Twin Pump set-up
Originally Posted by MRC Motorsports
You developing a fuel system for the space shuttle or a z?
I'm not trying to speak for Phunk, but it seems to me like he's totally lost interest in the Z, and the fuel system is on the back burner....set to LOW heat, lol. Although, one would think he'd get it up and running asap, if not for the profitability of such a system 
its not so much that i have lost interest in it... i just go to school and work full time. since i am not building cars for people anymore as a business owner.. i am not as active on here. our dealers take care of almost all of our customer service and sales now (probably a lot due to it being nearly impossible to get us on the phone these days, only the lucky few i regret to say... but its only a part time business as thats all it really requires), so i only post if i see someone have a tech question regarding our product. brandon and i expect to have more time to put into CJ just about now, so perhaps we will actually get something new done for you guys - but we been saying that for a year so...
the twin fuel pumps has actually been on "low heat" for about 1.5 year, we work on it here and there, with prototypes completed every now and then but none that we are satisfied with, as in one that is 100% as quality as the OEM unit with twice the flow. the design is going with another change, this time a big one that changes the entire concept of the siphon to eliminate all the potential consistency issues with it, but it will take some time to complete. if all else fails, it would be very easy to just duplicate the APS pump canister setup, but we really just dont like it, it can be done better.
while there are a handful of guys begging for twin pumps, in reality from a business perspective it is just a novelty product - as its true needs are next to nothing compared to the existing stage 1 and 2 systems. the profitability is next to nothing on the twin pumps due to our 100% cnc machined build of it, its more about eventually getting something just for our previous customers to upgrade to because we dont like the idea of them "outgrowing" what they already paid for.
the twin fuel pumps has actually been on "low heat" for about 1.5 year, we work on it here and there, with prototypes completed every now and then but none that we are satisfied with, as in one that is 100% as quality as the OEM unit with twice the flow. the design is going with another change, this time a big one that changes the entire concept of the siphon to eliminate all the potential consistency issues with it, but it will take some time to complete. if all else fails, it would be very easy to just duplicate the APS pump canister setup, but we really just dont like it, it can be done better.
while there are a handful of guys begging for twin pumps, in reality from a business perspective it is just a novelty product - as its true needs are next to nothing compared to the existing stage 1 and 2 systems. the profitability is next to nothing on the twin pumps due to our 100% cnc machined build of it, its more about eventually getting something just for our previous customers to upgrade to because we dont like the idea of them "outgrowing" what they already paid for.
Last edited by phunk; Sep 8, 2007 at 07:44 PM.
Originally Posted by InjectedPerf
We have been running an in tank dual pump setup for about a year and a half. Just pulled it to put a Weldon in for drag racing.
We have a couple different prototype 2 pump setups that we haven't had time to finish up. One is a twin -06 that Y's to a -10 feed up to the rails. Second is twin -06 feed lines all the way to the fuel rails.
We have a couple different prototype 2 pump setups that we haven't had time to finish up. One is a twin -06 that Y's to a -10 feed up to the rails. Second is twin -06 feed lines all the way to the fuel rails.
I want to hear more info on this setup???? any info or pics???
Originally Posted by phunk
its not so much that i have lost interest in it... i just go to school and work full time. since i am not building cars for people anymore as a business owner.. i am not as active on here. our dealers take care of almost all of our customer service and sales now (probably a lot due to it being nearly impossible to get us on the phone these days, only the lucky few i regret to say... but its only a part time business as thats all it really requires), so i only post if i see someone have a tech question regarding our product. brandon and i expect to have more time to put into CJ just about now, so perhaps we will actually get something new done for you guys - but we been saying that for a year so...
the twin fuel pumps has actually been on "low heat" for about 1.5 year, we work on it here and there, with prototypes completed every now and then but none that we are satisfied with, as in one that is 100% as quality as the OEM unit with twice the flow. the design is going with another change, this time a big one that changes the entire concept of the siphon to eliminate all the potential consistency issues with it, but it will take some time to complete. if all else fails, it would be very easy to just duplicate the APS pump canister setup, but we really just dont like it, it can be done better.
while there are a handful of guys begging for twin pumps, in reality from a business perspective it is just a novelty product - as its true needs are next to nothing compared to the existing stage 1 and 2 systems. the profitability is next to nothing on the twin pumps due to our 100% cnc machined build of it, its more about eventually getting something just for our previous customers to upgrade to because we dont like the idea of them "outgrowing" what they already paid for.
the twin fuel pumps has actually been on "low heat" for about 1.5 year, we work on it here and there, with prototypes completed every now and then but none that we are satisfied with, as in one that is 100% as quality as the OEM unit with twice the flow. the design is going with another change, this time a big one that changes the entire concept of the siphon to eliminate all the potential consistency issues with it, but it will take some time to complete. if all else fails, it would be very easy to just duplicate the APS pump canister setup, but we really just dont like it, it can be done better.
while there are a handful of guys begging for twin pumps, in reality from a business perspective it is just a novelty product - as its true needs are next to nothing compared to the existing stage 1 and 2 systems. the profitability is next to nothing on the twin pumps due to our 100% cnc machined build of it, its more about eventually getting something just for our previous customers to upgrade to because we dont like the idea of them "outgrowing" what they already paid for.
-Jerome
I'd heard that the issue with release had to do with the siphon - much like the current reports of issues with the APS unit... I'm under the impression that the best answer for those looking for more fuel / power need to look at a revised inline solution. AAM's is okay at best, but you would need to boost the flow from the walbro to the surge tank in order to prevent starvation. Also, a true surge would be a vertical solution - not horizontal IMO.
Charles - I'm interested to see what changes you guys make down the road. Hopefully we'll see something soon. Good luck and keep us posted.
Charles - I'm interested to see what changes you guys make down the road. Hopefully we'll see something soon. Good luck and keep us posted.
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 10,740
Likes: 25
From: On a forum dedicated to Boost
Originally Posted by meatbag
Just man up and get a fuel cell with twin internal pumps. You can make it work with the stock fuel gauge and everything.
lol @ just. care to share how much money your fuel system has cost you? I had the previlage of seeing your car at SGP while I was taking pictures of my built long block. Can I say HOLLY FCKING SH*T!!!!???!!!!!! Biggest fcking fuel lines I've ever seen going all the way to the motor! lol.
Originally Posted by Old School
lol @ just. care to share how much money your fuel system has cost you? I had the previlage of seeing your car at SGP while I was taking pictures of my built long block. Can I say HOLLY FCKING SH*T!!!!???!!!!!! Biggest fcking fuel lines I've ever seen going all the way to the motor! lol.
I'll make a thread detailing my fuel system in a couple weeks probably.
Last edited by meatbag; Sep 10, 2007 at 12:46 PM.
Originally Posted by TENGAI
I'd heard that the issue with release had to do with the siphon - much like the current reports of issues with the APS unit... I'm under the impression that the best answer for those looking for more fuel / power need to look at a revised inline solution. AAM's is okay at best, but you would need to boost the flow from the walbro to the surge tank in order to prevent starvation. Also, a true surge would be a vertical solution - not horizontal IMO.
Charles - I'm interested to see what changes you guys make down the road. Hopefully we'll see something soon. Good luck and keep us posted.
Charles - I'm interested to see what changes you guys make down the road. Hopefully we'll see something soon. Good luck and keep us posted.
the fix is simple, we have an entirely different style siphon to integrate. it will reduce complexity of our unit and should be easier to manufacture than our previous designs - i just dont know why we didnt do it this way the first time. we will be in the shop a bunch over the next month for another production batch of rails, perhaps this will be the time to squeeze the twin pumps in there and put an end to that story. we have lost a few customers to competition, but we know the choice will be obvious as soon as we get'r done.
Last edited by phunk; Sep 10, 2007 at 07:30 PM.
Registered User
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 98
Likes: 0
From: Puerto Rico
Originally Posted by phunk
you are correct, the issue is with reliability in the siphon. Making a venturi siphon powered by the return fuel that is trustworthy of release ends up being too restrictive on the return to give the adjustability in fuel pressure we want to provide.
the fix is simple, we have an entirely different style siphon to integrate. it will reduce complexity of our unit and should be easier to manufacture than our previous designs - i just dont know why we didnt do it this way the first time. we will be in the shop a bunch over the next month for another production batch of rails, perhaps this will be the time to squeeze the twin pumps in there and put an end to that story. we have lost a few customers to competition, but we know the choice will be obvious as soon as we get'r done.
the fix is simple, we have an entirely different style siphon to integrate. it will reduce complexity of our unit and should be easier to manufacture than our previous designs - i just dont know why we didnt do it this way the first time. we will be in the shop a bunch over the next month for another production batch of rails, perhaps this will be the time to squeeze the twin pumps in there and put an end to that story. we have lost a few customers to competition, but we know the choice will be obvious as soon as we get'r done.
carlos
we made some exciting developments with it today. we have all concerns with the siphon completely eliminated. all we have to do is make sure there is no cavitation at idle like our first prototype had... but we are almost positive its not even a concern with this design.
if we can get the CNC program written tonight, we might even cut one out for testing tonight.
carlos, you are at the top of the list. you have been a good and loyal customer for a long time and have maintained faith in us despite long delays in development.
if we can get the CNC program written tonight, we might even cut one out for testing tonight.
carlos, you are at the top of the list. you have been a good and loyal customer for a long time and have maintained faith in us despite long delays in development.
Registered User
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 98
Likes: 0
From: Puerto Rico
Originally Posted by phunk
we made some exciting developments with it today. we have all concerns with the siphon completely eliminated. all we have to do is make sure there is no cavitation at idle like our first prototype had... but we are almost positive its not even a concern with this design.
if we can get the CNC program written tonight, we might even cut one out for testing tonight.
carlos, you are at the top of the list. you have been a good and loyal customer for a long time and have maintained faith in us despite long delays in development.
if we can get the CNC program written tonight, we might even cut one out for testing tonight.
carlos, you are at the top of the list. you have been a good and loyal customer for a long time and have maintained faith in us despite long delays in development.
Originally Posted by phunk
we made some exciting developments with it today. we have all concerns with the siphon completely eliminated. all we have to do is make sure there is no cavitation at idle like our first prototype had... but we are almost positive its not even a concern with this design.
if we can get the CNC program written tonight, we might even cut one out for testing tonight.
carlos, you are at the top of the list. you have been a good and loyal customer for a long time and have maintained faith in us despite long delays in development.
if we can get the CNC program written tonight, we might even cut one out for testing tonight.
carlos, you are at the top of the list. you have been a good and loyal customer for a long time and have maintained faith in us despite long delays in development.
BTW I'm not selling my G, haha!!
Originally Posted by Carlitos
Hey, don't forget about me! I should also be in that list
BTW I'm not selling my G, haha!!
BTW I'm not selling my G, haha!!
we are about to start cutting this version right now which i hope should be the flawless final prototype.
after it gets puts thru a couple tests to ensure stable pressure and proper siphoning, we will make a first batch large enough to cover all the guys that have been waiting for us forever, and a few for our dealers. they will be scarce for a while as we also have 50 more sets of rails that need to be machined.
