interesting bad built motor thread on G35driver.......
10-29-2008, 03:39 PM
#521
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From Julian on g35driver.
"Regardless of what he says, i have at least 2 people that can confirm he wanted the car back to go to a car show.It drove fine out of boost and on low boost, the heads would only lift at 18psi. We can not keep a customers car from him.He was given advice to "just drive it dont beat on it" he chose not to listen to me as he has not in the past. A good friend of his advised me that the night he raced it it was turned up to 19.2 Psi. Rome often turned the boost settings up on his car..
He is a grown man, no one held a gun to his head and made him street race a hurt car."
"Regardless of what he says, i have at least 2 people that can confirm he wanted the car back to go to a car show.It drove fine out of boost and on low boost, the heads would only lift at 18psi. We can not keep a customers car from him.He was given advice to "just drive it dont beat on it" he chose not to listen to me as he has not in the past. A good friend of his advised me that the night he raced it it was turned up to 19.2 Psi. Rome often turned the boost settings up on his car..
He is a grown man, no one held a gun to his head and made him street race a hurt car."
10-29-2008, 03:42 PM
#523
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Again from Julian
Originally Posted by Julian
if you do know Rome, then you do know he is stubborn and thickheaded and do not listen to reason at times. You story is almost correct, despite me advising rome to run low boost and NOT TO RACE the car. The car did not lift the heads on low boost even on the dyno. If your insinuating that we blew Romeys motor on the dyno negligently then your incorrect. The TQ ratings on the headstuds were all over the place, out of all the motors to come from GTM we had issues with the headgaskets with the exceptions of the shortblocks we got and installed the heads on at our shop.
10-29-2008, 03:42 PM
#524
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Why didnt you take the issue up with Sam when your HG failed? From what you posted, you drove the car at low boost 99% of the time, had some issues where you didnt touch the car, then simply accepted the failure and had another HG put in with no issues before selling the car.
Why did you just accept it, yet you ask Rome/or show interest now to find out who/what is at fault?
This whole situation stinks.
Why did you just accept it, yet you ask Rome/or show interest now to find out who/what is at fault?
This whole situation stinks.
+1
Nitrouz you stated in your post the "mileage was unchanged"...how can you not be 100% sure someone didn't joyride it if the mileage never changed and it had 2 inches of dust on it.
You're signs were the SAME as Bam Bam's and I know you had discussions with him when it happened. It makes no sense how this would "just happen". ANY HG compromise at that mileage is considered premature and I will refer back to my post with the 3 reasons for premature HG failures.
Your post and GTM's previous statement about your incident don't jive...you're car all of a sudden was spewing coolant under normal conditions and their excuse was your overheating causing the HG to fail which you never mentioned(the reason they told you was a matter of time period) . Cars don't spew coolant for no reason.
Edit: Also common automotive practice... loss of compression on only one cylinder does NOT immediately implicate a head gasket failure. Other tests can be run and typically a loss of pressure will be seen in TWO adjacent cylinders not just one. So for example...if you had low compression on cylinder 6 then 5 should have been low as well. What was the compression on the adjacent cylinders?
Last edited by Driven1; 10-29-2008 at 04:12 PM.
10-29-2008, 03:51 PM
#527
+1
Nitrouz you stated in your post the "mileage was unchanged"...how can you not be 100% sure someone didn't joyride it if the mileage never changed and it had 2 inches of dust on it.
You're signs were the SAME as Bam Bam's and I know you had discussions with him when it happened. It makes no sense how this would "just happen". ANY HG compromise at that mileage is considered premature and I will refer back to my post with the 3 reasons for premature HG failures.
Your post and GTM's previous statement about your incident don't jive...you're car all of a sudden was spewing coolant under normal conditions and their excuse was your overheating causing the HG to fail which you never mentioned(the reason they told you was a matter of time period) . Cars don't spew coolant for no reason.
Nitrouz you stated in your post the "mileage was unchanged"...how can you not be 100% sure someone didn't joyride it if the mileage never changed and it had 2 inches of dust on it.
You're signs were the SAME as Bam Bam's and I know you had discussions with him when it happened. It makes no sense how this would "just happen". ANY HG compromise at that mileage is considered premature and I will refer back to my post with the 3 reasons for premature HG failures.
Your post and GTM's previous statement about your incident don't jive...you're car all of a sudden was spewing coolant under normal conditions and their excuse was your overheating causing the HG to fail which you never mentioned(the reason they told you was a matter of time period) . Cars don't spew coolant for no reason.
10-29-2008, 03:51 PM
#528
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i'm dissapointed with the lack of detail in this engine report,if there is more please let us know.i know i'm going against the stream here but,to blame romey OR julian for a ticking time bomb of a motor(#1) is wrong,the limited info about #2 suggests a similiar fate for it as well.maybe julian not having spark and pulling the motor was actually best case scenario.i would want more info to the actual condition of this brand new motor,to estimate gtm's level of respsonibility.
10-29-2008, 04:10 PM
#532
i'm dissapointed with the lack of detail in this engine report,if there is more please let us know.i know i'm going against the stream here but,to blame romey OR julian for a ticking time bomb of a motor(#1) is wrong,the limited info about #2 suggests a similiar fate for it as well.maybe julian not having spark and pulling the motor was actually best case scenario.i would want more info to the actual condition of this brand new motor,to estimate gtm's level of respsonibility.
10-29-2008, 04:49 PM
#533
***This post is only in regards to Romey’s engine, there will be one post per engine, Please be patient***
A lot has come up in the last 48 hours. I was accused of “character assassination” tactics and trying to divert the blame to someone else, which is completely untrue. I stated before trust is everything, and if there is no trust it is impossible to resolve conflicts, but I am happy that Julian’s true colors have surfaced.
Julian contacted me a few days ago to inform me about Romey street racing his car after the head gasket issue. He made it seem on the forum as we have been in communication and have been working on something – That is not the case, he has been trying to convince me that Romey is the one to blame for all this mess, and that Romey has been playing us all this entire time. He very frankly told me that we should both wash our hands free of Romey, and divert the blame to Romey. I wasn’t really surprised to hear this from Julian because this is exactly the type of person I knew Julian was. If someone does this to a friend, imagine what they will do to a competing shop?
So here is our take on the whole situation;
1. The video has nothing to do with Rome’s situation, Romey is a customer Julian is supposedly the professional. The customer to a certain degree doesn’t know any better. Julian lifted the heads on the dyno, and handed Romey the keys as if everything was fine.
2. When the car had suffered the head lift issue, due to detonation according the Arias piston report. (scanned copy below) This engine could have been repaired by a simple head gasket replacement; Romey would have been back up and running a long time ago.
3. I told Romey before I ever saw the engine (engine 1) that I would take care of it, which is exactly what we did EVEN THOUGH WE WERE NOT AT FAULT. We wondered why an engine that lifted the heads was damaged so bad, and we were accused of improper machining because of the damage, but now the video explains the reason why the piston was damaged.
4. A complete new short block was assembled, new pistons, rings, bearings, etc. We inspected the heads, upgraded the camshafts, and this engine was on its way. There was nothing that needed to be repaired on the heads. The valves in the heads were never touched, they held 6.5 BAR of vacuum when we tested them before shipment. A brand new head with a fresh valve job will hold 7 BAR of vacuum, we set the valve clearances and that was it.
5. After MRC installed engine #2, it was not running on one bank. Romey and Matt called me to let me know, I told them it is impossible that half the engine would not be running and that there is another problem. I recommended that they check the timing, fuel and spark. Julian was quick to blame the engine.
What kind of a shop pulls an engine out before checking for fuel and spark? There was nothing wrong with this engine. This is why I accuse MRC of being amateurs, because this is a classic amateur mistake.
Incase anyone missed it, The reason this engine did not fire is because there was no spark on one bank, which is an external issue – NOT ENGINE RELATED.
Julian claims that one bank had lower compression, well what do you think happens when there is no spark and the cylinders get washed out with fuel and scuffed, the side that was firing was overly rich according to the report, now imagine the side that didn’t fire, yet still had fuel injected.
Compression and leak down tests need to be done on a hot engine in order to be accurate. 10-15% leak down on a COLD engine IS ACCEPTABLE. Once this engine is warmed up and ran, you will be able to get an accurate compression and leak down test.
MRC accused us of having overly tight valve adjustments; this report shows that all our adjustments were 100% within specification.
People keep saying we are diverting blame, but they keep forgetting we covered an engine that we were not at fault for! (Romeys first engine which was detonated on the dyno and lifted the heads)
As far as the camshafts, We have told Romey that we will give him a full refund on the Stage2 camshafts and warranty his stage 1 cams free of charge, or make other arrangements directly with Romey. He will be taken care of one way or another and he knows that, which is all that matters to us.
So yes Julian, we are blaming you because it is your fault. We already covered one of your mistakes for free and we are not going to do it again. I also believe you have a compulsive lying disorder; I would get it checked out.
Thank you,
SAM
GT MOTORSPORTS
A lot has come up in the last 48 hours. I was accused of “character assassination” tactics and trying to divert the blame to someone else, which is completely untrue. I stated before trust is everything, and if there is no trust it is impossible to resolve conflicts, but I am happy that Julian’s true colors have surfaced.
Julian contacted me a few days ago to inform me about Romey street racing his car after the head gasket issue. He made it seem on the forum as we have been in communication and have been working on something – That is not the case, he has been trying to convince me that Romey is the one to blame for all this mess, and that Romey has been playing us all this entire time. He very frankly told me that we should both wash our hands free of Romey, and divert the blame to Romey. I wasn’t really surprised to hear this from Julian because this is exactly the type of person I knew Julian was. If someone does this to a friend, imagine what they will do to a competing shop?
So here is our take on the whole situation;
1. The video has nothing to do with Rome’s situation, Romey is a customer Julian is supposedly the professional. The customer to a certain degree doesn’t know any better. Julian lifted the heads on the dyno, and handed Romey the keys as if everything was fine.
2. When the car had suffered the head lift issue, due to detonation according the Arias piston report. (scanned copy below) This engine could have been repaired by a simple head gasket replacement; Romey would have been back up and running a long time ago.
3. I told Romey before I ever saw the engine (engine 1) that I would take care of it, which is exactly what we did EVEN THOUGH WE WERE NOT AT FAULT. We wondered why an engine that lifted the heads was damaged so bad, and we were accused of improper machining because of the damage, but now the video explains the reason why the piston was damaged.
4. A complete new short block was assembled, new pistons, rings, bearings, etc. We inspected the heads, upgraded the camshafts, and this engine was on its way. There was nothing that needed to be repaired on the heads. The valves in the heads were never touched, they held 6.5 BAR of vacuum when we tested them before shipment. A brand new head with a fresh valve job will hold 7 BAR of vacuum, we set the valve clearances and that was it.
5. After MRC installed engine #2, it was not running on one bank. Romey and Matt called me to let me know, I told them it is impossible that half the engine would not be running and that there is another problem. I recommended that they check the timing, fuel and spark. Julian was quick to blame the engine.
What kind of a shop pulls an engine out before checking for fuel and spark? There was nothing wrong with this engine. This is why I accuse MRC of being amateurs, because this is a classic amateur mistake.
Incase anyone missed it, The reason this engine did not fire is because there was no spark on one bank, which is an external issue – NOT ENGINE RELATED.
Julian claims that one bank had lower compression, well what do you think happens when there is no spark and the cylinders get washed out with fuel and scuffed, the side that was firing was overly rich according to the report, now imagine the side that didn’t fire, yet still had fuel injected.
Compression and leak down tests need to be done on a hot engine in order to be accurate. 10-15% leak down on a COLD engine IS ACCEPTABLE. Once this engine is warmed up and ran, you will be able to get an accurate compression and leak down test.
MRC accused us of having overly tight valve adjustments; this report shows that all our adjustments were 100% within specification.
People keep saying we are diverting blame, but they keep forgetting we covered an engine that we were not at fault for! (Romeys first engine which was detonated on the dyno and lifted the heads)
As far as the camshafts, We have told Romey that we will give him a full refund on the Stage2 camshafts and warranty his stage 1 cams free of charge, or make other arrangements directly with Romey. He will be taken care of one way or another and he knows that, which is all that matters to us.
So yes Julian, we are blaming you because it is your fault. We already covered one of your mistakes for free and we are not going to do it again. I also believe you have a compulsive lying disorder; I would get it checked out.
Thank you,
SAM
GT MOTORSPORTS
Last edited by Sam@GTM; 10-29-2008 at 04:59 PM.
10-29-2008, 05:08 PM
#534
yes I accepted because 1, the downtime was not worth my stress, and 2, I wasn't even sure the customs guys didn't go for a joyride. I was PRETTY sure, but not 100%. I don't blame anyone of anything if I'm not sure.
That was the path I took, and stand by.
But Rome's issue...he hasn't even touched it yet. So I want to find out who's at fault. And of course, Rome's a good friend of mine.
That was the path I took, and stand by.
But Rome's issue...he hasn't even touched it yet. So I want to find out who's at fault. And of course, Rome's a good friend of mine.
Customs seized it for 7 months, and the car was not touched at all (2 inches thick of dust on the car, mileage unchanged, settings unchanged, etc).
So what happens now?? Who has to pay to get Rome back on the road
10-29-2008, 06:11 PM
#540
***Vino’s Motor - The original motor this thread was about.***
Call it what you want, but I have caught Julian in too many lies to take his word on anything. For all I know the third party company that did the inspection on this motor is his best friend. (Diamond Motors)
Julian stated this engine only had 2,000 miles. Then he says the engine used 4qts of oil between oil changes. How many times are you going to change the oil in 2,000 miles?
When I spoke to Julian he told me the car came into the shop 4qts low on oil, now he denies it. How can we prove this?
Oil consumption can happen for a number of reasons;
-improper break in
-improper assembly of oil sealing rings
-improper Machining
-Tuning (washing the cylinder walls with fuel on excessively rich start up, i.e. Like Romeys engine)
Now, if this engine was machined incorrectly, to the point where it would consume 4qts of oil in 2,000 miles there would have been signs of this right away.
-smoking on decal
-smoking on start up
Why would MRC post this car up on the forums, showing how successful the project is, and deliver a car to a customer if it is consuming this much oil? Any time we have had an engine issue with a car in house, which we have had like anyone else, we notice the problem right away, either on startup, on the dyno, or on the test drive. Whenever there is an engine issue, you will know right away.
Why would Julian deliver a car to a customer knowing that there is a problem? If this car was in my shop, and there was an issue, we would never deliver it to the customer. Julian should have called me and let me know of the problem so we can diagnose it and take care of it ASAP, Instead he gave me one phone call to advise me that the car came back 4qts low on oil, I told him we need to take it out and send it back to me, instead he decided to go about fixing the problem his own way.
I wish Julian would have handled this problem the correct way, so that we could have inspected the motor and take care of it if on our end, Instead Julian wants to play this game, and the customer is the one who ends up losing.
I am sure I will get accused of shifting the blame, but if you are an engine builder, and you are in my situation, dealing with someone who you can not trust at all, what would you do?
SAM
GT MOTORSPORTS
Call it what you want, but I have caught Julian in too many lies to take his word on anything. For all I know the third party company that did the inspection on this motor is his best friend. (Diamond Motors)
Julian stated this engine only had 2,000 miles. Then he says the engine used 4qts of oil between oil changes. How many times are you going to change the oil in 2,000 miles?
When I spoke to Julian he told me the car came into the shop 4qts low on oil, now he denies it. How can we prove this?
Oil consumption can happen for a number of reasons;
-improper break in
-improper assembly of oil sealing rings
-improper Machining
-Tuning (washing the cylinder walls with fuel on excessively rich start up, i.e. Like Romeys engine)
Now, if this engine was machined incorrectly, to the point where it would consume 4qts of oil in 2,000 miles there would have been signs of this right away.
-smoking on decal
-smoking on start up
Why would MRC post this car up on the forums, showing how successful the project is, and deliver a car to a customer if it is consuming this much oil? Any time we have had an engine issue with a car in house, which we have had like anyone else, we notice the problem right away, either on startup, on the dyno, or on the test drive. Whenever there is an engine issue, you will know right away.
Why would Julian deliver a car to a customer knowing that there is a problem? If this car was in my shop, and there was an issue, we would never deliver it to the customer. Julian should have called me and let me know of the problem so we can diagnose it and take care of it ASAP, Instead he gave me one phone call to advise me that the car came back 4qts low on oil, I told him we need to take it out and send it back to me, instead he decided to go about fixing the problem his own way.
I wish Julian would have handled this problem the correct way, so that we could have inspected the motor and take care of it if on our end, Instead Julian wants to play this game, and the customer is the one who ends up losing.
I am sure I will get accused of shifting the blame, but if you are an engine builder, and you are in my situation, dealing with someone who you can not trust at all, what would you do?
SAM
GT MOTORSPORTS