plastiketa

iTrader: (14)

I've noticed on the forum that the SPC Toe Bolts seems to be a popular mod choice over the Kinetix Toe Arm. Aside from price, why choose the Toe Bolts over the Toe Arms? Is one inferior to the other? Will I regret an install of either mod?

One person mention that the Arms don't adjust the toe from the proper angle. Any other +/- for either mod? I currently have the Toe Arms, which are not installed yet, but I may be considering the Toe Bolts, depending on the responses on this thread.

Thanks

aleok

iTrader: (1)

i would like to know too. all i think i know is that with the bolts you need to drill, which i wouldn't want to do.

Gsedan35

iTrader: (10)

SPC toe bolts = Making the oem toe control system have greater +or- adjustment range.

Adjustable toe arm = Making the radius rod into a adjustable rod that your trying to effect toe change with.

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Here's a cut and paste from a discussion on the subject done awhile back on the board.

The so called traction/toe rods made by LSD, JIC, Stillen are more accurately named a RADIUS ROD. That is the correct name for the arm, just look it up in the shop Manuel.

These rods do not adjust toe. Due to their mounting point they cannot adjust toe WITHOUT affecting the caster of the rear spindle.

The radius rod (sometimes called toe rod) attaches to the spindle right on the pivot point between the upper and lower ball joints. It does not attach in front of the pivot point like some believe.

Lengthening or shortening of this rod only changes the caster of the spindle because the rod is below the rear axle. So, lengthen the rod and the less caster you get.... Shorten it and you get more caster.

Sure... some say that they have lengthened it and it adjusted toe. That is only because the caster has changed so much that the pivot point between upper and lower ball joints has been relocated..... due to the traction rod not being mounted perfectly centered between the upper and lower ball joints the entire rear geometry gets changed to the point that toe was affected.

This is the WRONG way to adjust your toe. I would call this a static toe adjustment. This may work as long as your rear suspension never moves. As soon as you corner hard, accelerate and squat or hit bumps and cause your rear suspension to become dynamic things can get nasty.

The proper way to adjust toe is with the stock toe cam.

In some cases (depending on how much your Z is lowered) the stock toe cam is not enough. The only way to get more toe at that point would be to reduce the length of the lower spring cup arm. Not an option on the stock Z and as far as I know there are no aftermarket lower spring cup arms yet.

camber arms are sufficient and in my opinion the radius rods are not a required mod.

What needs to happen is the camber rods need to come bundled with a set of shorter spring cup arms. That would make a complete toe/camber package. The Camber/Radius rod package only addresses the camber side of things.

I do not pretend to be a master at suspension geometry but I have spent allot of time underneath my Z and have a very good idea on its geometry and how it all works.

In closing I'll say that it's my opinion that the camber rod is a great piece but the radius rod is just a pretty piece of steel that merely looks good.

Z1 Performance

iTrader: (564)

G35sedan - try one out for yourself, you'll see you can get it to have suitable rear caster

I've got radius rods on my car, as well as camber rods. It takes ALOT longer to properly set these up vs a toe bolt (which is why the SPC is such a popular kit and why for 99.9% its what you should go with).

I've got my setup dialed in very well with the exact rideheight, rear camber and rear toe I want and still am within factory reat caster range. Time consuming but it worked out.

In retrospect though, the toe bolt is a far far far easier way of doing things and would have saved me a couple hours

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

The toe bolt is the proper way of doing things. Regardless of how little it affects caster the Kinetix arm does in fact do that. A true toe adjustment piece should not have a changing affect on the caster of the wheel. The only correct way to correct toe is to move the entrie psring bucket in or out as needed. If you look at the arm for any length of time you can see how its moving the wheel position on two axis as opposed to one on the toe bolt.

slaponte

iTrader: (2)

Toe bolt is the right solution, cheaper, easier to install... why would you use the "toe" arms? All these "toe" arms are missnamed. Z1, you might get it right after a lot of work, but why? Why move the caster if it was fine to start with?

Also, I would say most of us don't have access to good/reliable alignment shops who would take the time, neither can we keep paying $60 a pop just to check it... It took me 4 or 5 alignments the first year and a half just to get close to right. A simpler toe bolt that changes toe only is an easier thing to deal with.

plastiketa

iTrader: (14)

Z1- Are traction rods AND toe bolts work well together so far? Aside from the time spent, was it worth it to do both? +/-??

Also, I dont quite understand what caster does to the suspension. From what I understand, its the angle that the strut tower or coilover sits. Any quick explainations?

Thanks to everyone who has posted so far. I think I may sell my Kinetix set and get the SPCs.

slaponte

iTrader: (2)

I kept Kinetix camber arms back and front. Then used bolts on the back for extra Toe. And it all went into alignment like a charm. I have EIbach springs all around. They were one of my very first mods, to get rid of that annoying "bunny hop" the car had...