I say Supercharged!!! Bigger HP gains!!!

 

There's a very long thread on this, run a search on it.

 

Turbo cause:
1: You're wrong, turbo = better gains cause no parastatic drag given equivalent temp, psi, and cmf, the turbo wins hands down

2: Less wear and tear on the motor in the long run cause it won't boost on the freeway or at idle (unless you get some lil jobbers, and I mean REAL little)

Ben

 

Search for more info.

Here's a quick recap:

Turbo's = more flexible (easier to tune boost), more complicated, probably more expensive, will have slight lag.

Supercharger = less flexible, less complicated, probably less expensive, no lag, but always on. Will take some HP to run compressor so less efficient.

Which is best for you probably depends on what you want to do with the car and which of the above criteria are most important to you.

-D'oh!

 

Turbo = More horsepower gains

Supercharger kits are generally more expensive. Especially considering buying a nice set of headers to compliment the SC.

 

for more everyday use is it more effecient to use a turbo
cuz i mean i dont race often but when i do i want that little kick
its nothing big just want to know i can pull ahead of that stock Z

 

I think superchargers are good for light cars like a MINI because it exagerates that zippiness instead of adding in lag, but with only a minor gain in power.

I also think turbocharges for Z's since the 350 is a 3000lb+ hulking beast, which massive power, but slightly slow (kinda like all those big monsters in cartoons and in movies) to get the power going.

I think you're vastly underinformed if you're making comments like: "I say Supercharged!!! Bigger HP gains!!!"

 

A turbo system is more efficient in two ways. First, the energy in the exhaust gasses that would normally be going to waste is utilized to create the boost. Second, the compressor is more efficient on a turbo setup because of the higher rotational speeds reached. I've read of turbos spooling up to 180,000rpms (no joke!). There is no physical way a supercharger can do that with gearing.

Turbos have a downside to using the exhaust as their motivation though. If you spend too much time at or near WOT, the backpressure created by the turbo's turbine can create excessive heat and damage exhaust valves.

That being said, I'm planning on going the supercharger route due to simplicity of the system. I don't plan on upgrading the engine's internals so 7-9psi of boost will be just fine. I'm sure I'll be able to deal with the lower mileage from the parasitic loss of the continuously driven supercharger. The HP/TQ increase will be worth it!

 

Few superchargers run at a 1:1 ratio, so a SC can easily reach = boost to that of a turbo within reason, and they do make gear sets for SC in certain applications, there is no reason a SC cannot hit 10PSI as easily (and prolly COOLER) than a turbine, but I like turbos cause you can also adjust the boost levels in seconds with a lil extra investment and you do not have to boost at all if you do not want to, just sty outta the throttle.

But the turbine is not seeing all fo the exhaust gasses, so with a properly sized waste gate this is a non issue unless your instal is POS in which case..... don't blame poor theory. Plus the exhaust on a Turbo car should be VERY free flowing and thus eliminate almost all back pressure.


Plumbing IC pipes and pipes off the Exhaust manifolds is not fun, nor is fabbing a custom exhaust manifold! Will you be getting positive diplacment or centrifugal type SC?

Ben

 

I didn't mean to infer that a SC couldn't boost as much as a turbo. Just that from my readings turbos are more efficient at compressing air by 10-20%.

Don't get me wrong. I've been a big fan of turbos over superchargers but at this point in time the simplicity of the Procharger system as well as the fact that it's intercooled (unlike the Stillen) is very appealing.

 

This is a debate that really has no limitations or correct answer, but I like s/c'er for a daily driver and a turbocharger for all out race applications.

The s/c in my opinion is a lot more reliable and in the long run will not cost as much. On top of that it is emission legal in most states where in Cali. it is still Carb pending. On top of this most s/c kits come with a warranty where most turbo’s don't. Also a plus with s/c’er are that they come ready to bolt on, out the box. There are just so many positive things about the s/c, which makes the decision an easy choice for the daily driver.

There seem to be an issue about the s/c being on all the time. This is not true. S/c'ers work under vacuum. So when you are on the fwy. or just driving around you really don't see boost. In fact your car will be in vacuum a majority of the time until you actually floor it. The only real time you see boost is when you floor it.

Oh…another cool thing about the s/c’er is the sound. At idle you can hear a whining noise, which reminds me of a jet. If you cruise around at low RPM’s you still can hear the noise, but it becomes a little louder…and when you floor it the sound with the exhaust just sounds so good. And everything you shift you here the by pass valve go off…it kind of sounds like a little sneeze.

 

SC for the torque curve and drivability of instant on boost, unless the turbo kits are coming out with low inertia designs. Bolting on a Procharger appears to be an easier install for those of us with DIY skills.

 

SC for street.
Turbo for Race.

a) Try to back out a TT system in a warranty dispute.

b) The ATI system appears to be cake to install / de-install.

c) once you include the tuning and "mandatory" exhaust work for the TT system ,it is no longer cheaper. Also how are 2 compressors cheaper than 1?

etc.

 

I'll get a supercharge after I buy a Z
supercharge is better for your engine life if you don't race a lot!
I have a Turbo RX-7 so I need a powerful daily drive car like a new Z with supercharge.^_^

 

I would go twin turbo when a really good kit comes out. But I won't. Geez, I can't afford that sheeit.

 

I wouldn't say you "need" it. Wanting it is certainly OK though.

 

My (Zultor) reply to Eskimo:

Don't start bashing. The whole idea behind my post was to brew up a debate in hopes of some healthy information about Turbos and Superchargers. It is not intended to insult anyone or for me to be insulted. That brings me to one of my favorite quotes:

"To be stupid, selfish, and have good health are three requirements for happiness, though if stupidity is lacking, all is lost."
Gustave Flaubert (1821 - 1880)

"Lighten up my friend. I could understand if I was "Z" bashing.

 

I have looked for this answer in the past with no success. From what you say, the engine only sees boost when you floor it. I don't really understand that, I thought it was a linear powerband where the boost was there at all times. If the SC is only seeing boost at WOT, then if I get an SC, I will not be seeing much boost cause I rarely "punch" my car. I don't want to be like Fred Flintstone running with my feet cause I "punched" it too hard.

So if the SC is not seeing boost on the interstate, is it affecting MPG??? I mean, I assumed MPG would go down with the SC running all the time, but correct me if I am wrong.

I don't know, I will not be doing the install myself, if I do go FI. I do know that turbos can see full boost down in the RPM band, were SCs never see full boost til the redline. Sure, the SC will jerk your head cause it is on all the time, but after that initial .5 sec jerk, the turbo with the same max boost output will put out more power for the rest of the run. That jerk is nice, but the turbo putting up more power for longer. It is more expensive (too expensive), but it does have it advantages as far as I understand it.

 

Most SCs (if not all) provide an atmospheric bypass valve. You can readily see tis in many of the ATI install photos (top , drivers side near FMIC.

The SC should be bypassed when:

a) loads requireing <0psi are not required.

b) under rapid deceleration (ie between shifts) to bleed off the +psi an reduce strain on the compressor and supporting componets (ie don't blow a gasket).

When the SC compressor is "bypassed" it is no longer "pumping"
and hence not produceing significant crank loads.
When un-loaded the SC drivetrain should only disspate only a fraction of a HP.

 

correction

...>0psi