MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

Now thats the way you should have posted as opposed to telling everyone here how behind they are. I still don't see dozens of 1000 WHP Zs in the near future regardless of engine management. More work needs to be done on the motor and drivetrain side to make them "street" 1000 WHP Zs. A Turbo400 tranny is NOT a "street" gear box. I think that needs to be recognized. The EMS is not going to magically make the motor handle 1000 WHP all day long. In fact its taken several thousand dollars in custom work to do that to date. Big ups to those that are pushing us there though like Sharif, Overzealous, MRC, AAM, etc.

Julian@MRC

iTrader: (28)

Tell that to all the Mullet wearing Mustang and F Body guys that have been running them since the late 80's

Mr. IS300T

Are there any boosted guys in Miami area that are interested in running an AEM..

Julian@MRC

iTrader: (28)

Here is the bottom line...The AEM unit or ANY unit in itself will not make 1000whp on any car,it will simply give an "EXPERIENCED" tuner the tools and ability to safely tune all the parameters needed to support such high HP levels.
There are a few systems on the market already that have worked fine for everyones budget and HP needs. You have entry level systems such as the Uni-chip and Emanage Blue, then mid level systems such as the Emanage Ultimate and UTEC, and for the big DAWGS you will have the HKS and AEM. This will simply allow tuners and engine builders to have different levels or "Choices" when building a car.
No unit is a savior, the main determining factor is the tuner and his/her ability to tune the vehicle as equipped.
Do you think Performance Motorsports made their HP on a Unichip? They needed to go full standalone (Motec) and even then it did not like to play nice with the DBW, so they had to go to a manual TB and cable set up.
Another thing to consider when comparing 1000Hp supras and vipers to the VQ motor is the design of the motor itself..You comparing an "open deck" Aluminum V6 block to a flat inline6 STEEL block that is capable of 800-900 on the stock motor and a 8 Liter V10 motor, which IMO is not even in the same playing field..To produce 1000whp out of a VQ35 motor safely and consistantly is going to take alot more $$$$$$ than 99% of people are willing to spend, therefore I do not predict alot of 1000+hp 350Z's running around anytime soon...Because if it were that easy, companies like Top Secret and Options would have already done it on a regular basis..

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

Thank you this is one of the points I have been trying to make all day..

Julian@MRC

iTrader: (28)

Yeah, but your going about it the wrong way..Larry knows his ****, and is a pioneer on many levels.He is probably one of 2 people on this forum that actually know their **** and dont just repeat what others say or what they read..
So be nice to him...Trust me.

SoundPerformance

So who has tried what and made it work o the head lifting issues??


We went thru similar 'growing pains' with the 2J motor.... But as some of you stated already... we did have less problems to deal with being a steel block.

What we learned with the 2J:

Stock bottom end can make 1000 RWHP on dyno repeatedly but on the street the rods become a liability past 850 RWHP.

Factory head bolts will allow head to lift @ 1000 RWHP.
Fix # 1 : Use L19 head studs or 1/2 head studs. (Regular ARP 11mm head studs offer no better clamping than factory bolts)
Fix # 2 : Control ignition timing!! We run very little!!!
Fix # 3 : Use nitrogen filled O rings along with steel shim HG (very few guys use this)

Factory main caps will flex and crack at ~ 1200 RWHP.
Fix : Billet main caps

Factory block will split causing vertical cracks inside of cylinders at ~ 1250+ RWHP
Fix : hard block, control detonation using VP import fuel, run very little timing.


I am going to begin building our motor soon.... of course sleeving it, O ringing it using nitrogen O rings, perhaps a girdle for the main caps.....

The turbos I am using will support 1000 RWHP so I plan on testing the motor to the breaking point.

That is how we learned so much on the 2J..... testing to failure. We had the 88mm turbo on it, pulled off the wastegate and blocked it, ran it until it failed! It hit 60+ psi on the NOS = 1520 RWHP!!! We pulled it apart and found the main caps were moving around (none failed but would have soon) and the block was split. Addressed those problems and moved on.

gatti-man

iTrader: (2)

Im still waiting for why the aem is better than the fcon vpro for tuning. I see that it works with traction control but imo thats for people who cant drive anyways. I want to know how it allows for better tuning and constant a/f ratios in real world environments. Tell me why it is safer. Also IMO the UTEC isnt an answer, its still a patch. If I dailr drove a UTEC FI car i wouldnt feel confident in my ems at all.

SoundPerformance

I did start out that way!!! Then everyone started saying how over priced it was!! I felt like I was talking to the 86-92 supra guys!! LOL

Julian@MRC

iTrader: (28)

I believe Vinny Ten has done all that on PM's car that hit 2500whp on the VQ.. Thier Street car has a similar set up at 1300whp.Last I heard, they were cracking heads during recent testing..

SoundPerformance

The fcon controls timing and fuel very well. However the AEM does that and SO MUCH MORE and the pricing is similar. Also the software that the AEM uses is SO MUCH nicer than the HKS. Go to www.aempower.com and go to the electronics section. Download the AEM software and play with it.... It is amazing!

SoundPerformance

Vinny has some brilliant engine builders and engineers working on his motors. I will give them a call.

If we can figure out how to keep the VQ motor alive at 1000 RWHP I think most street guys will be happy! Anyone know if the manual trannys can support that much HP?

Julian@MRC

iTrader: (28)

I dont think so..They kept breaking trannys, at about 800whp from what I heard..Thats why they went with the turbo 400.They really pioneered alot of stuff, best bet is to call Vinny and ask him..But dont expect PM to allow Vinny to let any secrets out of the bag, they are very guarded about their work. Try getting in touch with George Ianou formerly of Bullish, he worked for PM for a while..Also we are using their former Head guy, who built them their 1300whp heads..

SoundPerformance

Im sure they are secretive about certain things as I am too. Ive talked to George many times about 2J issues. The nice thing about being in this business for 20 years is knowing people in high places. Im sure I can make a few phone calls and find out what s working on the head lifting issue.

SSR Engineering

Sorry but companies like Top Secret aren't in it to make dyno queens and show queens. They aren't out there to make a VQ35DE that makes 1500hp on stock sleeves, stock crank etc. But until someone does it's pure speculation and no one can accurately assume or prove how much horsepower a stock block can handle.

Julian@MRC

iTrader: (28)

That statement was not to be taken literally, but for demonstrative purposes only to make a point.The point being, "it aint easy to make a 1000hp VQ motor" it costs alot of $$$$$$$$.

Julian@MRC

iTrader: (28)

Also keep in mind, the number of 350z owners that actually go ***** deep into a 700hp build is very slim..There may be about 4 members on this board out of over 50,000 that would take it to the levels being discussed..3 of them are performance shops already..
Also FYI APS has a 800whp car in their facility in Australia, so their getting very close to the 1000whp street car status.. But I think the fact that no one to date has made a 1000whp 350Z (street car) is the factor in the limited numbers of them you will eventually see.It just seems it was way easier to modify an already turbocharged car such as the supra to high HP levels of 800-900whp, than it will be to do it to a 240whp N/A car with 10.3:1 compression on an aluminum open deck block..

SoundPerformance

This is true....

However just a few years ago we said we would never make 700 RWHP in a supra.... and now we are at 1520 RWHP so you never know unless you try!

RageWoRX

I agree 100% .... who knows whats really possible until you try. And the more people/shops that try the better off we will all be in the end for the knowledge gained.

I mean Its like Larry said ... yeah in current times a 1000whp MKIV Supra seems sooo easy to build ... but back in 1994 saying that you were gona build a 1000 whp MKIV Supra probly got you looked at funny it seemed like an insane task. Things have come along way since then not only in the Supra world but in the import performance industry as a whole. So there is no reason not to think that with the help of some great shops the future could be looking bright for the VQ crowd. Of course will the VQ ever reach the insane levels of the 2J ..... who knows but its hard to compare any other engine to the 2JZ .. unfortunately I don't think we will see another engine like that again from the factory (I'm a big 2J and 1J fan). I would be happy if the VQ even came close to those levels ..... and I'm not just talking about WHP levels but stability and durability too

I'm glad a shop like SP is taking an interest and look foward to seeing more of thier VQ developments in the future.

-Jon

AmyCroft

iTrader: (3)

RageWORKS - Jon

Seems you are implying the Forged Components we currently have plus some of the Nitrogen Ring Seals, plus a Superior ECM. Those you are good with.

That leaves a set of Aftermarket Heads and a aftermarket VQ Block with additional strength. Who can take on a task like that?

Cheers Amy -