Which Z's have AT /w Manual?
07-30-2007, 01:35 PM
#61
psychedelic one
Originally Posted by Zivman
in the Z, the auto is an auto, not even close to a standard manual tranny. It is all gimmick
Here's my interpretation of your gimmick:
1) You enjoy creating this friction as it's allow you to feel manly and superior as you stroke yourself over the internet.
2) You were only trying to make a point and had no clue that it would start 4 pages of flaming, of which you were the main instigator....(see #1)
07-30-2007, 01:35 PM
#62
Originally Posted by rcdash
How is the auto tranny deceiving or fooling us exactly? Because it's a more advanced technological development?
Not really, just a slight variation of the standard auto - these slapsticks have been around for yrs.
Is it not changing the gear ratio between the engine and the driveshaft? It is.
I'll give you that - it is
Does it not allow you to change said gear ratio on demand? It does (despite your protests).
this is where you are wrong. it does as long as it is within a set of predefined parameters that is controlled by the ECU. And when the shift does take place it does so with a noticable delay.
I don't want the manual because the automatic is better for the two purposes I'd like to use it for: in traffic on the street,
Fair enough for traffic - I never said the manual was the better choice for you or anyone in a near stock setup (anything non boosted is near stock)
and occasional drag racing. The top two drag times on this board are in autos. Wonder why?
See, this is just foolish. The top two drag times are by cars that only resemble a Z33. the auto you are flaunting is not the auto we are talking about here. When it comes to the Z, you chose the wrong car if you are looking for a drag setup. The manual will outshine the auto in road course /autoX racing because of the control it offers the driver - which is more along the lines of what the Z was setup for...
I guess by your realm of rationalization, those that frequent the track with their near stock 6mt Z's or even boosted Z's are better swapping their manual for the 5at to attain better ET's???
The only thing you cannot do with the triptronic is go directly to neutral from within manual mode. Otherwise a 5AT provides very good control of the car and the taller gears are particularly well suited for forced induction applications.
The gearing may be, but the trans is far from being proven to hold the power. We have seen a reference to a single auto running at 500 power levels in this thread. How many 6mt are holding up to those levels and beyond? Well, let's just say it is more than one. I may not be up on every auto that has attempted to make decent power, but those applications that I have been informed about have been less than successful. But if you pull the FD out of the auto and toss it into the 6mt setup, you are better off still
You have not made one constructive or even logical argument to date in this thread. Try, really try this time...
And I think the OP is clear that the automatic is not a computer controlled manual (ala DSG). Stop beating a dead horse already.
Not really, just a slight variation of the standard auto - these slapsticks have been around for yrs.
Is it not changing the gear ratio between the engine and the driveshaft? It is.
I'll give you that - it is
Does it not allow you to change said gear ratio on demand? It does (despite your protests).
this is where you are wrong. it does as long as it is within a set of predefined parameters that is controlled by the ECU. And when the shift does take place it does so with a noticable delay.
I don't want the manual because the automatic is better for the two purposes I'd like to use it for: in traffic on the street,
Fair enough for traffic - I never said the manual was the better choice for you or anyone in a near stock setup (anything non boosted is near stock)
and occasional drag racing. The top two drag times on this board are in autos. Wonder why?
See, this is just foolish. The top two drag times are by cars that only resemble a Z33. the auto you are flaunting is not the auto we are talking about here. When it comes to the Z, you chose the wrong car if you are looking for a drag setup. The manual will outshine the auto in road course /autoX racing because of the control it offers the driver - which is more along the lines of what the Z was setup for...
I guess by your realm of rationalization, those that frequent the track with their near stock 6mt Z's or even boosted Z's are better swapping their manual for the 5at to attain better ET's???
The only thing you cannot do with the triptronic is go directly to neutral from within manual mode. Otherwise a 5AT provides very good control of the car and the taller gears are particularly well suited for forced induction applications.
The gearing may be, but the trans is far from being proven to hold the power. We have seen a reference to a single auto running at 500 power levels in this thread. How many 6mt are holding up to those levels and beyond? Well, let's just say it is more than one. I may not be up on every auto that has attempted to make decent power, but those applications that I have been informed about have been less than successful. But if you pull the FD out of the auto and toss it into the 6mt setup, you are better off still
You have not made one constructive or even logical argument to date in this thread. Try, really try this time...
And I think the OP is clear that the automatic is not a computer controlled manual (ala DSG). Stop beating a dead horse already.
Last edited by Zivman; 07-30-2007 at 01:38 PM.
07-30-2007, 01:47 PM
#63
Does it not allow you to change said gear ratio on demand? It does (despite your protests).
this is where you are wrong. it does as long as it is within a set of predefined parameters that is controlled by the ECU. And when the shift does take place it does so with a noticable delay.
this is where you are wrong. it does as long as it is within a set of predefined parameters that is controlled by the ECU. And when the shift does take place it does so with a noticable delay.
The delay can be minimized to where it is faster than you can ever shift using a manual. Deal with it. You don't know this because you haven't kept up with the latest advancements. Learn.
The top two drag times are by cars that only resemble a Z33. the auto you are flaunting is not the auto we are talking about here
The gearing may be, but the trans is far from being proven to hold the power. We have seen a reference to a single auto running at 500 power levels in this thread. How many 6mt are holding up to those levels and beyond? Well, let's just say it is more than one. I may not be up on every auto that has attempted to make decent power, but those applications that I have been informed about have been less than successful.
But if you pull the FD out of the auto and toss it into the 6mt setup, you are better off still
07-30-2007, 01:57 PM
#65
Originally Posted by Z MANIA
Okay. Here is your jumping in post. The OP's question was answered with the first post. Why not leave it alone? What was your reason was altering the direction of this thread to the inevitable ending that it got?
Here's my interpretation of your gimmick:
1) You enjoy creating this friction as it's allow you to feel manly and superior as you stroke yourself over the internet.
2) You were only trying to make a point and had no clue that it would start 4 pages of flaming, of which you were the main instigator....(see #1)
Here's my interpretation of your gimmick:
1) You enjoy creating this friction as it's allow you to feel manly and superior as you stroke yourself over the internet.
2) You were only trying to make a point and had no clue that it would start 4 pages of flaming, of which you were the main instigator....(see #1)
+1. Some people are just too hard headed for their own good... oh well, i gave it the good 'ol college try. Come out to Z dayZ next year zivman and you'll see what a 500+ whp autos can do... There should hopefully be a fully built GTM and fully built SGP tranny there
07-30-2007, 01:57 PM
#66
Originally Posted by rcdash
Ok, let's do this one at a time. Can you shift into 1st gear going 100 mph? Would you want to? What is your problem understanding this? The 5AT was designed to be "smart", as in not blow up your engine. What parameters and what kind of ECU "control" are you so paranoid about?
The delay can be minimized to where it is faster than you can ever shift using a manual. Deal with it. You don't know this because you haven't kept up with the latest advancements. Learn.
And I never said you didn't need to upgrade an auto for FI. Just like you upgrade your MT for FI. I did say it was more expensive for the auto for high hp, but almost all high hp dragsters use autos.
Admittedly, it has taken longer for upgrades for the auto. That's because it's more advanced and more complicated. That said, both SGP and GTM have solutions now for 500 whp+. Do you trust either of these shops? A GM tranny will no longer be required for high hp.
Wrong. Do the math. By my reckoning, the gears are *still* longer in the 5AT even if a 6MT puts in a 3.3 diff.
The delay can be minimized to where it is faster than you can ever shift using a manual. Deal with it. You don't know this because you haven't kept up with the latest advancements. Learn.
And I never said you didn't need to upgrade an auto for FI. Just like you upgrade your MT for FI. I did say it was more expensive for the auto for high hp, but almost all high hp dragsters use autos.
Admittedly, it has taken longer for upgrades for the auto. That's because it's more advanced and more complicated. That said, both SGP and GTM have solutions now for 500 whp+. Do you trust either of these shops? A GM tranny will no longer be required for high hp.
Wrong. Do the math. By my reckoning, the gears are *still* longer in the 5AT even if a 6MT puts in a 3.3 diff.
Originally Posted by rcdash
The auto is not a gimmick zivman. It is certainly not perfect though. There is about a 1/4 second electronic delay in stock form, which can be completely elminated with a good grounding kit (you will see the electronic display on the console change instantly after the kit is installed).
If you want to reference GTM and SGP specifically we can take it to PM.
07-30-2007, 02:00 PM
#67
Originally Posted by rcdash
+1. Some people are just too hard headed for their own good... oh well, i gave it the good 'ol college try. Come out to Z dayZ next year zivman and you'll see what a 500+ whp autos can do... There should hopefully be a fully built GTM and fully built SGP tranny there
Maybe while I am there I can get a good feel of what a TN setup is all about as well
07-30-2007, 02:03 PM
#68
You want to discuss the theory behind the improvements associated with a grounding kit on the 5AT? You think a proper ground on complex electronics is unimportant?
What technical expertise do you have in the matter Zivman? Got a PhD we should know about? If not, then I wouldn't go attacking someone else's credibility...
What technical expertise do you have in the matter Zivman? Got a PhD we should know about? If not, then I wouldn't go attacking someone else's credibility...
07-30-2007, 02:09 PM
#69
Originally Posted by rcdash
You want to discuss the theory behind the improvements associated with a grounding kit on the 5AT? You think a proper ground on complex electronics is unimportant?
What technical expertise do you have in the matter Zivman? Got a PhD we should know about? If not, then I wouldn't go attacking someone else's credibility...
What technical expertise do you have in the matter Zivman? Got a PhD we should know about? If not, then I wouldn't go attacking someone else's credibility...
07-30-2007, 02:10 PM
#70
Originally Posted by Zivman
You tend to my fields and I would be more than happy to show up. I have a limited window to make a living and unfortunately that time overlaps with ZdayZ. I am open for mid Oct Zdayz or late March ZdayZ
Maybe while I am there I can get a good feel of what a TN setup is all about as well
Maybe while I am there I can get a good feel of what a TN setup is all about as well
It's just a few days - it'll certainly be easier to show to you than explain to you
07-30-2007, 02:15 PM
#71
Originally Posted by Zivman
This is off topic enough. Please send me a fully detailed informative PM if you like about the improvements associated with a grounding kits. I have discussed grounding kits in very specific details with those that have related PhD's as well as with shops that have plenty of experience with them. I have also done side by side comparison tests with other makes and models of cars with groundings kits and guess what.... they aren't worth a ****. If all it took were a few extra wires here and there to provide noticable differences like you state I would think the entire automotive industry would be following suit and installing them from the factory
http://g35driver.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55081
It's a good start if you'd like some reading not just from engineers, but from dozens of real world users...
07-30-2007, 02:35 PM
#72
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Originally Posted by Zivman
I am done. I have said what I have to say. Believe what you want.
THE TCU CONTROLS THE SHIFTING, NOT THE ECU! Stop talking about stuff you have no clue about. And stop dragging OP's thread way off topic with the manual vs. manual mode debate. He never once asked if it was like driving a damn manual, EVER! He only wanted to know if there were auto's that didn't come with the MM and about fully auto keeping up with FI. Here's proof:
Originally Posted by freemist
I wasn't trying to debate AT vs. manual. I'm just looking at purchasing an AT 350z and I know the vortechs have had issues with upshifting if your in 'normal drive' with an AT.
07-30-2007, 02:56 PM
#75
Originally Posted by Cube
I thought you were done? And you wanna know how I know that you're a complete moron and know NOTHING about the 5AT?
THE TCU CONTROLS THE SHIFTING, NOT THE ECU! Stop talking about stuff you have no clue about. And stop dragging OP's thread way off topic with the manual vs. manual mode debate. He never once asked if it was like driving a damn manual, EVER! He only wanted to know if there were auto's that didn't come with the MM and about fully auto keeping up with FI. Here's proof:
I answered all of his questions regarding the latter in post #35, and his first question was answered in post #2. So WHY did you even open this thread? To pollute it with useless WRONG information?
THE TCU CONTROLS THE SHIFTING, NOT THE ECU! Stop talking about stuff you have no clue about. And stop dragging OP's thread way off topic with the manual vs. manual mode debate. He never once asked if it was like driving a damn manual, EVER! He only wanted to know if there were auto's that didn't come with the MM and about fully auto keeping up with FI. Here's proof:
I answered all of his questions regarding the latter in post #35, and his first question was answered in post #2. So WHY did you even open this thread? To pollute it with useless WRONG information?
08-01-2007, 11:09 AM
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I have a 5AT 350z '03 but I've been considering doing a manual transmission swap to it.
Will it be just the same as stick?
Also what do I need in order to make this happen?
or... on the other hand should i just stick with my 5AT?
Will it be just the same as stick?
Also what do I need in order to make this happen?
or... on the other hand should i just stick with my 5AT?
08-01-2007, 12:08 PM
#78
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Originally Posted by pyanq
I have a 5AT 350z '03 but I've been considering doing a manual transmission swap to it.
Will it be just the same as stick?
Also what do I need in order to make this happen?
or... on the other hand should i just stick with my 5AT?
Will it be just the same as stick?
Also what do I need in order to make this happen?
or... on the other hand should i just stick with my 5AT?
