Hydrazine

iTrader: (53)

Yes! Even the Stillen too.

Hydrazine

iTrader: (53)

The Copper TB heater works the same way the stock plenum heats the TB, but the Copper is much more precise about it. The copper transfers a lot of heat into the TB and only the TB.

So from a TB point of view, it gets hot and performs just like the stock set up.

badmrscary

I'm guessing gas mileage should increase a bit as well with more efficient & cooler burning? Or, am I gonna be sucking more gas to go with the "flow"? I know dumb questions......lol

311roadster

Hi,

I too would like to get in on the group buy but need some help? I think that I want item #(8) 350Z 5/16" Iso Thermal plenum spacer (with all Iso Thermal components, Aramid gasket and Polarized Copper TB heater) $265. I have a Touring 350Z 2004.5, 6 Speed stock. I want to retain my strut bar. I am in Raleigh NC. So I assume that during the summer, I would keep the isothermal valve closed, and if the temperature gets below 55 degrees, I open the value? That sounds easy. I still don't think that I understand what the copper TB heater is for. Is that only used if it gets real cold or is that just and additional item to help direct the heat to the throttle body?

Thanks

the7ferret

OK

For all of you who do not understand what the copper TB heater is or what this entire thing does for read this...

If you were to apply the thermal gasket and TB coolant bypass we know that in very cold weather it has the possibility to freeze up. Well the copper TB body goes between the TB and the Plenum like a gasket. THen you attatch the coolant lines to the copper tb heater and thus the copper thing acts like a heat transfer plate by transfering the heat from the coolant to the TB. But you ask wouldn't that put heat into the plenum... Nope! they have another thermal gasket between the copper plate and the plenum to prevent heat from entering the plenum. Therefore basicly

intake -> TB -> Copper Thing -> [red]Thermal gasket[/red] -> PLenum -> [red]Thermal gasket[/red] -> intake manifold -> Heads.

badmrscary

yeah, but my stereo will heat up because of it right? LOL....just kidding,,,,sheesh

Z BOY

iTrader: (41)

TiPIACE

now youve all confused me

i thought spending the extra cash on the TB Copper Plate means you dont have to bother with the DIY open/close coolant valve????

the7ferret

exactly

Hydrazine

iTrader: (53)

If you get the Copper TB heater, you don't need the valve. You just install it forget it and plenum will run cooler and you Z will make more power.

If anyone is not sure of which one to get, just get the Copper TB heater. It costs a little more, but its a lot simpler. You don't have to adjust anything or be concerned with weather temperatures. Just install it and you're good to go for any weather hot or cold.

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While most people report better gasmileage with the spacer, if you slam the gas all the time it could burn gas more simply because more power burns more fuel.

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

I know this has been said but I just want to get perfect clarity here. With the 5/16" spacer and all the Iso goodies the stock strut bar can be retained WITHOUT having to use the hoodspacers right? If so I'm interested in the Iso goodie package and 5/16" spacer bu no need for the copper jobber here...gotta love Socal...

Hydrazine

iTrader: (53)

Exactly. No hood spacers!

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

Perfect....guess its time to spend some more money...

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

Actually a friend brought up a good point...on a turbo car what is the difference in power delivery between the 5/16" and 1/2" spacers. I assume it should not be a large difference due to the nature of the air in the plenum under pressure. But I'm curious and your webpage appears to be down at the moment.

lightner22

iTrader: (1)

How difficult is the copper TB heater to install? I found install directions for the valve which seem simple enough. Is the TB heater any more difficult or basically the same? Do you have a link to install guide for this piece.

Im in for the full 5/16" kit with copper heater if i can see the install guide first.

taurran

iTrader: (18)

I really would like to know if this works on any of the veilside/seibonvt style hoods with a strut bar spacer of any sort. From what someone on these forums explained, the 5/16" spacer with strut spacers won't fit with this hood and the stock strut. If that's the case, I might as well just go without a strut and run the 1/2". I'm concerned with the difference in gains between the 5/16" and the 1/2" plenum spacers to see if this is something I will bother trying...

Also, I'm wondering if the JIC strut bar might work with the hood and the 5/16" spacer. The JIC struts seem to be a bit flatter than the stock bar, perhaps it would fit...

Hydrazine

iTrader: (53)

Your friend brought up a good point.

This is a theoretical explanation. I havn't actually done a pre/post dyno on a FI engine, but the general equations should work the same.

If a spacer produces 13 HP NA at redline, It should produce a lot more when FI.

So lets look at approximatly what 13 HP means to the engine in terms of pressure drop. If an engine produces 300 HP at atmospheric pressure (14.7 psia) the atmosphere would have to be at 15.337 psia to produce the same peak HP as a plenum spacer. Lets assume the pressure drop is predominatly occuring at intake runners 1 & 2. So that means ~0.637 psid is being lost at the restriction area above intake runners 1&2.

If you slam a turbo on it, that same pressure drop will increase a lot!

Based on bernoulli's equation, pressure drop increases exponentially with a linear increase in flow rate. So if your ST increases your HP to ~450 HP (a hypothetical number) from a baseline of ~300 HP (hypothetical), thats a 150 HP increase, or a 50% linear increase over nominal. Hence the air flow rate will be 50% more, but the pressure drop above the fully stock intake runners 1 & 2 won't be 50% more, it will be exponentially more by the square of the flow rate!!!

And this is where a plenum spacer will help "exponentially" more than NA.

If the pressure drop is 0.637 @ 300 HP, the pressure drop will be 1.433 psid on a FI stock plenum. Thats a lot of pressure drop! So just take the ratio of pressure drops and multiply by the typical spacer gain to get an estimate of the FI HP gain.

(1.433psid/0.673psid)*13HP=27.86 HP

Will you actually get an extra 27.86 HP!? I don't know, that sounds like a lot of gain.

Based on a feel, I would estimate your gain would be somewhere the normal 13 and the theoretical upper limit of 27 HP. Heck if you could do a pre post dyno that would be great. The gain should be somewhere between 13 and 27.

If you can do pre/post dynos on a dyno of any kind, I will always recommend the Dynapack. Its much more repeatable than the Dynojet or Mustang. I just don't like the dynos with rollers. Its the tire to roller interface that bugs me.

Have you ever noticed all the powdered rubber just behind the rollers? Its the tire surface getting ground up by the diamond tread on the steel rollers. When you make the first pull on the dyno the tire surface is smooth. But as you get into your 3rd, 4th or 5th pull, the tire surface is finely shreaded brand new rubber.

That's changing the tire/roller interface friction coefficent! If anything, it probably makes the friction coefficent go up relative to the first pull few pulls. Giving a HP advantage to the later pulls. (this is just one of my speculative obesrvations of roller dynos)

Use a Dynapack. It totally elimates the unknown tire/roller interface variable and eliminates the mass of the wheel variable. They are much more repeatable. Dynapacks are as close as you can get to an engine dyno without all the hassle.

So now that I went totally OT I'll shut up.

Hydrazine

iTrader: (53)

I'm working on updating it now.

350zDCalb

iTrader: (21)

hydrazine...so what is the difference (hypothestically) from the 5/16 vs 1/2

i want to have a strut tower bar and i don't want hood spacers

jct

iTrader: (11)

Tony:

If I understand this, the Iso Thermal plenum internal supports would be the height of the plenum spacer, either 5/16 or 1/2 inch. If that is correct, will you be offering Iso Thermal plenum internal supports for those of us (at least 200) who purchased your 1/4 inch plenum spacer?