Eagle1

iTrader: (2)

A couple of laps at laguna seca in the G coupe.
Enjoy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFGWRBYdahI

baileyrx

iTrader: (16)

man, Ed, you showed that Red Minivan who's the boss!

nice run, that sloping S really drops off fast!!

Tekwon-V

iTrader: (13)

great video! i cant wait to hit this track up.

what kind of tires do you run?

Eagle1

iTrader: (2)

Laguna Seca is a definite "must do" if you are a track lover. Even if you are a newbie!

I am running Nitto NT-01 tires. 275/35/18 F and 315/30/18 R on Enkei NTO3+M wheels.

See you out there next time.

For track days at that track, there are three really fine groups running it.
Speedventures
Trackmasters Racing
Leadfoot Adventures

Cheers,
Ed

Eagle1

iTrader: (2)

Oh, that was cold!

That sloping S is the infamous "corkscrew" Turn 8. It is not a difficult turn, but it certainly has drama. Because it is so unique in driving it has quite a reputation and allure. You basically point your nose to the middle oak tree trunk and when you get it aligned you hit the throttle and dial in steering, even though you cannot see the road.
"You gotta have faith" is the mantra on that one.

plumpzz

iTrader: (10)

I think that red mini van was a GTi lol

ketsup

don't forget redline track events. i know it's still far but they have an event on november 9th, 10th, and 11th http://redlinetrackevents.com/event_list.html

Eagle1

iTrader: (2)

My apology for the omission!

dkmura

iTrader: (64)

Very nice video. It also showed admirable restraint and good judgement in slowing up for packs of cars (or minivans) and "picking your passes". Eagle1 made good, clean passes with little drama- that's what you want at a HPDE! While Laguna Seca is one track I've never raced or even driven at, this video gave me a good sense of the rhythm and pace of hot lapping at this classic track.

Eagle1

iTrader: (2)

Tnhank you for the kind words on restraint. Getting home with your car functional is a high priority. HPDE is not racing, and safety is paramount always. Coming up the front straight I had to lift while still going up hill, and could have cut inside WOT and taken a whole line of cars on the left with a "dive bomb" and apex stealing move. And been kicked off the track the rest of the day for doing so....most deservedly. Proper etiquette to other drivers and respect for the dangers of speed are essential to having a good day for everyone at HPDE.

I had a passenger in the car and I don't think he would have enjoyed the view just outside his window of cars under full brake and readying for a turn in to the left towards him, not knowing if they could see him. Given the intense focus of having to do two quick gear drops under full brake from a 120+mph run up the front straight and a difficult double apex hairpin turn running downhill....it is rather problematic as to whether they will have the presence to note you coming inside with your hair on fire during an HPDE....in fact the odds are probably 99% they would never see you at all. If somebody did that to me, he would be wearing a torque wrench such that sitting down would pose a challenge.

Be safe, and come back to run again!

pedroosan

iTrader: (1)

nice video, thanks for sharing!

As far as the minivan goes... I also think it was a VW golf..

Looks like a widescreen camera formatted to full screen.
I use the xilisoft video converter software. You can convert pretty much anything to anything and can select letterbox formatting. That may help when uploading videos to get rid of the minivan effect.

Marc Mc

Having driven the track before, I will also complement you on your line. It was very clean. I have trouble on the Andretti HP and will probably watch your video to find a better line.

I will be there on Feb 16th and can't wait.
Thanks for the Vid!
Marc

Eagle1

iTrader: (2)

Thanks Marc...I appreciate the kind words. Glad you are getting out there, it is a track that is just so fabulous, and in real life so much more dramatic than the video because the elevation changes are hard to catch fully on the camera. Or the stomach drop out of 8 and 9.

The Andretti (Turn 2) is a fascinating turn and there are several ways to take it. One is the double apex approach, and that is the most customary. But there is another way that can be faster, if you can heel/toe downshift and trail brake. It is a little more gutsy, but even done conservatively it will position you for a much faster exit.

And that is the super late single apex. You set it up by going under the letters ZD in the "MAZDA" sign on the bridge, and straighten out turn 1 as best you can by cutting on to the white line at track left. Keep it straight and throttle DOWN all the way over the top and well over the crest, and let the inertia drift you out to track right. When you get to 4 board....aim in at an angle that bisects the track at turn in for the first apex...and then follow that line deep, straight brake and take two quick downshifts, go deeper into the turn well past the turn in point for the double apex racing line....and then use a turn in and trailing brake to rotate the back end around (in the video you can hear the rear tires of my car as the back steadily and gradually yaws around to where the nose gets pointed to the second and exit apex part of the turn), then gently squeeze throttle to arrest the slide and get the car to take a "set". As soon as she settles, keep rolling the power on and she leaps forward through the apex, which you will notice clearly as the nose gobbles up the track to the exit line on track right, turn in to your mark cross track for the entry to turn 3, etc. Vision is a critical aspect on this technique. You have to mark your exit apex over your left shoulder literally at 90 degrees, turn your head like a barn owl and stay fixed on it as you begin your turn in and trail brake so that your countersteering and pedal inputs are precise and as subtle as you can make them. Once you get yourself pointed right to your apex....do not stare it down until it disappears under the hood........., you look WAY forward, catch the exit track out point on the right and keep lifting vision, to your cross track mark, just keeping the exit track out point in your peripheral vision as you approach it. You don't worry about the exit apex any longer because....you have done your job and you are pointed at it...nothing more to do there!

This approach lets you carry a lot more speed and deeper into the turn, and just cannibalize multiple car lengths on many other drivers during the last 250 yards or so. It is NOT a hero braking maneuver and not a "dive bomb". But it is a different line and disconcerting to others in traffic, so you can see I did not use it when in a "conga line" of other cars that in a race I might have challenged. But never in HPDE. You could feel and see clearly between the two laps how much faster it was in the lap before compared to the lap with the traffic taking the other line.

Good luck, have fun, be safe!

EDIT: Here is a picture taken at Firebird during an advanced race driving school session, going into a hairpin turn and using basically the same technique, but in a Mustang Cobra. Note that the braking is now trailing off and the car is settling, loaded on the right side (see the front left is only slightly turned in) and the back is starting its rotation. The head is already well set on the target completely across the turn on the other side.

Bumpinjeep

iTrader: (3)

Very nice driving. Something like that has always been a dream of mine, going through Laguna Seca would be a BLAST. I watched a couple of your vids on youtube and i wouldn't want to be a GTi/M3 driver when you come bye. You seem to kill those guys in packs!

pingbling23

iTrader: (3)

sweet, i now remember why i love gran turismo.

Eagle1

iTrader: (2)

Traffic clusters are usually the result of one slow driver in front, and then others catching up and then waiting as they pick their spot for a safe pass. the stack up typically happens much faster than it takes to clear it. it is the absolute responsibility of the passing car to effect the pass safely, and if anything goes wrong, it is his fault. Laguna Seca is a pretty fast circuit, with only 11 turns. Passing opportunities that are truly "safe" are limited in reality to three spots...the front straight, between 4 and 5, and between 5 and 6. (You can do 6 to 7 if you have tons of power advantage). Contrast that with Buttonwillow with 23 turns for the same distance, and lap times that will typically be 20 seconds longer! But even though in the advanced group it is open passing anywhere, including turns, that does not mean that people will do it anywhere.

So what we see in the video, twice in fact, is a line of cars stuck behind a slower vehicle. the awareness of the slow vehicle drivers, and the patience of the faster vehicle drivers, is pretty good. The slow vehicle stays on line but lifts throttle, gives point by signals in succession, and the entire line scoots by...once on exit from Turn 11 and entry to the straight...and then another coming out of Andretti turn 2. that then puts the entire rest of the pack by, safely and cleanly, to open it up and enjoy the run. You may have heard me comment as we approched Andretti behind the stack that "I did not want to get kicked off". What was happening is that I had to lift throttle before even getting to the top of the hill and Turn 1. The alternative would be to duck inside left, and take two or three cars in rapid succession with a dive bomb move and stealing their apex and driving line. Very effective in a race where bending your equipment is part of the game. And people are watching for it. But in an HPDE it is irresponsibly dangerous and takes the fun out of the day for a lot of people. If you do that it is, and should be, an ejection from the track for the balance of the day. So you respect the line, maintain your place unless you get a point by, and set up for the next segment. Then you sort yourselves out in the stack. If you get clear enough to do two turns at your best speed, and there is somebody on your rear bumper.....let him by immediately! that helps sort out the stack quickly, usually within a lap or barely more if there are as many as five or six cars in the cluster, and soon the fastest are out front on their way, the slower ones don't have their rear view mirrors filled with cars, and everybody is enjoying their run unhampered. Until you come up to lap them.

A key is learning the proper etiquette and protocol of running your HPDE so that you have a great time safely. The Advanced group is not a hair on fire, red mist vision bunch of wild dogs. It is fast drivers in fast cars...but field aware and restrained, not racing. With that approach you can have a lot of very fast driving and skill building safely.

Marc Mc

Thanks Eagle!
I will digest your input and try to put it in action. I am fortunate to have a great mentor, so I am actually going to give him the info as well and we can discuss it on track and try to find a better line for me.

PS- your comments on ettiquette are right on!!!!

Marc

z_caliph

nice vid and nice driving

Eagle1

iTrader: (2)

On the Andretti turn, I was able to dig out and post up some older pictures of the turn that help to visually present what is going on with that turn, which will help those not intimately familiar with "Turn 2" at Laguna Seca.

Here is a picture of the turn, with the Spec Miata on the second of the two apex points. You can readily see the downhill "horseshoe" type of turn that it is. Also, please note how wide and deep the track surface is in the turn. Most of the rubber is laid down more tightly to the two apex points on the turn, as most drivers take the "double apex" approach to the turn.



Here is another picture, and you can see that following the double apex approach the car is still leaning into the turn approaching the apex, leaning enough that a fair amount of the available grip of the tire is being used to keep the car on line and turning, and thus is not available for acceleration or more velocity at this point. The Carrera behind is following the same line, and you can see how much more turn he has to effect just to hit the exit apex point.



Here we are the next lap. The slope of the approach to the turn is evident from the cross track view of the Carrera. At this point his head should be completely swiveled to looking at the apex point where my car is. He is on the right edge of the track, about to take his turn in to the first apex, which he would be watching with peripheral vision...though many drivers would do the reverse, which is the wrong thing to do, and that is stare down the first apex and then look up for the second once they get to the first....



Here is a later lap in the same session. The Carrera is no longer around, and we have gone by a red car, whose position from this shot also shows a typical double apex set up. If the set up was for single apex, the car would already by the white board on the road edge five lengths behind him, be angling in to bisect the surface at the single apex point, straight braking and probably be located a full car width to the driver's left of where he is seen in the photo.



Using trail braking and a single apex approach to this turn, returning to the very top photo above, the G35 would be in the same alignment as the spec Miata, with about ten more degrees of rotation having been induced. That yaw or change in angle releases the car from needing more lateral grip and allows for more aggressive application of throttle to the tires....and much faster exit speed because of being on throttle so much earlier into and through the apex. Hope that helps.

trebien

That doesn't help worth a damn. I'm still sitting in front of a computer, finishing a proposal, 1500 miles away from said track, driving a keyboard.