Possible Hotchkis Sway Bar fix
#1
Possible Hotchkis Sway Bar fix
Has anyone else noticed that the Hotchkis sway bars move back and forth in the bushing? Well I decided to try and correct that and make it more like the stock setup by putting shaft collars around the bar. So far it seems to be working. I'm reserving my final opinion until after my next track day. I got the collars at Mcmaster-Carr, part #'s 6436k141 and 6436k146. About $35 bucks for all four shipped.
Last edited by zillinois; 10-01-2004 at 08:21 PM.
#2
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pardon the question if its dumb, but wats so bad with them shifting a little... I mean they are clamped down pretty tight with the 4 bolts in the front and the 2 in the back so any movement is really minimal isnt it? Does it make noises? Cuz i just put mine on and wondered about that for a sec but then thought it would be a big deal.
thanks
thanks
#3
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any play in the bushings means less anti-roll bar stiffness, which means more body roll. generally, bushings that allow play will result in less communicative chassis feel.
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Originally posted by autois4pussies
pardon the question if its dumb, but wats so bad with them shifting a little... I mean they are clamped down pretty tight with the 4 bolts in the front and the 2 in the back so any movement is really minimal isnt it? Does it make noises? Cuz i just put mine on and wondered about that for a sec but then thought it would be a big deal.
thanks
pardon the question if its dumb, but wats so bad with them shifting a little... I mean they are clamped down pretty tight with the 4 bolts in the front and the 2 in the back so any movement is really minimal isnt it? Does it make noises? Cuz i just put mine on and wondered about that for a sec but then thought it would be a big deal.
thanks
#6
Thanks for all the responses guys. The reason I put the collars on is because my sway bars were all the way to one side all the time. They weren't making noise, but my tires started to show uneven tire wear at track events after putting the sways on. I don't have proof that the sways made the uneven wear, but it started shortly after the bars.
I'm sure its not critical, but I track my car regularly and I think it is just better to have that sway in the position where it was designed to be. Sway bars are levers. And if you change the fulcrum points or torsional characteristics it changes how the bar behaves. I'm pretty sure the bar was designed to have some travel in the bushings, but I doubt it was designed to work at its best all the way to one side. I did leave a small amount of room for play in the collars. Approximately 3/16" on each one.
So far, with the exception of the tire wear, I have really enjoyed the sways. When you set them to tight/tight it makes a dramatic difference in the Z's handling. That was a little much even for track days, so I have backed off and now I'm at medium/medium. Great bang for the buck mod.
I'm sure its not critical, but I track my car regularly and I think it is just better to have that sway in the position where it was designed to be. Sway bars are levers. And if you change the fulcrum points or torsional characteristics it changes how the bar behaves. I'm pretty sure the bar was designed to have some travel in the bushings, but I doubt it was designed to work at its best all the way to one side. I did leave a small amount of room for play in the collars. Approximately 3/16" on each one.
So far, with the exception of the tire wear, I have really enjoyed the sways. When you set them to tight/tight it makes a dramatic difference in the Z's handling. That was a little much even for track days, so I have backed off and now I'm at medium/medium. Great bang for the buck mod.
#7
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Originally posted by 03Z33
do other sways (ie:cusco,nismo,350evo) have this additional play as well? sorry haven't paid much attention to those when under the car...
do other sways (ie:cusco,nismo,350evo) have this additional play as well? sorry haven't paid much attention to those when under the car...
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zillinois: I just orderd a pair of Hotchkis and hadn't noticed your thread before. I'll probably get those collars but do they work ? I would think they would move if that much force is put on them ?
#9
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Here's a direct link to the company.
http://www.mcmaster.com/
All you have to do is plug in the part numbers Zillinois list's in the find products window in the upper left corner and your done.
BTW, the Cusco sway's do have the collar's. I had not idea that the EVO sway's had them.
http://www.mcmaster.com/
All you have to do is plug in the part numbers Zillinois list's in the find products window in the upper left corner and your done.
BTW, the Cusco sway's do have the collar's. I had not idea that the EVO sway's had them.
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I am planning on buying a set of hotchkis for my G35 sedan too. How should I install this collar thing if I am to buy a set??
Should I leave a little space for movement??
Should I leave a little space for movement??
#11
Originally posted by Gsedan35
Here's a direct link to the company.
http://www.mcmaster.com/
All you have to do is plug in the part numbers Zillinois list's in the find products window in the upper left corner and your done.
BTW, the Cusco sway's do have the collar's. I had not idea that the EVO sway's had them.
Here's a direct link to the company.
http://www.mcmaster.com/
All you have to do is plug in the part numbers Zillinois list's in the find products window in the upper left corner and your done.
BTW, the Cusco sway's do have the collar's. I had not idea that the EVO sway's had them.
Thanks for the link!
#12
Originally posted by 35ounces
I just orderd a pair of Hotchkis and hadn't noticed your thread before. I'll probably get those collars but do they work ? I would think they would move if that much force is put on them ?
I just orderd a pair of Hotchkis and hadn't noticed your thread before. I'll probably get those collars but do they work ? I would think they would move if that much force is put on them ?
Originally posted by Grex
I am planning on buying a set of hotchkis for my G35 sedan too. How should I install this collar thing if I am to buy a set??
Should I leave a little space for movement??
I am planning on buying a set of hotchkis for my G35 sedan too. How should I install this collar thing if I am to buy a set??
Should I leave a little space for movement??
And if you do put the collars on, I would leave a little space for play. The endlinks that the sways connect to are designed to move back and forth, so I'm assuming that some play is expected. Most of the force produced by the sways is torsional not lateral. Also, most other sways run some kind of collar.
The front collars have the least amount of room for mounting. I could not get the fronts to sit exactly flush against the bushing because the bar is radiused. But its pretty close. The back fits perfectly.
My next track weekend is next Saturday & Sunday. I'll be at Road America for two days. That should really put the collars to the test.
Here's a pic of the rear fitment. The pic in the first post is of the front fitment. You can see that it does not fit exactly flush.
Last edited by zillinois; 10-04-2004 at 03:49 AM.
#13
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Same here, the hotchkis sway bars moved all the way to the one side and have seemed to remain there. I also track the car somewhat. I don't notice too much noise or anything, and yes the sways make a major improvement even with them shifted.
Does anyone know how much play there is on the other adjustable brands (350Evo or Cusco)?
Does anyone know how much play there is on the other adjustable brands (350Evo or Cusco)?
#14
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Good post, I noticed this too, the fact that OEM has them, and the hotchkis didn't. All that lateral play in the sway introduces more dirt into the greased bushings and reduces the initial response during turn-in, especially if the bar as to more laterally first before can apply torsion to the bars. I guess that's one reason why the sways were so inexpensive. I'm definitely ordering a set of these collars. Really, thanks for the info zillinois.
My sways are getting a bit squeaky, and I'm pretty sure it's because I drove on a dirt road for 5 miles, and all that dirt/dust got into the bushings.
My sways are getting a bit squeaky, and I'm pretty sure it's because I drove on a dirt road for 5 miles, and all that dirt/dust got into the bushings.
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Well, I'm going to try these to see if they will help solve the creaking noise I have when I hit bumps while turning and while going up inclines at an angle - the Hotchkis sways work great when they are pushed hard, but they make a ton of noise on the street... I've tried relubing them, but nothing seems to help... hopefully, this will be the solution - thanks Zillinois!!!
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Originally posted by bwzabodyn
Well, I'm going to try these to see if they will help solve the creaking noise I have when I hit bumps while turning and while going up inclines at an angle - the Hotchkis sways work great when they are pushed hard, but they make a ton of noise on the street... I've tried relubing them, but nothing seems to help... hopefully, this will be the solution - thanks Zillinois!!!
Well, I'm going to try these to see if they will help solve the creaking noise I have when I hit bumps while turning and while going up inclines at an angle - the Hotchkis sways work great when they are pushed hard, but they make a ton of noise on the street... I've tried relubing them, but nothing seems to help... hopefully, this will be the solution - thanks Zillinois!!!
These shaft collars look very promising for increased handling improvement and noise reduction, and for $35 bucks I will definetely give them a try. Thanks!
Last edited by 350zluvr; 10-04-2004 at 11:48 AM.
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Question About Movement
When the wheels are turned right or left, doesn't the sway bar shift to accomodate the change in distance to endlinks? I know this might sound a bit stupid seeing as you, zillinois, have already track tested this, but I could have sworn that the bar shifted side to side when the steering wheel was turned. Thanks for the help / explanation ahead of time.