1cockyZ

iTrader: (46)

I want to mount my harness safely and pass tech just about anywhere. I will be using a harness bar and a cobra evolution seat. So if you have pics of proper installations that pass tech please post them and maybe if there is enough response hopefully this can be stickied so people have a place to look for mounting up their safety gear.

betamotorsports

iTrader: (1)

http://www.schroth.com/installation-.../en/index.html

1cockyZ

iTrader: (46)

I got out the protractor and its a 55 degree angle from the rear seat base mounting bolts(the bolts that goes through the base into the floor) to the pelvic line which is acceptable according to that link. Now if I use 8.8 hardware, longer bolts and put a backing plate on the other end under the floor would that be acceptable. I don't want to make holes in the car. Now where to mount the sub belts for the 6 point?

mhoward1

See the other thread about DE Seat and harness rules. I just posted some info there

z-u-later

iTrader: (43)

You don't have to drill any holes with a 6-point harness. You just have to be creative. I used the rear OEM mounting points for the seat rails for the submarine belts. Use an L-shape metal bracket to mount the submarine belts. Here is a link to a thread with some pictures that I posted on how I mounted my 6-point harnesses:

https://my350z.com/forum/showthread....ht=harness+bar

gixracer

iTrader: (2)

here is my current mounting for the lap and sub
https://my350z.com/forum/showpost.ph...2&postcount=48

you need to read this thread
https://my350z.com/forum/autocross-road/326449-new-08-club-de-seat-harness-rule.html

n1cK!

iTrader: (21)

i find that i am moving a lot in the stock seat, even with the CG lock installed. are real racing seats yet required to use a 5, 6, or 7 point harness? reading the CCR for NASA, it must be a 5, 6, or 7 point. is it even possible to use these harnesses on a stock seat?

laze1

iTrader: (17)

I use a Ultrashield "Spec Miata" racings seat and a custom base / mount ....it keeps you *** in the right position...plus is has holes for my 6 point harness. Having a good seat made me a MUCH better Track Day driver!

NO! you can't use a stock seat with a 5 or 6 point harness!

first350

iTrader: (24)

I did a similar method - super easy!

n1cK!

iTrader: (21)

why?

z-u-later

iTrader: (43)

You should have done a search because you're wrong about the 6-point harness. I've got 6-point harnesses mounted both on my stock driver & passenger seats.

mhoward1

and how are you holding the shoulder straps in place?

n1cK!

iTrader: (21)

per his post, he states that it is held with a harness bar.

z-u-later

iTrader: (43)

^+1

mhoward1

A harness bar doesn't keep the straps from separating, only the harnesses at the correct angle from the seat back. You either need a h connector or seat pass throughs. Also, as Z-U_later posted in the other thread that setup is fine for Auto-X, but I am not sure we would pass it at our tech inspections. We would have to verify the strength of the harness bar and a few other things.

n1cK!

iTrader: (21)

looking at the NASA regs (CCR), the setup that z-u-later has probably wouldn't pass their tech either. basically, the harness must be attached to the car, not something attached to the car (if that makes any sense). here's a thread over on theNASA forums that may shed some light on the subject. here's what the CCR states:

Quote:

Originally Posted by NASA CCR

• The shoulder harness shall be mounted behind the driver and above a line drawn downward from the shoulder point at an angle of no more than twenty (20) degrees with the horizontal.
• The seat, seat holes, and attachments to the seat are not permissible “harness guides” for compliance with the angle requirement. Only specific harness guide bars, or parts of the chassis or the cage are allowed to be used for this purpose. The guide bar, if used, should not present a sharp edge to the belt. It should provide as much area of support as possible to distribute the load.

it may suit the purpose of autox for that region and with that club. best thing to do OP would be to check with your club's regs.

guitman32

iTrader: (15)

I think you misread the rules posted on that page. The first point you quoted relates specifically to the shoulder harness' angle from the occupants shoulder to the bar (whatever type of bar used to mount the shoulder harnesses). The second pertains to the use of a "guide bar" in the case that the aforementioned angle is out of spec. Basically, if you make sure you mount your belts right via correct roll bar/cage design you wont have to worry.

Alas, the debate of a harness bar's ability to pass tech inspection and, more importantly, their safety, rages on.

n1cK!

iTrader: (21)

the second bullet basically states that the seat or a guide bar can't be used to put the harness within the 20 degree requirement. here's more of the harness section of the CCR:

Quote:

Originally Posted by NASA CCR

• Only separate shoulder straps are permitted. “H” type belts are allowed. “Y” type belts are not allowed. Each shoulder strap must have an independent mounting point.
• All mounting hardware should be SAE grade five (5) or better. Large diameter mounting washers should be used to spread the load. Bolting through floor panels etc. is not acceptable without required washers.

it's unfortunate that the CCR does not exactly state where the harness could be mounted, but i guess that's where the tech inspectors come in. i got my (vague) answer from the aforementioned NASA thread.

laze1

iTrader: (17)

Sure, you can mount them that way..but that doesn't mean they will protect you in an accident.

Why, Because you need a hole in seat base at the proper location for the crotch belts to pass thru......running the crotch belts over the front of a stock seat is very dangerous and will likely not pass most Tech in HPDE clubs like the PCA..

If you have a front-end crash, your torso will slide forward, your crotch/hips will slide WAY forward and "submarine", and potentially causing injuries to your back/internal parts. You really need to have the crotch belts really close to your Nads/hips to prevent forward movement.

Also, the crotch belts hold your lap and shoulder belts in the correct location, so if the crotch belts are looped out over the front of the seat, it will pull you lap belts out of position when tight.




From the PCA HPDE Tech guide:

http://www.pca.org/drivers_ed/standards.html

Harness Systems: If the participant chooses to install a 5 or 6 point driving harness ( four point systems are not safe and therefore not allowed) several changes to the automobile must be made to create a safe occupant restraint system. Harnesses must include a antisubmarine strap and be mounted in an approved manner consistent the manufacturer’s instructions. The Harness system must be used in conjunction with a seat which has the supplied routing holes for the shoulder and anti-submarine belts. All pieces of the restraint system must be installed in accordance with the manufacturer’s instructions.

This means that a seat is required to have the proper routing holes for the harness as supplied by the seat manufacturer for the shoulder and anti-submarine straps. The shoulder straps should be mounted at 90 degrees to the axis of your spine or at most 40 degrees down from horizontal. Because the addition of the harness system means that the occupants are fastened upright in the vehicle, a properly padded roll bar or roll cage is strongly encouraged to complete the SYSTEM. The use of one without the other may result in an unsafe environment and is not a COMPLETE SYSTEM. Due to UV degradation and wear the harness webbing must be replaced every five years.

z-u-later

iTrader: (43)

My shoulder harnesses are passed thru underneat the headrest, between the two poles. It's tight enough that it will not get separated.

I have the Avalon Racing Harness Bar, probably the rarest & strongest harness bar ever made for the 350Z. It is mounted on the stock seat belt mounting point on the B-pillar. Trust me, it is the best & safest designed harness bar ever made for the 350Z.

It passes tech inspections by my two local clubs. We have several national-level drivers (former & current SCCA National champions) in our clubs who are very knowledgeable of the safety requirements & they have inspected/passed my setup. I'll trust their judgment before I trust someone's cyber comments on this thread.