Originally Posted by bigcloud

Binder I want you to show me 10 people that DD FI setups AND autoX and HPDE with no major problems. If you can do that then my position will change with FI. Hell remember I'm buying this godspeed kit just to show that my motor will blow. :-)

Originally Posted by Resmarted

I want you to show ME 10 people who DD their cars and Auto X and HPDE (idk wtf that is but whatever) AND not only have the reliability you seek, but do it with truely impressive consistency AND performance.
I've seen all sorts of supercars, totally oem. Scuderias, lp640's, ford GT's, GTRs... what you are asking for is beyond what even the highest end performance oem cars can provide.
I'll cut to the chase, your expectations are... un-realistic. A properly built vq will not have IMMENSE problems. Especially with a strong kit and a strong tune. IMO if you can't deal with "problems" of a simple FI kit for our factory motor, how are you going to deal with any issues on an engine swapped car? Yeah lsx's are a dime a dozen, and yeah so are 350z's, but together you have a whole other beast. Be aware that YOU will be your own support system/backup. And if you don't want to do that, or can't you are going to have to pay out the a$$ to fix stuff.
Go ahead ask around locally how much it would cost for a shop to work on your 2003+ nissan with a fuel injected chevy engine. See what happens.

Originally Posted by Resmarted

I want you to show ME 10 people who DD their cars and Auto X and HPDE (idk wtf that is but whatever) AND not only have the reliability you seek, but do it with truely impressive consistency AND performance.

I asked the question first. Answer mine then I will try and answer yours. Oh an HPDE is a High Performance Driving Event. You should try one out. It may help you drive your car better.


I've seen all sorts of supercars, totally oem. Scuderias, lp640's, ford GT's, GTRs... what you are asking for is beyond what even the highest end performance oem cars can provide.

I've seen and driven some super cars...namely lp640, GT-R. The GT-R STOCK won't have any problems doing what I want to do. DD, AutoX, HPDE without blowing my motor. That's the premise here resmarted.

I'll cut to the chase, your expectations are... un-realistic. A properly built vq will not have IMMENSE problems.

See my comments on the post above. You have much to learn. Read our forums. Remember the PREMISE is DD, AutoX, HPDE.

Especially with a strong kit and a strong tune.

Define strong kit?

The only kit in my opinion that isn't strong is the Turbonetics kit. ALL the other kits are very strong. The STRONG kits still have had blown motors.

Define strong tune?

You can't because it's vague and not specific. Each FI build on this forum is totally different. Therefore tunes will differ. There are no cookie cutter FI builds because everyone doesn't have the same money nor do shops charge the same rates. If there were more proven cookie cutter builds that people could build on then the only thing that would need optimizing is the tune.

IMO if you can't deal with "problems" of a simple FI kit for our factory motor, how are you going to deal with any issues on an engine swapped car?

I can deal with "problems" of a simple FI kit. Hell I love FI just like the next person. However, there are REAL costs to it. There are some REQUIREMENTS that go along with that though. See list below:

1. Second car
2. Money for a new long block or two or three.
3. Money for new turbo/turbos just in case.
4. Insurance for second car.
5. AAA membership
6. Money for shipping the car if tuner isn't close.
7. Tuner shop close for maintenance.
8. If tuner shop is not close your own tools for maintenance (if you have a garage).
9. Lots of vacation/sick time at work if second car is not an option...lol.


All of those items listed above COST MONEY/TIME. Those are some of the ancillary costs of going FI. Did you think of any of those items?

Yeah lsx's are a dime a dozen, and yeah so are 350z's, but together you have a whole other beast.

Yes a whole other beast...

Be aware that YOU will be your own support system/backup. And if you don't want to do that, or can't you are going to have to pay out the a$$ to fix stuff.

See my post above. Also GM engines are cheaper to fix...

Go ahead ask around locally how much it would cost for a shop to work on your 2003+ nissan with a fuel injected chevy engine. See what happens.

Just because a chevy motor is in a nissan body doesn't mean it's going to cost more to maintain. I don't understand your logic here.... Plus see my post above. There is a place that supports my swap.

You ask any built VQ FI guy that has blown 3 motors or more would they rather have FI and the headaches and downtime or DD N/A and have no worries?

Originally Posted by bigcloud

I'm going to comment on some of your statements see below:

Originally Posted by bigcloud

Resmarted actually I wrench on my own car because I have my own garage. Actually LS parts are cheaper than VQ parts. Actually there is a shop in the my area that specializes in this very swap so there is a support system.

Are you going to DD your car?

Are you going to track your car in AutoX or HPDE?

If you're not doing any of those things then you don't really fall in to the category I'm looking for.

Do you have a second car to drive if your motor blows?

Are you prepared to replace EVERYTHING if your motor blows and takes the turbos out with it?

Can you define a "properly" built VQ? That's such a vague term.

According to your logic a "properly" built VQ shouldn't have IMMENSE problems?

Have you read our forums?? I'll just leave it at that....

Actually a "properly" built VQ is a term that shouldn't be used anymore. Again define "properly" built? Is it a dollar amount? Or a list of certain parts? Look at the number of high dollar builds that have had problems. Dropping 30k doesn't necessarily mean it's built right. Hell even some of the best shops have had their motors blow. Does that mean they aren't doing it right?

Resmarted 30k is not chump change, and no one should be in FEAR of blowing their motor EVER. Even with the amount of money it takes to do a stock block FI setup there should NEVER be FEAR of blowing your motor. Why you may ask? Because sound engineering/tuning trumps all.

I look at the FI on the VQ as an ongoing engineering project. In my professional opinion as a top level engineer there is still work to be done on proper LONGTERM FI solutions. There hasn't been too much proper root cause analysis.

The reason I like the LS motor as a better option is that the community actually has better support than the VQ.

For example if you tune your car with HP Tuner Pro there is a BANK of tunes that you can pick from that have been uploaded from other members. They range from specific tunes with specific pieces to generic base map everyday driving tunes.

Do you see that in our community?



Actually I will have the reliability I seek that my N/A VQ has with the V8. I think you're missing my point here.

Leaving the V8 N/A with no mods will be just as reliable as my N/A V6.

Granted swapped cars "could" have general problems simply because there is a new drivetrain. It's not going to result in a blown motor though. I can tell you that.

Originally Posted by Resmarted

After re-reading this post, I refuse to continue this debate with you. Continuing will only get ugly for reasons I don't want to go into.
Go ahead engine swap your car, good luck. It's not something I would attempt.

Originally Posted by bigcloud

You can't debate without getting into your feelings? The reason I'm going to do the swap is because I'm an engineer and I have the intellect and common sense to do it.

Aside form the fact that ALL engines require general maintenance proves my point. Just remember you won't be able to enjoy your car to the fullest because there will be a FEAR of your motor popping. Can you HONESTLY say that you're confident that you won't have any FEARS of your motor popping?

I don't have that feeling with my N/A Z currently, and with a V8 I will still NOT have that feeling.

Come on man it's common sense. Just look at what you're doing. Adding compressed air to an engine that wasn't FULLY designed for it. Granted that are some good shops out there that make great boosted VQ applications.

You seem to be missing my point.

Bottom line is that your built motor TT setup will not be as reliable as an N/A V8 running with a STOCK tune. Hell my N/A V6 Z will still be more reliable on the track and with DD than a built motor TT. I have 141k on my motor. Do you know of anyone that has a built motor TT with 141k miles on the setup?

Now don't get me wrong I'm not trying to start an argument, but you have to look at things LONG TERM.



Is that better???

Originally Posted by Resmarted

Well this makes it a lot harder for me to pinpoint your questions and answer them specifically.
First off why would a vq be easier to work on? Mainly 2 things. These in my opinion are huge.
1) OBDII. Scanning the port is always the first and easiest step (scanners are always readily available to borrow and make things oh so much easier) to diagnosing almost any problem with the car. This in my opinion is HUGE. You should obviously already know this.

See this is where you and I differ. This is an engineering project to me. I make a very good living developing custom communications solutions, and software. So getting OBDII warnings from the GM ECU will not be a problem. You forgot that the OBDII ports are incorporated into the wiring harnesses. There will be two connectors. With some time I may be able to convert or add them to the dash so I can have an andon for the GM ecu.

2) Room. The Vq is already a tight fit, I would not want to have work on a V-8 in that space, esp considering the size radiator you'd want to run.
3) Wiring harness. I don't even want to think about setting up that car with a harness. That's just a pain in the ***, even if you run separate ecu's, you will never get the full oem package (a/c, full communication in the car -going back to obdii)

Actually the V8 takes up less space than the VQ. It sits lower by about ~4 inches. Enough for a roots blower (tvs 2300) to fit under the strut bar. Actually I will have A/C as the Nissan compressor will be mounted to the LS block. See you know nothing of this swap and just bashing to bash.

What is a strong kit? I mean something that's been proven to work. And as you've stated, a ton of kits out there have been proven. SO no problems there. I'd personally choose a kit with water cooled ball bearings to help keep egts down.

What is a strong tune?
Yes, I can define this. I will combine this with a properly built engine. Honestly this is a much bigger part of blowing motors than people realize. A strong tune obviously isn't something you go into a shop asking for. You need a good ECU, a good tuner who knows how to tune this ecu. I don't hear about Sound Performance building and blowing motors(even out-side of the vq world), I haven't heard anything about Vinny Ten blowing motors (and they have been making records long before everyone else), I haven't heard anything about Dynosty blowing motors, and one day I hope to have Hal tune my haltech (on a dyno and not just a base tune). All of their customer cars seem to have really strong performance and get tracked, hard.

You have some good points on this one. Who's tuning your ECU?

1jz's and 2jz's blow on bad tunes. I think we can all agree that both of these motors are very well suited to handle boost.
What I'm trying to say here is it is wrong to classify how reliable an engine is based soul-ly off what it's name is. How reliable/strong an engine is is totally based off the parts you have in it, how well it has been assembled and the tuner (and combined ECU/fuel system/turbo kit) behind it.

I'm not basing anything on the name. I have history. You should rethink this statement, because there are members on here that have spent 10 times what you've spent on this project with better parts, good tuner, and still have had blown motors.

Now what I was trying to say with a DD tracked car is, I've seen all of those cars break. The GT broke a belt and had to stop. The scuderia (a pre 2008 model) had cracked its headers. The GTR went into some kind of limp mode (idk anything about it, the guy was long gone before I got to the pits). Corvettes, well they are made of plastic and start to fall apart on their own lol.

You're talking about minor issues. What I'm trying to convey to you is that your built TT setup could possibly throw a rod through the block while on the track. You could have fuel starving while in boost on a hard turn then BOOM. My issue with FI is that the consequences of bad anything could result in a blown motor. Do you have the funds to buy another built short block? Do you have the funds to buy new heads? Do you have the funds to rebuild turbos? These are all possible areas of extra cost that you may incur. I want your setup to run for 100k miles with minimal issues.

What I don't want is your setup to blow after 50 miles. I'm pulling for you man, but you have to remember you're taking a HUGE risk financially, and mechanically with your car. It's not something you should take lightly. That's why I'm sticking with N/A V8 power.

Here's what I'm ultimately saying, its unreasonable to want a perfectly reliable Daily Drivable track car, unless you want to pay for it or wrench on it your self. You simply will not find a car that you can drive there and back regularly and put miles on in between without having to do some maintenance.

I agree which has been my stance the entire time. This let's me know you really haven't comprehended my posts. Your built motor TT setup will NOT have general maintenance. It's much more complicated. After EVERY oil change you must send it to blackstone just to see if your motor is holding up. Do you want that?


You seem to understand this, and you claim to have the $ for it and the shop.
What I'm getting at is that if you are capable of maintaining this purpose of a car, with a SWAPPED motor, maintenance for a boosted Z (and the cost for a properly built car) shouldn't be any kind of an issue. But for some reason it is.
So here's what I say. You are not backing off of the idea (which doesn't make sense to me on several fronts but respectfully) to each their own, so just do it.

Don't get me wrong. I would looove to have a boosted Z. However, the cost benefit ratio is not a good one. Add in a second car and it's a losing battle. A whole other event chain happens with a second car. I would prefer to drive my Z daily and not have weeks months of downtime.

Just be prepared for even the small maintenance things (that a stock motor will eventually have), to become a much greater pita than they should be.

I'm already prepared for this maintenance. I maintain my Z now. Hell this maintenance is much cheaper than what a GT-R's maintenance is. I was prepared to pay for that. However, I like having money in my pocket so no need to speed it.

Again you claim to be ready to handle all of this so it shouldn't be any kind of problem. Which makes me wonder why you haven't started yet.

Priorities my friend. I'm buying another house, getting engaged, then getting married.

Hopefully that didn't come across as attacking your skills as a wrench or your financial status.

I don't see you as attacking me at all. I hope you don't see me as attacking you.

I'm just trying to get my point across that everything will become more complicated, and this setup isn't so cut and dry 'better' than a properly boosted vq35.

Again I disagree. You should prove me wrong, by DD'ing your car. Taking it to the track, and not throw a rod all in 141k miles. If you can do that then I will give you not only props, but the community will look to see what you've done to keep your setup going for so long.

Originally Posted by Resmarted

I'm not getting feelings, I'm getting frustrated. I clearly stated I'm going to dd the car. you then asked if i was going to dd the car. If you can't follow this basic statement, I doubt you can look at this debate from a different perspective.

I will confidently say the engine won't pop. If I thought the engine was going to pop why the f*** would I spend the time and money to do it? Will it pop? That's always a possibility, but I'm putting in all the parts and all the time to keep it from doing that. And if it does, so be it. Honestly what kind of question is that?
This is beating a dead horse.

Originally Posted by bigcloud

Binder I want you to show me 10 people that DD FI setups AND autoX and HPDE with no major problems. If you can do that then my position will change with FI. Hell remember I'm buying this godspeed kit just to show that my motor will blow. :-)

Originally Posted by Cass007

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Coming Soon:

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Originally Posted by Alberto

People arguing back and forth over stupid fawking $hit is why this site sucks ***** now.

May the OP DIAF for even posting about this fawking kit....

edit-cant we make members post a minimum amount of posts, say like 1000 posts before they litter our FI threads with this garbage? It would clean up the forums a ton, but then also, who the fawk would we laugh at?