eddiebrock71

iTrader: (1)

Looking for suspension experts comments.

How is the NISMO s-tune suspension compared to the new 2004.5 + suspension revision. Understeer vs. neutral vs. oversteer.
comfort level.

NISMO s-tunes have progressive rate springs 448/504 (F+43% R+48% compared to 2003 suspension) vs. 314/427 for the revised suspension.

NISMO sways +18% stiffer front, and 1% softer in the rear (compared to the 2003 suspension) vs. +17% stiffer front, rear the same for the revised suspension.

Notwithstanding the NISMO s-tune will have a lower center of gravity, but would it be more neutral than the 2004+ revised suspension?

I am no expert but from doing a little research, whenever you increase the stiffness of your rear swaybar or rear springs understeer will be reduced. And according to the specs, the revised suspension has a greater stiffness to the rear, due to the swaybar being stiffer, and it also has a greater rear to front spring rate (a 113 lb difference), compared to the 54 lb difference in the NISMO s-tune. also the NISMO rear sway is softer so sends more bias back to the front.

So according to these number the revised suspension should be more neutral, or maybe a little more prone to oversteer than the NISMO s-tune.

also the revised suspension uses linear rate springs, so it would be more predictable. the NISMO is progressive, which would make it more comfortable.

Not being an expert or anything here, would the NISMO s-tune even be worth it on a z with the revised suspension?

would not the revised suspension be more neutral or tend to oversteer?

I know I will hear comments that other suspensions are better, but I tend to agree with linear supporters as the springs are more predictable. also there are not many linear lowering springs, or the front to rear ratio numbers do not support a more neutral handing vehicle.

Did Nissan make the new revised suspension as neutral or more neutral than the NISMO s- tune suspension?

but kept it stiffer with linear springs so people would still be enticed to buy the s-tune for a smoother ride.

also since the NISMO s-tune is progressive, you will only get the best handling at the limit, while with stock linear you get the best handling even when not pushing it.


so besides the subtle drop and smoother ride would the NISMO s-tune give any performance advantage over the revised suspension?

Art Vandaleigh

iTrader: (16)

I must say I went from an 05 OEM suspension to S-tune suspension and sways a few years back now. I definitely saw improvements in body roll and neutral handling... took away the vast majority of stock understeer and added a bit of oversteer. You really can control the rear of the car a lot more with the S-tune through corners, but its not unpredictable. Overall handling is sharp, turn-in is improved as well. I would say the comfort level was on par with OEM and OEM wheels/tires. Adding the Nismo wheels and lower profile, more aggressive tires took a bit away, but it's still great for daily and roadtrips. The setup is not hardcore by any means, but good IMO if you want something mid-level and already tuned for the car.

godmans

iTrader: (10)

Got a question that I don't quite understand. The general rule of thumb is that if you want more traction on the front/back, you would want to soften that side (front/back), either in terms of spring stiffness, shock bound/rebound control, or roll stiffness controlled by sway bar.

In the case of difference between S-tune and OEM revised suspension, you can see that the S-tune provided relatively much more roll stiffness and spring stiffness for the FRONT. Can someone please chime in and maybe help me out by explaining how can the S-tune provide less understeer and more oversteer? .. maybe I was lost somewhere

Spork

iTrader: (6)

If you want traction... stiffer is better.

T_K

iTrader: (5)

How are you coming to these conclusions without knowing the initial spring rates of the S-Tune suspension, even more so, the initial resting rates of the springs with the weight of the car on it?

TK

Z04

iTrader: (15)

um, did you even read the first post? the spring rates for the s-tune are listed there, as well as numerous other threads and some of the vendor sites as well.

supracar

Interesting because I would lean towards a progressive 'street' suspension like the s-tune when looking for more comfort (at slower speeds at least).

You also mention they are less predictable. What about better absorption of jarring bumps (at any speed). I find my 2005 OEM setup makes the car VERY unpredictable because of that.

Good thread.

terrasmak

iTrader: (8)

Not always

godmans

iTrader: (10)

Sorry, I should have been more specific with my question/ comment. I was referring to the traction bias from front to back, which governs the understeer/ oversteer characteristics of a car.

From what I know, which is also reflected in this document, the side that is setup to be softer has more traction, i.e. people that want less understeer/ oversteer will relatively increase REAR roll stiffness, spring rate or bound and rebound control.

http://www.timskelton.com/lightning/...orrections.htm

*which is also why most aftermarket suspension will advise you to start with a softer setup at the back and slowly work your way to increase the stiffness at the back, since they wouldn't want you to start with oversteer... which is generally more dangerous than understeer on the street

T_K

iTrader: (5)

INITIAL spring rate. 448/504 is max spring rate. If initial is higher than stock, add weight of car on top of that, and the suspension is going to be stiffer than stock all around. If initial is lower than stock, and with the car compressing the spring at rest, if its higher than OEM, then its stiffer still, if its not, then its softer. Maybe you should read my post again?

TK

supracar

I don't think you can make that comparison as the S-Tune lowers the car a bit. All I've gotten out of this thread is that both the S-Tune coil overs and sways don't seem like a good upgrade if you have the revised suspension unless it's worn out.

eddiebrock71

iTrader: (1)

Also of note is that the rear has a more progressive spring then the front, and yet it is still only a 52# spring rate difference. Without knowing the beginning spring rates and looking at the springs themselves, you can see the tighter/softer spring wound in the rear compared to the front. From this it visual it appears the rear will start out softer then the front. But this is not a scientific measurement. Even if it was stiffer then the front, the variant between front and rear spring rates still do not match up to the physics of understeer.


Another point could be that the shocks are stiffer and have a specific rebound rate the helps promote a more neutral handling vehicle.

but if it is in the shocks that really make a S-tune more neutral, and lowering is not a concern, you could run Konis that are stiffer, of hence yet run Bilsteins which are monotube, and monotube are more track driven to a point then twin tube design shocks.

stiffer does not mean it handles better.