Wild stuff, cant believe the marshalls are wavign the debris flag while cars are piling up.

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...1605499&page=2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WuSE...layer_embedded

<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/22240697" width="400" height="300" frameborder="0"></iframe><p><a href="http://vimeo.com/22240697">VIR Oil slick spin</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user2095936">Leslie Davis</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>

<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/22306701" width="400" height="225" frameborder="0"></iframe><p><a href="http://vimeo.com/22306701">VIR Incident</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user4249060">Rob McClaskey</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>

 

A waving debris flag usually means something bad is on the track. The more vigorous the corner worker is waving, the more bad it is.

 

Corner workers are doing their job properly by waving the debris flag to warn oncoming traffic of the invisible hazard waiting for them. Can't expect them to help the cars that have already spun without putting them in harm's way.

 

Holy crap, thats some scary shtttt

 

I experienced that in my first (and only) SCCA race, though I saw the warnings and slowed down, was interested to watch the car behind me go spinning by in the rear view as I was around the turn.

 

That's just ridiculous.

 

At the 2:35 mark of video 2......I would have probably needed a change of nomex undies. Sounds like a few guys got banged up, but nothing serious. Considering the impacts, etc that is something.

 

You could hear the engine going and he just kept his foot in it :s

At 2:35 in the second one I was like "oh ****"
Then I saw where it went in Vid 3 and instantly thought the driver in the other car is f@#ked
Then remembered LHD, lucky!

 

Makes me wonder what they thought the flag guy was telling them that they didn't believe. You could see the oil slick or sheen even before they got to the corner. Some really dumb driving. The first guy going off usually is the signal to the flaggers that there is a oil or anti-freeze problem at the corner and most flaggers are pretty quick to bring out a flag.

 

Sometimes the red mist obscures the corner workers from the driver's vision. I was working a regional race a few years ago and a car was circling the track on fire. At least 3 corner stations had workers holding up their 50lb. fire bottles and waving it at the driver. I took our station's fire bottle, held it over my head, and ran out to the edge of the track as the car approached. That got his attention.

 

End of the third video is scary! POV driver is lucky that jetta/bimmer or w/e didn't get him!

 

Where's the yellow at start/finish? In the 3rd vid the flag looks to be just hanging down. Almost a minute later and cars are still barrelling in. There had to be a communication breakdown somewhere.

Also there's a art to spinning, I don't know about you, but stopped at the bottom of a oil slicked braking zone where cars see 140mph is not at the top of my list of places to be.

 

Oil on a track doesn't result in a halted race? Even with 3 cars spun off the race was kept going. Seems like obvious negligence to me.

 

C'mon dude. Negligence? Are you an attorney looking for a lawsuit?

 

Unprovoked insult?

 

No, that was a legit quesiton (unless being called a lawyer is an insult). My guess is that you don't have much race experience. Negligence is almost impossible to prove in a race. I can think of only a couple situations in the US in the last 50 years and those came about from definite acts, not lack of acting.

Even in Senna's case it took 13 years for the Italians to come up with a guilty charge for Patrick Head and by then the statute of limitations was over.

Remember, any time you enter a race you're signing a waiver where you agree that there is a significant risk of death and you're absolving everyone involved of any responsibility.

 

nonsense! thats some scary stuff

 

I was unsure if it was a legit question or not. Being asked if I was a lawyer looking for a lawsuit could be an insult if delivered in a certain tone. I wasn't sure if you had that tone or not. Hence I asked.

No I'm not a lawyer. I am as you guessed new to motorsports and was asking the question out of an interest to learn. The negligence comment comes from an outsider observing the situation and my own albeit limited experience with racing. It would seem to me that if near immenant harm was coming to the guys who spun out the track personell would stop the race for cleanup. The two on-track spills I've seen both resulted in the race being stopped. One was at Seca and the other just an autoX.

Thanks.

 

From the people I taked to the oil actually started before brake marker 6, and unfortunately if you are carrying significant speed you can't really lift at the front straight bend so that's very little room to get things halted before that marker.

Overall it was a VERY bad place to have slick conditions.

 

Depending on the race sanctioning body they might:

1. Stop the race and clean up the oil.
2. Do a full course yellow and lay down oil dry.
3. Display a local yellow.
4. Display the debris flag for the rest of the race.
5. Display the debris flag for 2 laps and then pull it.

SCCA Club Racing will typically do 2 then 5.