Hi,

I was thinking about going into auto crossing and I already have the Track model with Brembos so the brakes should be good enough when I start. What I was wondering is... Are anti-roll/sway bars really needed on the Z for auto-x. I am getting these new Tein basic coilovers so that should help. but I don't know if it's worth an additional $500 for the sways?

 

yes! sways are very important for auto crossing... sways/ with some nice coilovers....NOT from tien but go with something better...like ZEAL/ Endless or JIC
with that you should be running with the A class

 

So how about this setup:

1) Borla TD Exhaust
2) JIC FLT2 Coilovers
3) 17" MB Motorsports Competition Rims with Nitto 555R II tires
4) and some sways.


What are the best sways since I don't want to spend a lot. So far I found Eibach for only $330.

 

Tein's aren't nice?! (I don't have them, back was thinking of them)
Can you give me the reason's you say zeal, endless or jic's are better than tein's? You can't get to technical or do to long of a post for me Lot's of details and such is what I want to hear.

 

You can get NISMO sway bars from performance Nissan (sponsor vendor on this website) for $385 and that includes a warranty. Do a search or call Jeff at (626) 305-3000..good luck. I would love to see what you feel about your new suspension and sways, I am right behind you so pls pm me with feedback ok, Jeff

 

Cusco's solid rear bar is going to offer more rear bar stiffness over the nismo's hollow core bar of the same diameter. What we don't know is the hollow wall thickness of the nismo front bar and it's extra 1mm of thinckness makes it stiffer than the Cusco bar which is solid. Looking at how much the Cusco front bar weighs, it's highly likely that the thickness of it's wall isn't that thick.

We know the Cusco's can offer you 37% more bar stiffness in the front and 73% more in the rear. That net's you 44% greater rear rear roll stiffness and less underster Remember the nismo's rear hollow bar isn't going to offer as much rear bar stiffness as the Cusco rear bar.

I went with the Cusco's not so much for wanting to dial out understeer, but for wanting the setup that offered me the highest level of roll control period. Yet with the Cusco's 44% total increase in rear roll stiffness I certainly did banish most all of my understeer.

 

I'd suggest the 350evo sways. They're adjustable, which no other sway offers right now.

That's what I decided on--now all I gotta do is save a few bucks to order them.

 

350EVO sways are the only bars that come with poly bushings which make a noticeable difference. And they are adjustable to boot.....
developed on the track....
Cheers
BJ

 

Yes, absolutely true, I would have gotten them, but at the time you were in process resolving your bushing issues. Yet another choice that I think is better than the Nismo bars.

 

My Stillen bars are 3-position adjustable, front and rear.

Regarding the relative stiffness of the hollow vs. solid... as was discussed before, the actual stiffness of the hollow bar is a function of the wall thickness and diameter. Apparently, a hollow bar with sufficient wall thickness will be as stiff as a like solid bar of only slightly less diameter. I'd like to find out the specific dimensions that would make a hollow bar equivalent to its solid counterpart. FWIW, I've read that hollow torsion bars have a quicker response than solid ones, which improves suspension compliance. Perhaps that is an inherent advantage in anti-sway bars, as well

Also, something missing from these discussions is the effective bar arm-length (the distance from the bar centerline to the link mounting hole centers). This is a critical dimension for fine-tuning and a sometimes-overlooked aspect of bar design (e.g., the soft setting on my Stillen front bar puts the endlink at a very disadvantage angle -- looks like 60-70 degrees, instead of the ideal 90. In my case, Stillen says the soft position is 7% stiffer than stock -- is that a geometric calculation, based on arm length, or does it include the loss of leverage from the link angularity? I guess I'll send them an email... Of course, only one hole can be 90 degrees (directly above the suspension arm mounting hole), so multiple-position designs have built-in compromise.

This problem is exaggerated by a vehicle design that uses relatively short endlinks -- longer ones wouldn't have such a severe angularity. Of course, if the holes were closer together...

 

to answer the origional question, Yes, sway bars do make a difference and are worth the money. Make sure that you get adjustable front and rear so that you can adjust and experiment with different settings on the track. This will net you the most in usable performance.

 

I do more reading than posting, and quite a bit of autoX on the weekends, so since SK sounds like he may be trying it out for the first time .... I should mention that you may want to take the modifications real slow.

If you go to an SCCA event and run plain stock you'll be in the BStock classification, very competitive and lots of fun. If you make the suspension mods you're discussing, especially coilovers or rear sways, you'll be moving up into Prepared. If you're there just for fun, it won't make any difference, but if you want to be competitive you don't want to be in any of the Prepared classes. These folk often have $15000 or more in suspension mods in my local area.

My suggestion would be to spend a few time running in Stock Novice classes and size up the competition, then add one thing at a time to get a feel for what each mod means and how it works for your Z. The car is very nice but is heavy as a tank so good tires, and lots of practice for the driver are the best go-fast mods. Solo is 70% driver, they say. J

 

I'll start by running stock. THen when my stock tires wear out I'll put in some nice tires that I can keep on for street but good at the course with moderate wear. After Then I'll invest in some xseason I'll buy some Enkei rims and put them on with some Nitto's or Victoracers to start.

Should I put on the NISMO Sways first or put on the coilovers first?

 

I'm getting Cusco sways from Bulletproof Automotive.

Victor

 

Anyone??????