I reset my ECU tonight using the procedure on technosquare's sight. Got rid of the check engine light and it hasn't come back on....yet - we'll see, but looks hopefull.

Car feels a little bit better - I mean it drives great. I'm going to keep working with TS and get it nailed. I'm going to see if they can increase the timing too as well as tweak my A/F

as far as my situation, just understand this is my first modded car and I don't want to feel like I just threw thousands of dollars into something that was a total waste. I know NA isn't the best as far as big gains, but I knew that beforehand. I don't feel safe with FI until I do some sort of build up.

I've been on the board for 9 months or so and tried as best as I could to do my homework before laying down $12k on NA mods. I just want to get what I paid for so to speak. I'll stick it out and hopefully things will pull together.

TS has been really great to work with and I was impressed with how fast they got my ECU back to me on my first mail out. On a lot of this stuff I'm partly frusturated with myself for not knowing more about exactly what I was going to be in for.

 

Was this on a dynapack dyno?

 

You should take a long wknd, and have your z tuned at ts while you are there.
I assume they work on both the ecu and timing?

 

No, a Mustang Dyno.

 

Did you monitor your timing as well? Just because your A/F was ok doesn't mean you wouldn't benefit from a reflash. Many people do not realize there are many other benefits from a reflash such as the throttle opening issue that is resolved, or the ability to improve throttle response at lower rpms with proper fuel delivery, increasing the redline to maximize gearing or improve acceleration after shifting to the next gear. If your timing was not advanced as far as many have found to be the "sweet spot", then you may have more potential. The throttle issue is a big one and until you have had it done, you will not know what I am talking about. It is obviously up to anyone what they want to spend their money on, but $600 for a reflash or whatever tuning you decide to do is well worth it in the end. If I lived closer to either I would definately drive there and have the ECU tuned, but I did the mail thing and in the end it has been well worth it. I will take on any of the N/A 6MT cars (non nitrous of course) with my 5AT and I will even leave my 19s on

As far as dynos, they are simply a tool to help you measure improvements and also help monitor tuning issues that need to be addressed. I prefer to do real world testing on the 1/4 mile strip. I have found that this is a more reliable measure of performance. Yes, there can be inconsistencies from run to run, but overall you can tell if there has been an improvement or not. A good 1/4 slip will also help you determine where in the rpm range you have made improvements based on the different distance times recorded. I actually used my 1/4 mile slips a lot while working with TS to get the reflash correct.

 

I just find it hard to plop $600 on something like that when I am happy with the performance, the engine seems to be running safe and fine, and the stock ECU seems to be doing its job. I haven't experienced anything like a rough idle, low voltage (with the crank pulley) or any of the other problems I read about here. I guess I could go looking for one - next time I go to the dyno I will ask what other options they have.

As for dynos vs. the strip, the strip introduces a factor that is almost impossible to predict - a driver's ability. If you go to the same dyno all the time, your results should be within a couple of hp. When you do mods and go back to the same dyno, it will give a fairly accurate result of the impact of the mods. The problem comes when people start comparing their dyno numbers against other cars done on other dyno machines - that is what is pointless. Also, not realizing that the 236hp average rwhp is just that - an average - and that 10 stock Zs can give you 10 different numbers on the same dyno. The key is to dyno YOUR Z while its stock, and whatever the number, compare it only to future dynos on your Z done on THAT SAME dyno machine. That will give you an accurate measure of your mods impact on your Z's performance.

Comparing your dyno numbers against someone else's done on another machine is just a big 'ol waste of time.

 

Spending the money vs not spending the money for the benefits of an ECU reflash or tuning for that matter is a personal choice. I just want to make sure people know there are many benefits to an ECU reflash that is done correctly, even for a car that has a good A/F ratio. I for one am the type that wants as much performance as I can get and $600 is not much for the gains I received with the ECU reflash.

Yes, there is variability in 1/4 runs as I mentioned, however real world testing still needs to occur as a dyno only tries to replicate load on the drivetrain while running the 1/4 mile is the real deal.

 

I agree with you. However, if I were to spend $600 and only register 3-4hp gain on dyno, I would be... disappointed. The only way to know if the ECU will have an impact is to know whether your car is running right or not. The problem I have is that many posts here assume off the bat their car is running badly because they installed some headers or a popcharger. If the car is pinging or something, that is one thing. But the only way you can accurately gauge the impact of the ECU reflash is to dyno your car and look at your baseline performance. You have to do that anyway since a good reflash will be customized to your car, and the only way they can customize it is if they have the car in front of them, or they have some information on how its running now.

If I felt I was going to get significant gains from the reflash, I would do it. I've spent a whole lot more on some mods that gave me zero gains (but they look gooooooood ). A reflash, however, needs to give you performance gains in order to be "worth it". All I'm saying is that you cannot assume a car will run better with a reflash without doing some due diligence first.

Peace!

 

This is where I think we disagree, which is fine, I just want to make sure people realize that your ECU in stock trim will not advance the timing on its own, nor will it allow your throttle body to open to 100%. These two factors mean there is always more to be gained with an ECU reflash. The main issue at this point is whether you want to send the ECU in through the mail and make it work, drive to one of the locations that can currently tune the stock ECU, or buy another piggyback or standalone solution and have it tuned. Either way, you will increase performance and if you have mods, the gains will be more than 3-4 HP. If done right you are looking at 10-15 HP and possibly higher depending on the situation. There are people with no mods that have gained that much with just an ECU reflash. Remember that A/F ratio is only a piece of the tuning puzzle.

 

I stated this in another thread

I have my idle permanently programmed to be at 900rpms with the TS flash. This is because I have JWT cams and if I had the stock ECU and ever had to disconnect the battery it would reset back to 700 and the car would stall uncontrolably.

My car with my mods revs FAST (tilton, UR pulley, 3.9 final drive, 350EVO throttlebody) and the raised rev limiter really helps me. I haven't hit the limiter since the flash. Before that it was every week or two...

 

Your right I have thought that all along. But I was also told that are motors are not designed for F/I esp blower, I was told depending on boost pressure turbo is ok.

I heard that some import magazine did a tear down of a 350Z motor that was supercharged. After 30,000 miles of driving/testing the motor appeared to have shown wear of 100,000 miles.

Are motors werent designed for FI. We dont have forged pistons, rods, we dont have lower compression etc. Its just not good.

Take that however you like.

 

Oh and back to the reflash, thats just garbage. How can one think that a MAILORDER tune is gonna help. All cars are different. They must be dynoed and tuned at the same time.

Do the pople tuning take into affect where the purchaser lives? There are just way to many variables that apply. Ambiant temp, altitude, weather, air, etc all affect a tune.

For instance If I tune a car at sea level, and send it to one that lives in Colorado it will be crap. Air is thinner in higher altitudes.

I understand that a dyno has a correction factor, but you have to know the correction factor. It could be so far off, its bogus.

Untill somone makes a program like LS1 Edit, I will not have my car tuned.

 

that's why you dyno and send in your charts.

TS seems to want to get the A/F perfect first by adjusting to your A/F chart, then start messing around with adding more power where it can be gained. It would be dramatically faster and more efficient to dyno tune it in person, but so far TS does these adjustments for free as long as you pay for shipping. You also need another car of some sorts while your Z is out of commision.

I'll let you guys know my results of my next TS mail tune on sat. I've given them a lot of info so it should be in much better shape.

Last time I actually could feel a nice improvement and the dyno confirmed it - about 7-8whp between 3500-5500 mainly cause I wasn't so drastically lean anymore.

 

good luck, the down time sucks though.

 

Wow that really sucks. Makes you want to get an EVO. Those guys are getting 319 WHP by only spending $1400.

 

What about the neon guys. Factory F/I is the perfect starting point for very inexpensive mods to get maximum power, but most of all decent reliabilty.

This is a quote from my buddy, who sent me an email about his truck the other day. We were talking mods and drag racing...

"I recently took the Lightning to the track. It ran 12.8 @ 109mph on
radials. I was very pleased with this. I've got less than $1000 in engine
mods to it. It makes 393rwhp/482rwtq."

 

yeah that's what a factory V8 and factory supercharger will get you - nice platform for performance

also, it's a truck so it'll probably have more room in the engine bay for bigger stuff.

Still, it weighs 4674 lbs stock

The Z will probably out handle a lightning though

if you put drag radials on a Z and $1000 of mods - probably plenum, cats/pipes, and jwt intake or UR pulley you might be close to being that fast, but probably low 13's.

Trucks do well in a straight line because of so much power and not having to turn

Don't lightnings also cost a little more than your average Z?