I told myself I would probably resist the temptation to go forced induction until there was "real" fuel management available for the 350/G coupe. I'm feeling the itch pretty bad since I sold my Supra but I still want to do it the right way.

I posted about a year ago my thoughts about doing any upgrades and how I knew the ECU would be a limiting factor but I think it has dropped off now. I encouraged everyone to start inquiring with AEM about doing an EMS plug and play. This is slighly off topic but I though maybe we could rally the troops and get some people calling them, or posting on thier forums on the AEM site so they might prioritize the development on our application. This stand alone computer has many features like a full race ecu but is vehicle specific. It just plugs in like a stock one and would saving you from having to do all kinds of crazy wiring. In the hands of a knowledgeable tuner it's a powerful tool. The issue people are having with running larger injectors and fixing timing could be addressed easily. Just my 2 cents.
Later

 

On the timing issue, for those of you who are still wondering.....those stock timing numbers, including the 28 BTDC @ 6500 RPMs, were confirmed.......ATI has informed me that those numbers were datalogged from their test cars, but strangely, they say it produced no detonation in them

 

The on-set of detonation is not 100% predictable or repeatable.
Many factors come into play from day to day and car to car. Ambient temperature, blend of gas, ECU "learned" base map offset , etc, etc. The concern with 7psi and 28degrees is that it leaves very little margin of safety. Sure it gave great dyno numbers, but how repeatable? and safe was it (from a detonation perspective)?. I don't think ATI did (or had the time given their early Time to market plan) to cover all the scenarios.
It is seriously doubtful that they understood the full implications of this particular ECU and engine combination. So they have let the early adopters shake out the product, to plug some of the holes and unfortuanely to some, that has meant unsavory consequences. There is a lesson in there somewere?

 

Well I am having shifting issues in my A5T under WOT the rpm's stick and it won't shift. I am getting impatient for answers despite me fixing the timing issue with my own funds. So please sign me up for the unhappy customer by back program too. I do not think this kit works right on A5T's even with corrected timing and larger injectors, even at WOT. If you can't feather and you can't WOT then please tell me what is this kit good for honestly?

 

I can see how the post made by ATI can be taken the wrong way. I think what ATI is recommending / trying to say is that it wouldn't be ideal to modulate the throttle from WOT to Heavy/Part Throttle to WOT to Heavy/Part Throttle to WOT to Heavy/Part Throttle to WOT etc. back and forth quickly for an extended duration like someone might do in a driving competition. This is because this repeated style of driving on and off the throttle repeatidly can make the computer oscillate between open and closed loop frantically - wether you have forced induction or a naturally aspirated setup. This extreme driving condition can cause the computer to hit a timing or fuel value on the map it wouldn't have selected under a more linear driving style.

However, running your ATI Procharged car at partial throttle in boost is not a problem. I have both an EGT gauge and a wideband a/f gauge on my ATI Procharged 350Z and the car has no problem attaining safe/proper a/f ratios and egt's when driving at partial throttle in boost.

So, if you have an ATI supercharger on your 350Z, please don't be affraid to drive the car after reading some of these posts about partial throttle. I've put over 10,000 miles on my 350Z with the ATI Procharger which include alot of partial and WOT driving without any problems.


Here are a few simple things I do when driving any modified car to help ensure best reliability:

-Change the spark plugs every 5K-10K miles depending how much I've raced the car (fresh plugs are key to keeping your motor happy)
-Change the motor oil every 2,500miles with SYNTHETIC motor oil (yeah I know the manual says twice that, but I am an enthusiast and I drive my 350Z more than twice as hard as Nissan thought the average owner would)
-Make sure I use reputable gas stations (I've had a tank of what seemed like 87-octane from a 92-octane pumps at a no-name gas station before)
-When I race someone I am sensible (ie. if I race a C5 Corvette from 60mph to 120mph I give the car a minute to cool before I go ahead and race him again ... and we all know most C5 owners always wan't to race twice because the first time they figure something must have went wrong with their car for a 350z to beat them!)
-When I race at high speeds (over 80-100mph) I shift early at 6500rpm to save stress on the rod bearings/motor (the car doesn't mind higher rpms in lower gears where it is at the higher rpm for only a SPLIT second! Similar principal to how some BMW's have higher rev. limit in lower gears than higher gears)
-When I go to the track I use higher octane gas even though it really isn't 100% necessary (I just consider it a cheap form of insurance when I'm racing/beating on my cars)
-Turn off the traction control (why does traction control come on sports cars anyway?)

Using those simple tips I've enjoyed over 10K trouble free miles with the ATI on my 350Z.

Hopefully this e-mail provides to be insightful to this thread. I plan to increase the boost, injector size, and modify the fuel and timing maps to my 350Z in the near future. When I do, I will let everyone know how it turns out and what I learn from my personal experiences.

 

Just one question; how come the STILLEN Stage 2 Intercooled Supercharger's warranty covers the engine, as well?

G

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 02trex
[B]Great write-up!! The information you have provided is one of the more informative and honest posts I have seen regarding ANY product.



I agree

 

Mike@Altered, i think since you're a Procharger vendor, and have sold 11+ of the Prochargers out there, you're opinion is obviously going to be slightly biased.

If the ATI product is so reliable, why have there been more Z engines killed by the Procharger than by Nitrous?

 

Mike-
I don't disagree with what you're saying, but with the way ATI has worded their post, it almost seems like they're trying to put forth a disclaimer that will cover them no matter what. I'm still neutral in this thing, but you are correct...ATI's post can definitely be taken the wrong way.

EJ-
Regarding the number of engines killed by ATI compared to the number killed by nitrous, you can't really make that comparison. How many cars are really out there with the ATI kit installed? And how many, in comparison, are running nitrous?

 

please tell us what plugs you'r using and what gap works the best ?

I have tried to call ATI for this info and so far so response

 

Plug question; ProCharger recommends : Part # LFR6A-11, which is with a copper core.

Can someone enlighten me as to why ProCharger recommends copper tipped spark plugs instead of Platinums or Iridium; and being that the narrowest gap for the Platinum are recommended at 0.039, should the ProCharged platinums be gaped at 0.035

On the question of the intercooler piping, in my case it is causing a slight bulge to my fender protector, resulting in the left front wheel rubbing when I make sharp right turns or reversing right. The installer recommends that a cutout be made on the fender guard.

Will ATI be offering better intercooler piping that is contoured to fit the 350Z body/engine better without having to cut into frames and engine protection cover?

And, a better quality intercooler, like the ones used by PE?

Can we replace the by pass valve with one that is more reliable?

Thanks
Gerald

 

I hate to even respond to anything ATI related anymore being that everyone thinks that I work for them etc..... But...
What's wrong with the intercooler that ATI provides with the kit? It's a 3 core intercooler and is more then enough for what everyone is currently pushing. Also, what's wrong with the by pass valve? It does the job. Not saying it's the best in the world, but are you saying it isn't reliable? And yeah you can replace it..

 

Mike.

WRT recommendation
"Change the spark plugs every 5K-10K "

Depends on the plugs you prefer. The copper plugs recommended by ATI are not necessariyl the best choice , if you want to save a little labor.

However; if you shell out for cooler Iridiums (I prefer Densos),
changing every 10k , regardless of your driving habits should be unnecessary (unless you really have a fouling problem due to leaky rings or valve seals). The Iridium tips , though a finer wire are much more durable and should easily exceed 25k miles under very harse conditions.

The side benefit of Iridiums is that they provide a "effective spark boost" to avoid potential misfire under boosted WOT. Copper / Platinum plugs do not provide this benefit since they tend to have larger wire tips (in an attempt to extend longevity). The Iridium design extends service life by using a harder material.

 

Yes, this cost me my expensive Stillen V2 bumper on that side too, it tore and has been documented by Nissan. They blamed it on the IC piping and it's in writing on Nissan lettehead. They also installed my SCer so no questions can arise as to the installer!

As for Mike, well yeah EJ he sold both of us our SCer's so yes his post should be read as him being a vendor and a user, not just a user of the product. He sells, tunes and installs them.

I just got off the phone with Level 10. My shifting problem is confirmed and they have the fix. It's another $600 plus deinstall / install to get it to not stick (lazy shift) at WOT. My car won't make boost at all in manual mode either and this too is confirmed as being both mechanical and electronic in the valve body of the tranny. I have a EGT and Boost guage too. ZERO boost in manual mode!

Knowing what I know now I would not have ever considered buying this. And Mike, I have upgraded my injectors and reflashed etc already and I still have shifting issues under boost.

My new question is if A5T's with Turbo's have this same problem with shifting under boost and if not why? Or even better other supercharger makers. Some day this will all come to a head. Right now I feel like I am building my car around the supercharger not vice versa which seems backwords to me.

 

the bypass valve consists of a thin rubber diaphragm inside that metal housing......the linkage that connects to the diaphragm goes through that hole in the metal housing......that hole allows the diaphragm to be exposed to the elements, so eventually it will dry out and crack, like a windshield washer blade......when it cracks it will be stuck in the closed position......that situation can blow head gaskets

It seems to me that if ATI was even the least bit concerned about engine safety, the very smallest effort that they could have made would have been to provide a better quality bypass valve



Yeah, and wasn't he selling these things to us with promises of free ECM reflashes?......if the kit is so reliable, as he now claims, why was he offering a reflash right from the start.......something tells me that he knew about the timing issues also, but failed to mention that to us in his sales pitch.......it's really pathetic what people will do for money

 

Indeed you are correct sir, I saved the emails. A promise he never made good on to me. How about you?

You have a good point there.

 

Oh yeah, I been waiting for this one... Damn right Mike knows about it. When I was up at his shop picking up my mess, I mean my car, I was chatting with a mechanic there, Jamie. Jamie said, that Mike knows about the timing issues and warned him that it's what is causing the engines to blow up, but he didn't seemed to concerned about it. Mike have you altered the timing in your car?

 

Bill that really upsets me. EJ and I placed our orders and he held my CC money in limbo for almost a month with all these promises. I almost had to involve my bank when ATI stepped in and got it shipped. Yeah, I had forgot that he kept saying part of the deal (I paid 4900.00) was a free ECU reflash. Well my reflash cost me 600 bucks so according to the laws of California he now owes me 600.00 bucks. Man this is sad. Because he may have caused me more damage than that by selling me the kit for my Automatic knowing it wouldn't work.

 

Bill? Are you the same guy that im'd me talking ****.

 

Yes they are..To all procharged owners,Please do not drive your car fast,Step on the gas pedal,Go above 4000rps,Drive when its hot out,drive when its cold out,drive above 5000rpms for more than 10 minutes...As a matter of fact, just dont drive your car at all...

EJ-
Regarding the number of engines killed by ATI compared to the number killed by nitrous, you can't really make that comparison. How many cars are really out there with the ATI kit installed? And how many, in comparison, are running nitrous? [/B][/QUOTE]

Last time I checked no one on this board with N2O blew an engine and Reportedly 6 people with Prochargers Popped their engines.. So lets see...If my math is correct that would be a 600% failure rate compared to N2O...