subframe, but our "B" pillars are strong enough for OEM shoulder belt mounting, and ALL the harness loads are transmitted through them with the BCR harness bar

As to it's acceptance, I don't know how many events you have held, but I highly doubt you have run nearly as many as PCA has. My bar, the BCR Harness Bar, has passed their requirements with flying colors! As much as you hate harness bars for HPDE events, some clubs have strongly different opinions. Chicago PCA, REQUIRES 5 or 6 point harnesses with a harness bar to run their events at Road America. (With the belts properly wrapped around the harness bar.) One of the fastest tracks in the US.

I hope you feel you're a better man for belittling my product that has had much reaserch in it's development. Please, in the future, to preserve your self proclaimed God like knowledge of the subject, do your homework first.

 

Please accept this as my public apology. Like anyone on a forum, posts can sometimes be written in haste, anger, and frustration... I sincerely apologize if any of my posts on the subjects of harnesses, harness bars, roll-over protection, or anything else have in any way negatively affected your product, you personally, or anyone associated with it.

I've never proclaimed to have God-like knowledge on the subject, and I really don't think any of my posts have belittled your product... but you're absolutely right, we havn't done nearly as many events as PCA... but I think SCCA has... and we base our rules on their rules for time trial and HPDE events. My opinions (and thats exactly what they are for anyone who thinks I think differently) generally follow those rules as well, but mostly I think they follow a general common sense. And while you are also completely correct that there are certainly differing opinions, by the same token, there are just as many who agree with my opinions.

 

I think for the $ the CG Lock thing is great. It keeps your hips back in the seat so you don't need to brace yourself with your feet. Now shoulders, "no" but in an accident the OEM shoulder/lap belt will function very well. Also in a real 5 or 6 pt harness, one of the functions of the sub belt is to keep the lap belt in the proper place. Just my $.02

 

Hey motobum,
I remember first attending HPDE and track events over 3 years ago. And I personally was thinking of all the mods that I was going to do.
But as mentioned on a previous post, concentrate on your learning and not car mods. Besides the brake fluid bleed, extra set of race brake pads (especially front/rears you can use stock to save some money), concentrate on making you a better driver.

Make sure to have or borrow a torque wrench to torque your lug nuts after each session. Make sure to manage your cold and hot tire pressures.

Eventually you'll make yourself a better driver and that will eventually lead you to being able to listen and feel your car better as you take it around the track.
If you're HPDE event has instructors, that is a great thing for someone just starting out. Remember that most of these instructors are enthusiasts like you. But also remember that they are volunteers and there are lessons you can learn from many people and not just one. What I'm saying is go for a ride with many instructors during the event so that you can find a consensus on the track and how to go around it.

Go to have fun in a safe environment, that's what it's there for.
Good luck motobum.

 

Instead of creating a new thread - thought this would apply here.

I was preping my car (again) today. As usually I was checking all the suspension linkages for fatigue and that the bolt are all tight. I found two bolts that where coming loose (lucky for me) and tightened them.
So just make sure you check your suspension over carefully before any track event.

Just thought I share with you guys.