Sneak Peak At Vortech System
#122
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I also would like to thank you for your presence on this forum. Vortech is the only Super Charger I am considering, and if it's not that it will be a TT kit going on my Z.
Where is Vortech based? I'm in Orange County (SoCal) and would love to see a Vortech Z in person before making this kind of decision.
Also, can we expect videos at least soon to give us some idea of what it sounds like hehehe that does matter to me too!
Waiting till you get back from SEMA...
-Dana
Where is Vortech based? I'm in Orange County (SoCal) and would love to see a Vortech Z in person before making this kind of decision.
Also, can we expect videos at least soon to give us some idea of what it sounds like hehehe that does matter to me too!
Waiting till you get back from SEMA...
-Dana
#123
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Originally posted by articfury
ZZ,
You obviously are instigating an argument. Which as a long term member you know is a no-no. And there is no reason to be rude to someone asking you to take your discussion to a different thread.
JD
ZZ,
You obviously are instigating an argument. Which as a long term member you know is a no-no. And there is no reason to be rude to someone asking you to take your discussion to a different thread.
JD
I wasn't trying to be rude....sorry if you have absolutely no sense of humor.
Lighten up, Francis.
Last edited by ZZtopp; 11-03-2003 at 05:45 PM.
#124
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Originally posted by spazpilot
My question to any one is why is it that the ATI Procharger put out 370rwhp at 7psi and the Vortech won't be able to do that at 8psi? Its claiming 412 crank hp, so ruff estimate would be 350rwhp? Any comments?
My question to any one is why is it that the ATI Procharger put out 370rwhp at 7psi and the Vortech won't be able to do that at 8psi? Its claiming 412 crank hp, so ruff estimate would be 350rwhp? Any comments?
Steve told me that he thinks that the ATI might be getting tuned by the people that are getting those numbers so that it is putting out high hp but it might be more risky as far as reliability goes. He said Vortec never sets up their SC'ers to run at highest possible output but to run so they last. They will give up the 15-18 hp for the sake of making sure the motor will not blow up. Remember, he is claiming that you do not need to get the Vortec tuned like the ATI and is bolt on.
I am basing the numbers off of what you are saying above vs. numbers I have seen with ATI's on previous posts. You are using the 350rwhp estimate and it seems the higher numbers in general I have seen for ATI's are about 368rwhp. I have also seen numbers as low as 350rwhp for ATI's as well but then again we are dealing with different motors, dynos, and conditions. BTW, I really hope we get a Vortec car in the SportZ magazine comparison in December so we can move past this debate of different dyno's on different days.
Steve did not use the 350rwhp number with me, he just said they dyno'ed the Z with a stock motor for the base line, then dyno'ed the Z again with the Vortec. They then added the hp gain found on the dyno and added it to the 287hp Nissan claims thus you get the 412hp number.
So you know, Steve told me that the goal is Vortec is not to have the most hp but to have the most reliable hp. From their perspective, they tuned the SC to get 412hp. If you feel the ATI is as reliable, you might not see any advantage to the Vortec in that area of comparison and feel the added 15-18 hp gives the ATI the advantage.
I hope this helps you. I am sure more data being released from Vortec and future dynos and testing from magazines and from owners of the Vortec will give us even a better picture of these issues.
Last edited by zland; 11-03-2003 at 08:04 PM.
#125
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zland
the 350rwhp was just a guess. I am sure at this point that no one knows what the rwhp numbers are and like you said all i have read is that it is 412 crank hp. I would like to see a comparison side by side though and for the power loss it could also be that the ati has a better intercooler and intake temps are lower. do you know if vortech intercooler is a front mount or that square thing they use? thats also something to look at.
the 350rwhp was just a guess. I am sure at this point that no one knows what the rwhp numbers are and like you said all i have read is that it is 412 crank hp. I would like to see a comparison side by side though and for the power loss it could also be that the ati has a better intercooler and intake temps are lower. do you know if vortech intercooler is a front mount or that square thing they use? thats also something to look at.
#126
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Originally posted by spazpilot
zland
the 350rwhp was just a guess. I am sure at this point that no one knows what the rwhp numbers are and like you said all i have read is that it is 412 crank hp. I would like to see a comparison side by side though and for the power loss it could also be that the ati has a better intercooler and intake temps are lower. do you know if vortech intercooler is a front mount or that square thing they use? thats also something to look at.
zland
the 350rwhp was just a guess. I am sure at this point that no one knows what the rwhp numbers are and like you said all i have read is that it is 412 crank hp. I would like to see a comparison side by side though and for the power loss it could also be that the ati has a better intercooler and intake temps are lower. do you know if vortech intercooler is a front mount or that square thing they use? thats also something to look at.
The location of the IC is the same for both ATI and Vortec (ft mount). In fact, if you look at both kits, they look alot alike (to a guy like me). Unlike the Stillen SC, which is a root blower and totally different, the ATI and Vortec have more in common. Other common traits will be boost increasing as RPM increases for both ATI and Vortec vs. Stillen which has full boost at low rpm's.
As far as you saying the 350rwhp was a guess, lets be honest, all hp posts have some variation to them. The same car on the same dyno on a different day (different conditions) will have different numbers. This is why I am so excited to get all of these cars dyno'ed on the same day on the SportZ comparision in December.
Last edited by zland; 11-03-2003 at 08:15 PM.
#130
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They are using the Vortech FMU, its not really tuneable. Which is ok i guess if they make us a custom disk for it.
http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/...tegory_Code=FC
I have been thinking about it, and its almost time to put my Z away for the winter. So I might wait until Feb to get the kit so i can see what everyone thinks about it. Unless I can get it for a good price now, because I wont be able to drive my car through the winter.
http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/...tegory_Code=FC
I have been thinking about it, and its almost time to put my Z away for the winter. So I might wait until Feb to get the kit so i can see what everyone thinks about it. Unless I can get it for a good price now, because I wont be able to drive my car through the winter.
#131
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Originally posted by zland
This is a website used by 350Z owners. We do get information but sometimes it is messy and after much debate. If you need tech support, go to superchargersonline.com They have techs you can address questions to about SC issues including questions specific to a particular SC company such as ATI or Vortec.
In addition, call the manufacture of the SC you want information on. Do a search, you can find a companies website and phone number that way. I called Vortec today and got all the answers I wanted. I did the same with ATI months before. The way I feel about it, if the manufacture will not give you time to answer your questions now, then they will most likely ignore you after you already spent your money thus I would scratch them off my list for that reason alone.
This is a website used by 350Z owners. We do get information but sometimes it is messy and after much debate. If you need tech support, go to superchargersonline.com They have techs you can address questions to about SC issues including questions specific to a particular SC company such as ATI or Vortec.
In addition, call the manufacture of the SC you want information on. Do a search, you can find a companies website and phone number that way. I called Vortec today and got all the answers I wanted. I did the same with ATI months before. The way I feel about it, if the manufacture will not give you time to answer your questions now, then they will most likely ignore you after you already spent your money thus I would scratch them off my list for that reason alone.
#132
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Originally posted by g356gear
The fuel management question was answered already earlier in the thread.
The fuel management question was answered already earlier in the thread.
Only a vague term of a "FMU" was used.
Since the 350Z and G35 have a returnless system, just a FMU simply can't be used..... I was hoping they would give a more descript explanation of the system. Kinda like when I asked, what the % factor they were factoring for the drive train loss, so we can all know what a real world rear wheel number might be.
The Fuel system must employ adding a return line back to the tank of some sort. Along with the additional fuel pump, and the FMU. Is this line braded? what size is it? Where is the fuel returned to? Do you have to drop the tank for this install? Just asking questions since, both the JoTech and the ATI kits both used the EFMU by Aeromotive.
If a return style fuel system is addapted to make the kit work. I wouldn't hold my breath to see it be CARB legal. Since I don't think the goverment is going to be hip on converting a new car to a return style system. When the main reason behind the Returnless is for reduced emissions. But who knows maybe they look the "other way" every now and then.
EA
#134
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Originally posted by damen
what are you saying? do you have a problem with G35 drivers being here on the board? i'm just trying to get some information that's all, not trying to steal anything from you guys. we have pretty much the same engine so why not take part in the discussion?
what are you saying? do you have a problem with G35 drivers being here on the board? i'm just trying to get some information that's all, not trying to steal anything from you guys. we have pretty much the same engine so why not take part in the discussion?
I wanted data on SC'ers for example. I did not want biased data only from a maunafacture or salesman thus I took it upon my own to work with car owners and contacted SportZ magazine to have them do a comparision on those products. All of this work I am doing is so 350Z owners AND G35 owners have correct information to make wise choices. There is no personal gain for me from it except for the information we all get from it.
So learn as much as you can here. When information is not availible on this webpage, go out and find it and then post it for the all VQ motor owners.
Once you post it, be ready to discuss and debate the data you provide on your post. A lot of guys here want facts and if your information is not accurate, they will call you on it (such as posting hp gains without a baseline dyno).
Sorry you felt I was some how making you feel unwelcome, Jeff
#136
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Originally posted by milner
man i cant wait to see what this thing is realy going to be like after it is installed on a few cars.
man i cant wait to see what this thing is realy going to be like after it is installed on a few cars.
1. 400hp at crank (easy most SC & TT kits can do that).
2. Reliable: Wait for 6 months to see if any problems are occuring with the kit. I would really be ready to buy if a motor warranty came with it but it seems that might be wishful thinking.
3. Sevice: If and when problems occur, will the manufacture and installer of these kits back their work and fix problems.
4. CARB legal: look like I will have to wait 6 months or more for any of these products to be CARB legal.
#137
Originally posted by etx
They are using the Vortech FMU, its not really tuneable. Which is ok i guess if they make us a custom disk for it.
http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/...tegory_Code=FC
They are using the Vortech FMU, its not really tuneable. Which is ok i guess if they make us a custom disk for it.
http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/...tegory_Code=FC
The only way to get the FMU you mentioned to work is to rework the fuel system will probably not pass any kind of CARB emissions review.
Edit: Guess I should've read SVTkids post. Yeah, What he said.
Last edited by jesseenglish; 11-04-2003 at 09:25 PM.
#138
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Originally posted by zland
I am fine with you guys that won G35's on the board. I suggested you search websites and ask questions just like I do so that you get answers.
All of this work I am doing is so 350Z owners AND G35 owners have correct information to make wise choices. There is no personal gain for me from it except for the information we all get from it.
Sorry you felt I was some how making you feel unwelcome, Jeff
I am fine with you guys that won G35's on the board. I suggested you search websites and ask questions just like I do so that you get answers.
All of this work I am doing is so 350Z owners AND G35 owners have correct information to make wise choices. There is no personal gain for me from it except for the information we all get from it.
Sorry you felt I was some how making you feel unwelcome, Jeff