APS TT or JWT TT?!?
03-17-2006, 08:59 AM
#21
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From experience... APS is impossible to deal with and does not honor warranties. I learned the hard way that the right installer/tuner is more important than the kit. I would call Sharif and work with him to decide what kit is right for your needs.
03-17-2006, 09:54 AM
#22
Originally Posted by Oleg
COJ, your options with your location are pretty much limited to APS. Comparing full kit to a full kit, I'd say they are just about same out of the box. If you were to go over the facotry setting in either one, both would need extra stuff. APS is good for about 450whp, after that you'll need new injectors and EMS. With JWT, the stock injectors are maxed out with the out-of-the-box kit, so. But w/the turbo size APS TT has a greater hp potential. And when going for a high whp w/built motor an all, you'll probably have to run more boost on the JWT (with all the consequenses) to achieve it.
Keep in mind that the ultimate goal of the JWT was to be a CARB exempt turbo kit, and that was not the case for APS, so that puts a lot of constraints of JWT that APS is not hindered by.
Also, all JWT dyno charts look like the power curve begins to taper after about 5800 rpm, but it's not an issue for a street car, I am sure that you are not driving around bouncing off the limiter all the time.
Having said all that, despite the horrorr stories about the APS customer service, I would still use APS, but only if the installer would be able to address potential problems quickly.
Keep in mind that the ultimate goal of the JWT was to be a CARB exempt turbo kit, and that was not the case for APS, so that puts a lot of constraints of JWT that APS is not hindered by.
Also, all JWT dyno charts look like the power curve begins to taper after about 5800 rpm, but it's not an issue for a street car, I am sure that you are not driving around bouncing off the limiter all the time.
Having said all that, despite the horrorr stories about the APS customer service, I would still use APS, but only if the installer would be able to address potential problems quickly.
As far as the APS being good for 450 hp out of box, that is not true. On stock compression with the out of box injectors, EMS, and actuators, you can easily get into the 500's whp.
If setup properly, I have no doubt both the APS and JWT kits will easily impress any Z owner/driver. Out of box though, I still think APS is a better/more complete kit that has been on the market longer with a more proven track record. The JWT kit has been running on a total of a dozen to dozen and a half cars for a few months now, but I doubt we will see it fully mass released anytime soon based on them waiting on CARB approval.
All the talk about APS and warranty issues is mostly hear say and forum BS. Don't get me wrong, I know of some people that have had less than desirable experiences with APS in terms of customer service, inlcuding myself, but at least in my case, I take partial blame on the way the situation evolved. That said, if he runs his car up to Japtrix, I have no doubt the APS setup will exceed his expectations and have no issues with any warranty.
In the end, your money, your car, so go with what you feel most comfortable with. Being that you have Japtrix so close, I would jump all over an APS setup and call it a day.
03-17-2006, 10:02 AM
#23
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Im prety sure there are only 2 shops installing JWT kits
1. VRT way over on the West
2. that one up north(?)
JWT way more limted since the Kits not out to the public(like the other kits APS,Greddy,PE)
1. VRT way over on the West
2. that one up north(?)
JWT way more limted since the Kits not out to the public(like the other kits APS,Greddy,PE)
03-17-2006, 10:05 AM
#24
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Zivman has a point, but Shariff has the JWT kits now and I would entrust him with my car in a heartbeat!! VRT does great work as well, but both places are not in FL. I did no research on this, but it is my understanding that the APS is expensive as well as the install, due to the small number of installers.
03-17-2006, 10:17 AM
#25
Originally Posted by Navygolf13
Zivman has a point, but Shariff has the JWT kits now and I would entrust him with my car in a heartbeat!! VRT does great work as well, but both places are not in FL. I did no research on this, but it is my understanding that the APS is expensive as well as the install, due to the small number of installers.
As far as the APS being expensive, I dont' agree. Be it the greddy or jwt, if you factor in a complete setup that APS offers, I think you will find all are close to the same price. In regards to install, they all will be within in spitting distance as well.
03-17-2006, 10:24 AM
#26
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didn't know sharif had the JWT.....in that case id prolly go w/ the JWT......but APS is still a good choice since Japtrix is right there.but im sure they would be happy to install both..
03-17-2006, 10:31 AM
#27
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My warranty experience with APS and Peter is far from BS! I had a bad wiring harness, waste gate and actual turbo that they won't warranty. Their customer services just plain sucks. If I had it to do over again, I would:
1) Ship the car to Sharif
2) Have him build the engine
3) Work with him on my goals and decide together what the best kit is
4) Have Sharif install and tune my kit and built engine.
Which btw is what I am doing now after spending over 15K and getting a fuked up car?
1) Ship the car to Sharif
2) Have him build the engine
3) Work with him on my goals and decide together what the best kit is
4) Have Sharif install and tune my kit and built engine.
Which btw is what I am doing now after spending over 15K and getting a fuked up car?
03-17-2006, 10:32 AM
#28
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Originally Posted by Navygolf13
Forget the APS....I have driven the JWT kit with smaller turbos and the larger ones. There is not a big difference between the two in terms of driveability or turbo lag. If you want the high HP then get the bigger turbos on the JWT. Realistically though at 12.5 PSI I have 504rwhp and 567rwtq. Tell me those aren't high numbers. The kit drives awesome and does very well on the track. That is the whole goal of VRT, build a track car. They have numerous cars that run VERY well at the track.
I do not know how many of these guys talking about APS have driven a JWT, but until you can drive them both you cannot compare. Also, like they said the track record for service is horrendous with APS and the fact that there are not that many installers/tuners for the APS is a drawback. I know right now the JWT is not readily available but it will be.
I truly think the only way to make this decision is to drive all the TT kits for yourself, because they ALL have pros and cons.
I do not know how many of these guys talking about APS have driven a JWT, but until you can drive them both you cannot compare. Also, like they said the track record for service is horrendous with APS and the fact that there are not that many installers/tuners for the APS is a drawback. I know right now the JWT is not readily available but it will be.
I truly think the only way to make this decision is to drive all the TT kits for yourself, because they ALL have pros and cons.
I haven't driven either. Turbo kits are rare in Denver, so I am only going off of what I have read and seen in the dyno charts. JWT seems ideal for my goals, it sounds like you can confirm that.
03-17-2006, 10:46 AM
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COJ if you go with aps I would by the kit from the place you have it installed from. The reason being is most of the time if you bring them the kit you assume the resonsibilty to return the parts for any warranty issues that may occur. Performance shops are not like nissan where you can bring in your car and they fix it under warranty. So if you save a few dollars on a kit think about long term service. If your intrested in contacting Japtrix pm me and I'll give you the contact info. Just so you know they are dealers for other kits also TN, Greddy. As far as jwt 99% of the dynos are on built motors there are 1 or 2 that are on stock motors done at performance motorsports in NY.
03-17-2006, 10:56 AM
#30
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"Big difference" in driveability? I would not say huge, but I do know that the JWT is very nice. I have driven APS, Greddy, JWT with both sizes of turbos, and as far as I am concerned the JWT is by far the best all around.
As for built motors, most are as far as I know built with the JWT, but if you are going FI then you should build your motor. No sense taking any additional risks with your baby. Build it for more power than you will ever use and you do not have to worry about it blowing up!
As for built motors, most are as far as I know built with the JWT, but if you are going FI then you should build your motor. No sense taking any additional risks with your baby. Build it for more power than you will ever use and you do not have to worry about it blowing up!
03-17-2006, 11:34 AM
#31
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Not everybody wants or needs 600+ hp. So it's not necessary to build it. The aps tt kits can hit boost just as fast as the jwt it all depends on how it's tuned. I've seen it myself on my car form my tuner. It depends on how much relibility and longevity you want on a stock bottom.
03-17-2006, 11:47 AM
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I have never driven an APS TT'd car so I can't comment on that but I have the JWT kit on my G35 right now and I agree with what everybody here is saying about the kit. I have it on a stock motor and I dyno'd 350whp on a mustang dyno without any tuning and nothing else done. So on a dynojet the number would be a little higher. If I got it tuned and turned the boost up to 8.5 like APS I'm sure the kits will be around the same hp. With either kit I'm sure you will be happy. What turned me on about the JWT is the faster spooling turbo's, and I like the dual intercoolers for the G35. The most important thing is I know what a name JWT has given themselves with Nissan's. My friends were all into the 300zx's back in the day and all I heard was JWT from everybody. I figured they knew these cars inside out so I went with them.
03-17-2006, 12:19 PM
#33
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What I meant about building the engine was that if you put a TT on and do anything other than like 8.5 PSI they should build their engine. It is something that is easier and cheaper than doing it after it blows. My thought process is that if you go FI then you should build the engine. No reason not to. Bottom line is that pretty much whoever you talk to is going to say that the kit they have is the way to go. Although I have driven a bunch and would not want anything other than the JWT.
03-17-2006, 12:27 PM
#34
Both kits are excellent. Get what is going to be within your price range (kit + install + tune) and figure in availabilty and then get the one that makes the most sense for you.
I have the JWT and I am VERY happy with it, but unlike other people on this thread I am not going to just be biased and just my kit. ALL turbo set-ups have there pro's and con's.
I have the JWT and I am VERY happy with it, but unlike other people on this thread I am not going to just be biased and just my kit. ALL turbo set-ups have there pro's and con's.
03-17-2006, 01:37 PM
#36
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First you must decide what is most important about the kits and compare.
Also, there are more than 2 places to install the JWT TT kit.
I have an APS TT, the kit is amazing. I happen to be lucky enough to work around the corner from and have a great personal relationship with Zcargarage. They just finished up a G35 sedan with cams, JWT TT, and a whole lot of other stuff. The JWT TT kit is very nice, smooth power and just like the APS.
Service:
JWT owns the cake in this department, I have JWT Cams, Flywheel, and clutch and they have been excellent products and the service is perfect.
Aps isn't as helpful, and when they are its to tout the kit itself or belittle the tuner or user community. But they have a cool design and great kit.
Form fit:
JWT has a good fit but not excellent. I don't like how you can see the IC pipes in front of the radiator but its very nice.
APS looks amazing and their detail and fit is very good a lil better than JWT, IMO.
Performance:
JWT is very good out of the box on nearly 6psi Zcargarage was able to hit 400 and 400+ft lbs. torque.
APS has good performance out of the box but I have seen several issues, smoking turbos, bad wiring harnesses, turbo went bad. I haven't seen any issues on my car tho so I've been lucky.
Overall
imo, If i would do it all over it would be a very hard choice. I like the JWT but its not as sleek like the APS. I like the APS but the service, attitude and the fact they are half way around the world sux. If i needed a new IC how long would that take? Or any other part? JWT is local and has a very good relationship with my shop that I go to. So, it would be hard but i would probably have to go with JWT for its outstanding reputation, quality, and accessibility. Either kit is a Win/win situation as they are very top notch.
Also, there are more than 2 places to install the JWT TT kit.
I have an APS TT, the kit is amazing. I happen to be lucky enough to work around the corner from and have a great personal relationship with Zcargarage. They just finished up a G35 sedan with cams, JWT TT, and a whole lot of other stuff. The JWT TT kit is very nice, smooth power and just like the APS.
Service:
JWT owns the cake in this department, I have JWT Cams, Flywheel, and clutch and they have been excellent products and the service is perfect.
Aps isn't as helpful, and when they are its to tout the kit itself or belittle the tuner or user community. But they have a cool design and great kit.
Form fit:
JWT has a good fit but not excellent. I don't like how you can see the IC pipes in front of the radiator but its very nice.
APS looks amazing and their detail and fit is very good a lil better than JWT, IMO.
Performance:
JWT is very good out of the box on nearly 6psi Zcargarage was able to hit 400 and 400+ft lbs. torque.
APS has good performance out of the box but I have seen several issues, smoking turbos, bad wiring harnesses, turbo went bad. I haven't seen any issues on my car tho so I've been lucky.
Overall
imo, If i would do it all over it would be a very hard choice. I like the JWT but its not as sleek like the APS. I like the APS but the service, attitude and the fact they are half way around the world sux. If i needed a new IC how long would that take? Or any other part? JWT is local and has a very good relationship with my shop that I go to. So, it would be hard but i would probably have to go with JWT for its outstanding reputation, quality, and accessibility. Either kit is a Win/win situation as they are very top notch.
03-17-2006, 01:53 PM
#39
Originally Posted by dosu350
Can someone define a "built engine"? is that just new rods, pistons and such?
A built engine can be anything from a built short block like I am running - rods/pistons/head and main studs ->to a fully built long block with the rods/pistons/head and main studs with head work and cams. The JWT setups that are showing big numbers are running full long blocks with cams.
03-17-2006, 01:58 PM
#40
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Originally Posted by barthelb
First you must decide what is most important about the kits and compare.
Also, there are more than 2 places to install the JWT TT kit.
I have an APS TT, the kit is amazing. I happen to be lucky enough to work around the corner from and have a great personal relationship with Zcargarage. They just finished up a G35 sedan with cams, JWT TT, and a whole lot of other stuff. The JWT TT kit is very nice, smooth power and just like the APS.
Service:
JWT owns the cake in this department, I have JWT Cams, Flywheel, and clutch and they have been excellent products and the service is perfect.
Aps isn't as helpful, and when they are its to tout the kit itself or belittle the tuner or user community. But they have a cool design and great kit.
Form fit:
JWT has a good fit but not excellent. I don't like how you can see the IC pipes in front of the radiator but its very nice.
APS looks amazing and their detail and fit is very good a lil better than JWT, IMO.
Performance:
JWT is very good out of the box on nearly 6psi Zcargarage was able to hit 400 and 400+ft lbs. torque.
APS has good performance out of the box but I have seen several issues, smoking turbos, bad wiring harnesses, turbo went bad. I haven't seen any issues on my car tho so I've been lucky.
Overall
imo, If i would do it all over it would be a very hard choice. I like the JWT but its not as sleek like the APS. I like the APS but the service, attitude and the fact they are half way around the world sux. If i needed a new IC how long would that take? Or any other part? JWT is local and has a very good relationship with my shop that I go to. So, it would be hard but i would probably have to go with JWT for its outstanding reputation, quality, and accessibility. Either kit is a Win/win situation as they are very top notch.
Also, there are more than 2 places to install the JWT TT kit.
I have an APS TT, the kit is amazing. I happen to be lucky enough to work around the corner from and have a great personal relationship with Zcargarage. They just finished up a G35 sedan with cams, JWT TT, and a whole lot of other stuff. The JWT TT kit is very nice, smooth power and just like the APS.
Service:
JWT owns the cake in this department, I have JWT Cams, Flywheel, and clutch and they have been excellent products and the service is perfect.
Aps isn't as helpful, and when they are its to tout the kit itself or belittle the tuner or user community. But they have a cool design and great kit.
Form fit:
JWT has a good fit but not excellent. I don't like how you can see the IC pipes in front of the radiator but its very nice.
APS looks amazing and their detail and fit is very good a lil better than JWT, IMO.
Performance:
JWT is very good out of the box on nearly 6psi Zcargarage was able to hit 400 and 400+ft lbs. torque.
APS has good performance out of the box but I have seen several issues, smoking turbos, bad wiring harnesses, turbo went bad. I haven't seen any issues on my car tho so I've been lucky.
Overall
imo, If i would do it all over it would be a very hard choice. I like the JWT but its not as sleek like the APS. I like the APS but the service, attitude and the fact they are half way around the world sux. If i needed a new IC how long would that take? Or any other part? JWT is local and has a very good relationship with my shop that I go to. So, it would be hard but i would probably have to go with JWT for its outstanding reputation, quality, and accessibility. Either kit is a Win/win situation as they are very top notch.
