rcdash

iTrader: (18)

No. Wisdom.

tylerxfire

iTrader: (15)

either way anything goes down, hill came in here and acted like a victim and like he is not at fault and doesnt give a ****...i know for a fact that hills garage will be crossed off my list for an engine build and im sure many more...there are ways of doing good business and bad business and he is not representing his company in a very good way imo..

XKR

iTrader: (1)

You, GoFast,djamps, Raj, Paul and Alberto all answered the questions that have been put to me....

Yes Frank is at fault...but is he the only one?...Will Chris be better off going to a lawyer?....my opinion?...yes!....My lawyers opinion ..Yes...."This looks like we have reached a dead end".

It cost me nothing to call my lawyer to get a legal answer. He wants us to know that not to think that the Judges are not in the know about things like this....and if they are lacking...they get experts involved.... Plus, a good lawyer will have his own expert/s present in court....

His professional opinion is...the Shops dont have a chance ..BECAUSE...the customer did not take delivery of the car....so we cannot throw the customer into the equation of fault.

So alberto's summary is correct ...ONLY ...if Chris drove the car off the lot.

Getting the Shops to pay for legal fees goes without saying.....Customer will almost always get covered on this one.... PLUS...loss of usage will be factored in.

Now....the bad part is....and this is coming from an Infiniti lead tech .....The Rag...Yes the rag.....that will hang Frank.....BUT....Dave is not off the hook!!....Dave should have walked away from the car the moment the rag was discovered. So now Dave is entangled in the web of fail.

In my opinion....All involved should get a lawyer...because this is going to really cost the shops some funds....Dont think you will only be liable for Chris's misfortunes.....There will be added costs....An easy 10K Shop replacement cost could turn into 25K x 2 for each shop when this is all said and done.

I hope this helps.

RudeG_v2.0

iTrader: (1)

Excellent post. Thank you Mike!!!

Unfortunately... There is some HORRIBLE legal speculation and misinformation going on in this thread that is not doing any favors for Chris or readers of this thread.

As you also stated, if this goes to trial... When Chris wins, the defense will get stuck with Chris's attorney fees. It's the court's way of discouraging frivolous lawsuits and encouraging all parties involved to settle out of court.

Now seriously... Do any of you guys here think that Frank Hill stands a chance of winning in court when the judge and jury see this picture???





It has already been established that Frank installed the 2nd motor and re-installed the turbo kit prior to the car being towed to FT for tune. So Frank's attorney would be hard pressed to convince a jury that Dave put the rag in there.

Even an attorney as stupid and incompetent as Lawchick would advise their client to settle out of court based on this photo alone.

XKR

iTrader: (1)

^^^^ That pic is what i showed to the Infiniti Tech...He said there is no way out of it when that pic is presented.

IIQuickSilverII

iTrader: (13)

... plus i dont think "i cant pay the bills" will go a long way with any judge/jury

escobar929

iTrader: (1)

i do not understand how either party is not willing to settle out of court, specially since Chirs has been boasting bout these two shops since day one, I'm sure the average person had no clue who the hell frank hill was until Chris started talking about him. Chris alone has prob brought those two shops so much business from this thread alone and w/ the latest turn of events, this thread will now destroy both shops

who in their right minds would take their car to either place? maybe an RA customer but thats bout it

I do give props to Dave for stepping up and offering Chris is own motor, seems like he is willing to help but IMO i would just want the money and take the car else where

very dissapointed that Frank tried to wash his hands off of all this w/ that post, specially as faithfull of a customer as Chris was, shame...

RudeG_v2.0

iTrader: (1)

Exactly. That rag photo powerfully speaks for itself. The judge and members of the jury don't need to be experts in built motors, turbo kits, or the performance auto aftermarket to know that some negligence was involved. And to my knowledge, that torn up rag has not yet been conclusively ruled out as a contributing factor that might have led to oil starvation in that motor.

The photo of that rag will be as effective for Chris as the glove was for the defense in the OJ Simpson murder trial.

XKR

iTrader: (1)

Very True....


Let me ask you all a question....This is only a question

How much would the TRUE cost be for Frank and Dave split the cost to replace what Chris lost???...When I say true cost...I mean how much is their/shop cost... 10K?....15K??

Reason for my question is....I was told that if this was my motor...he would ask for 3 x full cost ( the price i would pay the shop) plus lawyer fees...

So if Chris paid 20K...that would be 60K + Fees.....So thats 30K per shop

If i were shop A & B I would go with the 10K divided by 2= 5K

escobar929

iTrader: (1)

+1, IMO the fact that the judge/jury are not experts will def crusify Frank as the cause of the problems because of the rag. I was telling my GF (who knows nothing bout cars) this story and when I mentioned the rag, she was like "OMG something like that will def destroy a motor if it got in there right?" even the average person knows how sensitive a motor is, let alone a 600hp motor

but lol, you shouldnt bring up OJ cause he didnt get convicted so the glove didnt do much in that case, but Frank wont have good ole Johnny

RudeG_v2.0

iTrader: (1)

The glove was effective and crucial for OJ's defense. "If it doesn't fit, you must acquit." Remember? It was indeed a powerful piece of evidence displayed to the jury that ultimately lead to a "not guilty" verdict.

ToastZ

iTrader: (2)

Arbitration would be easier and faster for Cass', cheaper for all involved too. He'll get more damages from a jury though. If and when it does go to court it will be an interesting case for the Jury. The pictures tell a complete story and the "Rag" is the most damning piece of evidence and subsequent turbo damage. This thread with a documented timeline is a trial lawyers dream ticket. Also, Hill's latest response in this thread is open territory for a cross examination.

Cass, attorneys like to win. They are the most competitive type-A individuals you will ever meet. You should have no problem getting one to take this on with a low-dollar retainer. Doubtful this case will ever go to court though, this one will likely settle out of court behind closed doors with everyone in a room together. No defense attorney will want to try and justify to a jury that the now infamous "rag" and busted turbo didn't have anything to do with the motor eventually coming apart while being tuned and "before Cass even took possession of the car".

Unfortunately for Dave though he was the last in the chain to touch the car so he'll take the first punch and his lawyer will be cross examining Frank's testimony with Cass' lawyer laughing his *** off. If it did go to trial, the jury would completely understand it. Pictures tell a thousand words.

thefireboy

.....

XKR

iTrader: (1)

.....I agree.....I would take it to jury....thats where the $$$ is at. Plus the longer Chris is without his car...WOW....I see $$ signs

thefireboy

i do believe that jim the owner of justice racing and engine builder for 35+years stated that the rag was also not a factor in the motor fail..

XKR

iTrader: (1)

If you have ever been in front of a jury....Its always the picture that hurts you. Franks side will say no about the rag....but Daves side would say yes...and that leave the 6 or 12 people to deside..

They will say ( even though that maybe the only mistake that Frank made) that if he can make a mistake like leaving a rag in there...what else could he have done wrong.....and why did Dave continue to tune the car.

Its not whats true...its what the lawyers can make the jury believe....and if I were in the jury box....I would convict all....not equally....but all would have some guilt.

ToastZ

iTrader: (2)

If it went to jury the damages could be higher, much higher. Think replacing the "WHOLE CAR" kind of dollar figures with loss of use, loss of this/that and the other thing, loss, loss, loss, loss, loss,.... major loss. This has been going on close to a year, thats a whole lot of loss and attorneys love to spin stories to Juries on loss and pain and suffering. Poor customer, bad shop owners, bad insurance agents. Will be hard to convince a jury that Cass is NOT a victim.

RudeG_v2.0

iTrader: (1)

Seriously?

IIQuickSilverII

iTrader: (13)

Lololol "Lawchick has passed the nuthugging baton to thefireboy

GreenGoblin

iTrader: (6)

IMO Cass I think you should take them all to the cleaners to recoupe some money, that you have spent out side of there shop, all the little things because of this mess.