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I'm in NorCal so my local tracks are Sonoma and Thunderhill. Laguna seca is 4 hours away and Willow springs is 2 hours further. I will be going to both tracks in the next year or two. both are world famous. especially Willow springs with its heritage. I'm not a big fan of thunderhill. The east track irritates me but the West track is fast and fun. Sonoma is marvelous. Don't really need anything more than that honestly.
so this is the culmination of going on three years for me. 350Z was my first track car and I'm still working on it. My prior two threads here discuss the long progress of this car. just a year ago I was looking at radios to install in it. so I've had a hard time narrowing down exactly what I want to do. I didn't set out in the beginning to build a dedicated track car. but that is what it has become. hence, the new thread.
what really prompted the direction of this car is that I did so much to it it's not good for street anymore. it's incredibly harsh. totally unsuitable now but awesome on the track. it's like a go-kart. The other threads list all the stuff I've done to it. same car. haven't traded it or replaced the engine yet. I'm considering engine options. I might pull it and rebuild it for high compression, or for FI. still not sure. I'm leaning toward high compression because I think that's a more enjoyable track experience. but the thing with Fi is, it's much much easier to do. for now, I'm just leaving it alone with the minor upgrades. I will probably be adding LTs. there's no reason to keep the cats now.
I've learned more about working on cars in the past 3 years than in all the years before combined. I have a business with cargo vans and servicing them as expensive. I've been doing that all myself in my garage for the past year now thanks mostly to the experience I gained with this 350Z. not just changing the oil but doing brakes and suspension. Big stuff still goes to the shop. but I save a ton of money on things like brake pads which are typically $300 per axle at a shop while the pads are only $40.
anyone who has an inkling for doing this, I encourage you to do it and not put it off because of the cost. there are groups other than SCCA and NASA with discount track days. around here it's speed SF and a couple others. at east do one Saturday every few months. NASA is expensive. but one advantages, the structure and tracking your progress. I do a mix of NASA and speed SF events.
in case a beginner is reading this, I do not recommend using a daily driver for the track. One little mishap and you're not getting to work Monday morning. you really need to start saving for a dedicated track car on the side. they're affordable today. you can get a Miata or Z3 or 350Z for like $7,000 in great condition. you also don't want to totally screw up your DD and that's really necessary for track car. You're just going to be working on your skills on the track if you don't have a dedicated car. That's okay. All wheel time is useful, but you're always going to hold back with your DD.
so it took two and a half years but I am finally at the point where my street legal 350Z is getting the full track treatment. I was very slow to get here. I loved that car. I'd wanted one for 20 years. it's like unrequited love finally satisfied. I didn't want to screw it up. but I ended up buying a couple more cars and then I stopped worrying about the Z.
I treat it like with the same approach I take toward a BMW Z3. The vanilla cars are not worth preserving. same with a 350Z. there's no reason to preserve them. a Nismo is another matter. those absolutely should be preserved and not tracked. same with the Z3, mine is not an M, so there's no reason to preserve it. tear it apart and turned into a track car! there's nothing special about it. I kind of still like to buy an M and keep it as a nice street car. I was considering a Z4 M coupe, but they are 3800 lb. That's GT class, not sports class. I'm disappointed in that. it's a four seater with only two seats. a Z3M would be a better choice now I think. I probably won't because I bought a Cayman S and a boxster S and whether I keep them or not, that's scratched the itch. such a super rare thing in life, scratching an old itch...
in the next few months I'll be pulling the 350Z out from under the cover, back into the garage, pulling the transmission and rear diff to put onto the '03 donor car which will eventually be sold. although I'm sort of tempted to keep it in case I need an engine but if that is the case, I'll just be rebuilding or swapping out so I don't think I need another DE.
honestly, these VQs are kind of a PITA. I'm a fan but, the engine is tough, but it's really hard to get anything more out of it without huge expense. I'm leaning toward swapping it with an LS down the road. sure you lose the VQ sound but a race car is a race car. you do what you have to do to make it faster. I actually know Ford's better than Chevy's so it would be interesting to put a 5.0 in the 350Z instead of an LS. concept Z has LS adapter parts but I don't think anyone has put a 5-0 into one of these cars. or maybe I'll just rebuild the DE. I'm not married to any of these ideas yet. I just kind of don't want to pour huge money into a 300 HP engine. Even the old 5.0 in my 2011 makes 415 HP. I got the car for the price of a crate engine. buy another one and just pull the engine out or buy a used engine. I think in the long run it's cheaper than rebuilding a VQ. is it still a legit 350Z? I don't know. I haven't experienced it yet. I think it would improve the car. I think when you get behind the wheel and there's a V8 under the hood, you're not going to care.
what about weight distribution and all that V8 weight in the front? yeah, that's an issue. The reason so many racers go with LS is because it's a light engine. The 5.0 Coyote weighs 420 LBS without flywheel or accessories. A VQ/DE is about 100 lb less. That's a lot of weight on the front. offset by increased HP but still not good. an LS is somewhere in between but still about 400 lb. engine adapter and flywheel, mates the CD transmission to the LS, then the rest of your drivetrain is g2g.
I don't know just yet. but if my VQ dies, for the rebuild I would want to get it up to 400 HP. You're looking at about the same price for an LS. you might offset the increased weight with lower engine mounts.
I know one thing for damn sure, if the 3.4 in my Cayman S goes, I sure as **** and not spending 30K on a Porsche engine rebuild. I'll put an LS in it! a lot of people are doing that. I don't expect to have a problems but just saying, the engine is notorious. it's a good choice. damn, a V8 behind the seats... that would feel and sound like a Ford GT or a c8 ZO6.
The next steps for my 350Z are the rear diff and clutch and trans transplant. and completely strip the interior, finally. got a couple of fiberglass fenders in mind for it with air vents. harbor freight has a 25% off sale this weekend so I'm going to grab a transmission jack.
The '04 has been covered for 6 months now. I got in it to start it up recently while checking the mileage and putting in some sta-bil in the tank. climbing in, I felt a powerful wave of nostalgia. I miss this car! so I started it up and put in the preservative and let it run for 20 minutes.
Man, this car is calling to me. can't wait to bring it back into the garage. I think these new upgrades will be done by mid summer. it won't take that long, but I have other projects to finish.
there are a few upgrades planned apart from the rear diff. I've been shopping around and it looks like ISR is still the best bang for your buck for LTHs. a reviewer on CZP recommended NISperformance. they've got the ISR LTH bundle with O2 extensions for $799 shipped. I might just extend the O2 sensors myself with some wires. without the extensions the price is $740.
I'm really eager to see how the DE will respond. The plenum spacer and Z1 exhaust and a few other things def added power but how much? All I care about increasing is mid-range torque since I spend most of the time in 3rd at Sonoma and Thunderhill West. th-east is faster so 4th more often. either way, I'm looking to increase torque in third and fourth gears. LT's are known to increase high-end but we'll see. gonna do it anyway. And then a tune will be needed. I think I'll have gone as far as I can with the OEM.
The next thing on my to do list is a lexan poly rear window. I'm ordering it with vent slots. The build time doesn't bother me because this car isn't going anywhere anytime soon.
I'm torn between keeping my existing test pipes and getting some short headers and replacing them with long headers. That'll likely be my project later on in the year.
it's driving me crazy not being able to bring the car in to the garage and dig into it. I overextended myself. now there's not enough room. I use that garage to service my business cargo vans so I can't just leave the Z sitting in there on stands to get various things done like I did before. I need to get back to that but it'll be a while. it's frustrating. I need a rental shop space. a shop with room for two or three projects. it would be expensive but maybe worth it at this point. or maybe just big storage place with room to work on one car. I don't know if power is available though.
I appreciate anyone who is following my thread (s). thank you for your amazing advice over the last couple years
since these cars have dropped in value so much, the used high mileage ones anyway, I'm not going to get much out of my 2003 track model which I was using for parts but is still drivable. I'm thinking of just storing it for backup parts. And what's really been on my mind the last month is building a new race engine for the 2004.
a block is going to run about $2,000 shipped. The engine in the '03 has 80K but was raced hard based on some heat damage evidence here and there. but who cares, it's a solid short block project waiting to happen.
so instead of getting a pittance in resale out of it, I think I'm just going to keep it and do something interesting. at minimum, I can pull the engine and rebuild it. Go for high compression. maybe 4.0 L. upgrading the heads and valve train, maybe a 7K red line. a screamer rather than going FI. 112 octane. :-)
The OEM engine in my '04 has a limited lifespan. inversely proportional with the driver's increasing skill on the track.
The 03 has immaculate body panels. which is kind of surprising. maybe the prior owner replaced some of them.
I am going to move it to a storage facility. And hang on to it for parts although there isn't much OEM that I would want to use at this point. it's kind of worthless without the engine and since I'm going to pull that then there's no point trying to sell the car. it's a replacement chassis, though.
backup frame and body in case the 04 hits a wall. God forbid.
just curious if anyone else has a second car for parts? I suspect in coming years as I get better, I'm going to be glad I kept this straight and solid frame and body.
First two events are coming up with my favorite org, SpeedSF: Thunderhill West 4/06 and Laguna Seca 4/13. I'm a little nervous taking an unproven car (98 Z3 2.8L) on a long trip even in a trailer, so THW will be my test day. The prices are so low. $175 & $250. One day each, again, because the car is unproven.
I have to get tires, pads, fluids done. the Z3 is otherwise stock with 26-year old bushings. but you would never know it from driving it. such a well engineered, amazing car. fairly new rotors but OG calipers, Fortune Auto 500s. That's it. it's not exactly race prepped but it'll do.
I'll be trailering for the first time. a cringy U-Haul but gotta take these steps.
The 350Z will get done this summer but I didn't want to miss these spring events. it's already been a year since I've been on a track. Don't want my skills to atrophy.
Those are pretty good prices. I'm sure the Z3 will do just fine. As far as uhaul trailers, be aware that they have large stops on the front that a lot of lower cars can't get the front bumper over, in a lot of cases that'll result in the car sitting too far back and dangerous trailer sway. When I had to tow with a uhaul trailer I used to remove the front bumper to be able to get the car far enough forward for good weight distribution.
Did some rearranging this morning to get the Z3 into the garage and had trouble with the 350Z, couldn't start it.
I started it 2 months ago, no issues, but this time when I hooked up the battery the alarm immediately went off. So I inserted the key, turned on the ignition, and still the damn alarm was blaring. After about 30 secs the ignition was disabled, requiring a battery disconnect. Weird!
So I cut the horn wires and I could hear the alarm system relay clicking, even with the damn key in the ignition, turned on. No reason why the alarm should be going off with the key inserted (and the fob works--can lock/unlock the doors).
Not gonna worry about it RN. The alarm system and a lot more needs to be yanked anyway.
I need to send the ECU to Z1 for a mail-in tune and get rid of the key chip alarm.
Hi @horhe89. thanks for stopping by. that would be a complex job because the ECU and wiring is all different. If my DE goes, I will prob rebuild it and shoot for a higher redline. I'd like to do some engine work myself in fact. not machine shop work, just re-assembly. go for higher displacement, higher revs, better cams. it would be damned fun.
yea I looked into that as well, dont think its worth it. I like the idea of the 4.0L screamer DE engine! If mine lets go thats probably the route I will go too
since I'm keeping the 03 as a backup car, I'll be pulling that engine to rebuild it ahead of the 04 crapping out. i need the engine experience at this point in the hobby.
thats bold, engine work scares me, I feel like I would put 20K in parts in it and blow it up haha.
A machine shop will hone the block. there's a limit on every engine. I don't know what it is with the DE but with aluminum it's not much. I'd just go for a target displacement and plan on sleeves right away.
so glad I decided to keep the second car for this reason so I don't need to shop around for an engine. I would love to build a 7,000 RPM VQ. The Porsche M97 makes it look so effortless. Even more so with your 9A1.
Last weekend to get things done. I stripped the audio system and wiring for doors, windows. i wanted to remove the heater box but the AC lines go into it. I could just evac the lines but no hurry rn. this car needs more crucial upgrades before i do any more weight reduction. At 2840 stock, I suspect it's down -300 lbs. Window regulators, speakers, tools, spare tire, vert top, seats, and there's more that can be done.
the calipers were original so I just replaced them. stock rotors for now. I've got DTC-60 pads coming, not sure if they'll get here in time. it was a last minute thing. for this first time i won't be pushing it hard. hopefully U-Haul won't let me down. I had to cancel Laguna Seca because of logistics. I've got two days at TH West and one week later I'm doing TH east with NASA.
unfortunately, there isn't really an upgrade path via BMW. these calipers are shared with the E36 and E46 base models and m brakes are hard to find. eventually I'll need to adapt something. I'm going to talk to some E36 guys at the track and pick their brains.
I am eager to get the 350Z back to the track. All it needs is a differential rebuild. Even if I have huge fun in this Z3, I'm still gonna finish the Z. after that, I don't really know. The engineering of the BMW is so superior that it's hard to work on the Z after spending time with a German car. I can appreciate them both but what would I rather spend my time on? continue with the Z or play with cars that are more fun?
nice work. I think you need both! If one goes down you have a backup or if you just feel like driving something different. Both great track platforms. I was on track with a Z4 last weekend, made the think of your build.
Yes, it's good to have a backup. I'm eager to do do the next step, more weight reduction. are you ever going to track your Cayman? I'm on the fence about it. but, I am definitely doing the baffled oil pan and numeric shifter + cables, And it needs camber. from the 6 or so track days last year, it started to wear the outside of the tires. but I will keep that car strictly street and sellable. I will probably end up with a 981. I don't know. I'm really fond of this car.
I dont plan on it, its just a fun street car to practice heel/toe. honestly I hardly ever drive it. Im just too busy with work and working on the race car on the weekends. Im keeping my eye out for a gt3 to trade it on in the next few years..
I'm the same with my boxster s, it's a hoot on the street but at this point the z is faster on the track. The boxster is an 06 and just getting to 60k miles. Great condition cause I rarely have a chance to drive it. I thought about getting something else but I enjoy the convertible aspect of it.
12-28-2023, 12:09 PM
my real final track thread
