Skunk2 spacer
03-02-2009, 04:05 PM
#21
It speaks volume when they did not attend any of the dyno comparison days. They were called out in a So Cal thread not too long ago to do a side by side dyno comparison and they did not step up to the plate once again. Of course that thread was deleted for obvious reasons. Afraid?
Last edited by Rickdogg; 03-02-2009 at 08:15 PM.
03-03-2009, 07:06 AM
#23
Your spacer has been advertised as 5/8" thick plastic...Blox is also 5/8" thick plastic.
Should your 5/8" plastic spacer dyno any differently?
How come you deleted your thread in the So. Cal section? Without a link people cant see the details of our original discussion.
Anyhow, my offer remains open. If you like we can meet up at a independent dyno shop and redo the comparison you were asking for. We can invite MY350Z moderators, Modified Magazine and Nissan Sport Magazine for independent observation.
BTW - You were cordially invited by Nissan Sport Magazine to participate in the "Plenum Mod Shootout" but you (Skunk2) was absent for the event.
You are currently advertising your plenum spacer as being compatible with the 05 350Z and G35, so for good measure we can also submit our respective 05 plenum modifications for comparison on a 05 REVUP engine.
How about it? A second chance at the Nissan Sport Magazine "Plenum Mod Shootout!"
All in a friendly, honest and revealing competition. I'm sure everyone here would love to see it.
03-03-2009, 08:32 AM
#24
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03-03-2009, 09:03 AM
#25
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We use the Skunk2 spacers with no problems. I don't get where any of you guys think Skunk2 is eBay junk? Why because they make some of the highest quality consumer and race parts for Hondas? Skunk2 has been around a long time and has always pushed to make the best quality performance parts on the market and they make parts for a multitude of vehicles. They also have a state of the art prototyping and fabrication facility. They design stuff for a number of other manufacturers and OEMs.
Oh goody, they got called out for a dyno comparison, and they didn't show. Ever think that maybe they are a manufacturer that is 100x larger than Motordyne, and employ dozens of people? They don't have time to just drop everything they are doing. the marketing and product plans at a company that size can be made years in advance. That would be like calling out Edelbrock. Vic would tell you to shove it square in your dark place.
The Skunk2 spacer is actually a bit nicer than the average plenum spacer for most consumers because they can put it on with basic tools and it seals every time. We've had a number of customers come to us for tunes with leaking plenums because they didn't apply gasket sealer evenly, or it wasn't machined perfectly. The rubber gasket that is in place on the Skunk2 spacer assures that you won't have a seal issue.
Also have fun removing a spacer that you have to gasket seal to get to work right. The Skunk2 piece comes right off when you loosen the bolts. After having to do a number of repairs on cars I can say for certain it makes our lives much easier.
Honestly go pound your chest else where Hydrazine. I'm not saying you make a bad product, as a matter of fact you make an excellent product, and you're very well known in the Nissan community. But don't get all pissy because someone makes a decent product that competes with yours. That is sorta transparent. People compare Uprev to Cobb and Technosquare. Uprev is obviously the David to those Goliaths, but I'm not afraid of those products because I know what they make and I know the technological differences between their products and ours. Frankly we compete with HKS, Haltech, Utec, etc, and even there I can state a clear advantage in most cases and I can also concede to them having better products for certain instances. I cannot however make claims that Uprev makes more power, thats just poor marketing, I wouldn't stoop to that level. I also won't call any of those companies out for a dyno shoot out, not because it would show my products in a bad light, but thats aiming for the bottom of the barrel and doesn't prove too much.
You're talking about a spacer, a plenum spacer. This is not some crazy piece of technology. Dozens of companies make them and they make them in various sizes. It's a known issue with the air flow to the front to cylinders, and the advantages of increasing the plenum on any motor is also well documented. You didn't invent the wheel here, so why get so crazy wound up about superiority? I could turn around tomorrow and make a spacer that is 1mm thicker than yours and machine it out of identical aluminum and how exactly would you address that product? A rip off of your technology? Is yours still superior because that 1mm thickness difference?
Maybe in all my engineering and automotive knowledge I'm really missing something here.
Also if you're going to talk smack about Skunk2, stop trying to make claims of the plastic spacer being bad because they melt, and then posting about the Blox spacer. Everyone in the industry knows that the guys at Blox are the knock off company that makes things cheaper. Skunk2 has not had any melting issue that you can find. Your point is moot and thats final.
Oh goody, they got called out for a dyno comparison, and they didn't show. Ever think that maybe they are a manufacturer that is 100x larger than Motordyne, and employ dozens of people? They don't have time to just drop everything they are doing. the marketing and product plans at a company that size can be made years in advance. That would be like calling out Edelbrock. Vic would tell you to shove it square in your dark place.
The Skunk2 spacer is actually a bit nicer than the average plenum spacer for most consumers because they can put it on with basic tools and it seals every time. We've had a number of customers come to us for tunes with leaking plenums because they didn't apply gasket sealer evenly, or it wasn't machined perfectly. The rubber gasket that is in place on the Skunk2 spacer assures that you won't have a seal issue.
Also have fun removing a spacer that you have to gasket seal to get to work right. The Skunk2 piece comes right off when you loosen the bolts. After having to do a number of repairs on cars I can say for certain it makes our lives much easier.
Honestly go pound your chest else where Hydrazine. I'm not saying you make a bad product, as a matter of fact you make an excellent product, and you're very well known in the Nissan community. But don't get all pissy because someone makes a decent product that competes with yours. That is sorta transparent. People compare Uprev to Cobb and Technosquare. Uprev is obviously the David to those Goliaths, but I'm not afraid of those products because I know what they make and I know the technological differences between their products and ours. Frankly we compete with HKS, Haltech, Utec, etc, and even there I can state a clear advantage in most cases and I can also concede to them having better products for certain instances. I cannot however make claims that Uprev makes more power, thats just poor marketing, I wouldn't stoop to that level. I also won't call any of those companies out for a dyno shoot out, not because it would show my products in a bad light, but thats aiming for the bottom of the barrel and doesn't prove too much.
You're talking about a spacer, a plenum spacer. This is not some crazy piece of technology. Dozens of companies make them and they make them in various sizes. It's a known issue with the air flow to the front to cylinders, and the advantages of increasing the plenum on any motor is also well documented. You didn't invent the wheel here, so why get so crazy wound up about superiority? I could turn around tomorrow and make a spacer that is 1mm thicker than yours and machine it out of identical aluminum and how exactly would you address that product? A rip off of your technology? Is yours still superior because that 1mm thickness difference?
Maybe in all my engineering and automotive knowledge I'm really missing something here.
Also if you're going to talk smack about Skunk2, stop trying to make claims of the plastic spacer being bad because they melt, and then posting about the Blox spacer. Everyone in the industry knows that the guys at Blox are the knock off company that makes things cheaper. Skunk2 has not had any melting issue that you can find. Your point is moot and thats final.
03-03-2009, 09:10 AM
#26
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I have them in stock, they work excellent. As with most plenum spacers you will need to either remove the tie bar, or just use a few spacer/shims to move it up slightly. If you ever need to remove the plenum spacer it is a simple task, it's not stuck to the upper or lower plenum with gasket goop. Makes servicing the motor simple.
03-03-2009, 09:23 AM
#27
I don't think Hydrazine "beats his chest" for no reason. He is a very,very highly educated/knowledgeable individual and one of the nicest guys anyone will ever meet. Previously being a rocket scientist (literally) for Boeing is nothing short of amazing. He has never went off on any other of his competitors. People with character similar to his do not just go on attack mode for no reason. Think about that for a second.
Last edited by Rickdogg; 03-03-2009 at 10:07 AM.
03-03-2009, 12:05 PM
#28
Uprev,
Pounding chests? Getting pissy? You have this all wrong. Maybe you didn't see the original thread posted by Skunk2. Did you read that thread? It was Skunk2 that did the call out. (that thread mysteriously vanished)
1) They asked for the dyno comparison.
2) They strongly implied their competition used shady dyno results. The implication was referring to Motordyne.
You should be asking your honorable friends at Skunk2 for that thread to be revived and linked before making such accusations.
Skunk2 is too BIG to waste their time on a independent test?
Too BIG to publish truthful and accurate results?
Does the size of a company have any relation to its honesty and integrity?
It was Skunk2 that made the call out in the So. Cal. forum.
It was Skunk2 that suggested I used shady dyno results.
It was Skunk2 that has made veiled references to Motordyne on their website for a couple years now. Its all over the spacer section of their website.
OK, so they make the implications of impropriety in their thread. Of course, they can do the usual things competitors do. No problem. That's normal and expected.
They start a thread asking for the independent dyno comparisons.
Good. No problem. Lets do it. Let the truth be seen by all.
Tony
PS - You jumped the gun on this one.
Pounding chests? Getting pissy? You have this all wrong. Maybe you didn't see the original thread posted by Skunk2. Did you read that thread? It was Skunk2 that did the call out. (that thread mysteriously vanished)
1) They asked for the dyno comparison.
2) They strongly implied their competition used shady dyno results. The implication was referring to Motordyne.
You should be asking your honorable friends at Skunk2 for that thread to be revived and linked before making such accusations.
Skunk2 is too BIG to waste their time on a independent test?
Too BIG to publish truthful and accurate results?
Does the size of a company have any relation to its honesty and integrity?
It was Skunk2 that made the call out in the So. Cal. forum.
It was Skunk2 that suggested I used shady dyno results.
It was Skunk2 that has made veiled references to Motordyne on their website for a couple years now. Its all over the spacer section of their website.
OK, so they make the implications of impropriety in their thread. Of course, they can do the usual things competitors do. No problem. That's normal and expected.
They start a thread asking for the independent dyno comparisons.
Good. No problem. Lets do it. Let the truth be seen by all.
Tony
PS - You jumped the gun on this one.
03-03-2009, 04:55 PM
#29
JUNK2 Plenum spacer
As stated, Skunk2 is a great tuner in the honda community. I'm all for great companies that promote the car scene for enthusiasts. However, they do lack R & D in the VQ community. Just reference their website here for their lack of distinction with our VQ's:
http://www.skunk2.com/engine-2.php?code=ENGPLN (Attached also just in case someone tries to edit it)
They specifically state that their product application list is as follows:
-2003-2005 Nissan 350z's
-2003-2005 Infiniti G35's
Their dyno graph definitely does not apply to the REV UP VQ motors that are found in 2005 Anniversary edition 350z's and 2005 Infiniti G35's with 6MT transmission. These specific models came with rev-up motors and independent dynos have proven, that with a stock OEM rev-up lower plenum, a spacer does not do much in the form of any gains. Lets put their spacer on a REV-up and lets see how it does compared to a Motordyne Spacer with an MREV.
Skunk2 apparently has enough time on their hands to post within threads calling people out (deleted thread *cough* deleted thread), yet they do not have the time to send one measly Skunk2 spacer for a plenum shoot-out? That does not make any logical sense. It doesn't take an act of God to do something like that. We're not talking about the Olympics here.
I woudn't be surprised if we saw them edit their false information on their website lol. Wait...maybe they are too big of a company to do that as well. Recall that they are the one that started popping shots and now cannot even put their money where their mouth is?
http://www.skunk2.com/engine-2.php?code=ENGPLN (Attached also just in case someone tries to edit it)
They specifically state that their product application list is as follows:
-2003-2005 Nissan 350z's
-2003-2005 Infiniti G35's
Their dyno graph definitely does not apply to the REV UP VQ motors that are found in 2005 Anniversary edition 350z's and 2005 Infiniti G35's with 6MT transmission. These specific models came with rev-up motors and independent dynos have proven, that with a stock OEM rev-up lower plenum, a spacer does not do much in the form of any gains. Lets put their spacer on a REV-up and lets see how it does compared to a Motordyne Spacer with an MREV.
Skunk2 apparently has enough time on their hands to post within threads calling people out (deleted thread *cough* deleted thread), yet they do not have the time to send one measly Skunk2 spacer for a plenum shoot-out? That does not make any logical sense. It doesn't take an act of God to do something like that. We're not talking about the Olympics here.
I woudn't be surprised if we saw them edit their false information on their website lol. Wait...maybe they are too big of a company to do that as well. Recall that they are the one that started popping shots and now cannot even put their money where their mouth is?
Last edited by Rickdogg; 03-03-2009 at 05:09 PM.
03-04-2009, 08:17 AM
#30
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So can you post one that shows yours does better, and they can post one showing theirs does better. In the end they are both so crazy close to the same HP number. Every car is different and all cars will respond differently to even the exact same mods.
I think both companies can face the honest truth that they go about the exact same goal in slightly different ways.
If Motordyne is afraid that Skunk2 is invading his market and putting him out of business, then maybe he needs to reassess his business plans. If there isn't room for competition, then there is no innovation and the consumers suffer.
03-04-2009, 08:24 AM
#31
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As stated, Skunk2 is a great tuner in the honda community. I'm all for great companies that promote the car scene for enthusiasts. However, they do lack R & D in the VQ community. Just reference their website here for their lack of distinction with our VQ's:
http://www.skunk2.com/engine-2.php?code=ENGPLN (Attached also just in case someone tries to edit it)
They specifically state that their product application list is as follows:
-2003-2005 Nissan 350z's
-2003-2005 Infiniti G35's
Their dyno graph definitely does not apply to the REV UP VQ motors that are found in 2005 Anniversary edition 350z's and 2005 Infiniti G35's with 6MT transmission. These specific models came with rev-up motors and independent dynos have proven, that with a stock OEM rev-up lower plenum, a spacer does not do much in the form of any gains. Lets put their spacer on a REV-up and lets see how it does compared to a Motordyne Spacer with an MREV.
Skunk2 apparently has enough time on their hands to post within threads calling people out (deleted thread *cough* deleted thread), yet they do not have the time to send one measly Skunk2 spacer for a plenum shoot-out? That does not make any logical sense. It doesn't take an act of God to do something like that. We're not talking about the Olympics here.
I woudn't be surprised if we saw them edit their false information on their website lol. Wait...maybe they are too big of a company to do that as well. Recall that they are the one that started popping shots and now cannot even put their money where their mouth is?
http://www.skunk2.com/engine-2.php?code=ENGPLN (Attached also just in case someone tries to edit it)
They specifically state that their product application list is as follows:
-2003-2005 Nissan 350z's
-2003-2005 Infiniti G35's
Their dyno graph definitely does not apply to the REV UP VQ motors that are found in 2005 Anniversary edition 350z's and 2005 Infiniti G35's with 6MT transmission. These specific models came with rev-up motors and independent dynos have proven, that with a stock OEM rev-up lower plenum, a spacer does not do much in the form of any gains. Lets put their spacer on a REV-up and lets see how it does compared to a Motordyne Spacer with an MREV.
Skunk2 apparently has enough time on their hands to post within threads calling people out (deleted thread *cough* deleted thread), yet they do not have the time to send one measly Skunk2 spacer for a plenum shoot-out? That does not make any logical sense. It doesn't take an act of God to do something like that. We're not talking about the Olympics here.
I woudn't be surprised if we saw them edit their false information on their website lol. Wait...maybe they are too big of a company to do that as well. Recall that they are the one that started popping shots and now cannot even put their money where their mouth is?
How do you state that they lack R&D in the VQ parts they have made? Do you have some inside info on how many hours of development they did on these cars? Do you know how many units they've sold? Do you know how many track days they've spent testing their VQ products?
I know we've been at their facility testing our software on their test vehicles. We've spent a number of hours doing back to back comparisons and updates using their facilities to not only make our products more robust but to also make sure their products are as reliable and valuable as possible. They have a state of the art facility and some of the best engineers in the industry.
03-04-2009, 08:56 AM
#32
Would you still like to meet up at a independent dyno shop?
No hard feelings at all. A fair, friendly and open test session. Where everyone is invited.
Thank you,
Tony Colette
Motordyne
-------------
Who here has an 05 350Z or G35 with the REVUP engine that would like to volunteer for this independent dyno?
I'll donate a free spacer and MREV to the cause.
Thank you,
Tony
03-04-2009, 09:40 AM
#33
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TWO MEN ENTER ONE MAN LEAVES!!!
TWO MEN ENTER ONE MAN LEAVES!!!
TWO MEN ENTER ONE MAN LEAVES!!!
I would but I am a non-rev up. I would suggest anyone with a rev-up to volunteer.
~Robert
TWO MEN ENTER ONE MAN LEAVES!!!
TWO MEN ENTER ONE MAN LEAVES!!!
I would but I am a non-rev up. I would suggest anyone with a rev-up to volunteer.
~Robert
03-04-2009, 10:16 AM
#34
Would you just wet your little panties if they added an asterisk and mentioned that certain limited production 2005 models came with the RevUp motors?
How do you state that they lack R&D in the VQ parts they have made? Do you have some inside info on how many hours of development they did on these cars? Do you know how many units they've sold? Do you know how many track days they've spent testing their VQ products?
I know we've been at their facility testing our software on their test vehicles. We've spent a number of hours doing back to back comparisons and updates using their facilities to not only make our products more robust but to also make sure their products are as reliable and valuable as possible. They have a state of the art facility and some of the best engineers in the industry.
How do you state that they lack R&D in the VQ parts they have made? Do you have some inside info on how many hours of development they did on these cars? Do you know how many units they've sold? Do you know how many track days they've spent testing their VQ products?
I know we've been at their facility testing our software on their test vehicles. We've spent a number of hours doing back to back comparisons and updates using their facilities to not only make our products more robust but to also make sure their products are as reliable and valuable as possible. They have a state of the art facility and some of the best engineers in the industry.
I do not need insider information on all of the items you are referencing for what we are discussing. Maybe they did spend some time developing that one spacer for a DE VQ. However, their incorrect information shows that they either messed up and/or did not do extensive testing on the rev-up VQ's as well. The number of units sold has nothing to do with what they F'd up on. A big name, good marketing, and an ignorant buyer not knowing which products are better (referencing revup users) can add to sales. The number of units sold has nothing to do with their false information and the topic at hand. It may be true that they have a great facility and some good engineers, however they dropped the ball on this one and nothing can negate the fact that they did with some fancy boasting.
Lets not dodge the questions, concerns, arguments, and actual information posted. Or maybe it's better to dodge, duck, and run like they always have. Better yet, maybe they should utilize all of their great engineers and facility to develop something for the Rev-ups. Sadly they probably do not want to invest the time and money in to that since they can just sell the plenum spacer they have now as is to buyers that do not know better.
Last edited by Rickdogg; 03-04-2009 at 10:33 AM.
03-04-2009, 10:31 AM
#35
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Skunk2Tony,
Would you still like to meet up at a independent dyno shop?
No hard feelings at all. A fair, friendly and open test session. Where everyone is invited.
Thank you,
Tony Colette
Motordyne
-------------
Who here has an 05 350Z or G35 with the REVUP engine that would like to volunteer for this independent dyno?
I'll donate a free spacer and MREV to the cause.
Thank you,
Tony
Would you still like to meet up at a independent dyno shop?
No hard feelings at all. A fair, friendly and open test session. Where everyone is invited.
Thank you,
Tony Colette
Motordyne
-------------
Who here has an 05 350Z or G35 with the REVUP engine that would like to volunteer for this independent dyno?
I'll donate a free spacer and MREV to the cause.
Thank you,
Tony
Also, Skunk2 didn't remove the thread, the Mods did. (probably because Skunk2 doesn't have an advertising account).
Tony do you have access to flow benches? I'd actually be really interested in seeing how the flow changes per cylinder between the various spacers. I know Cosworth has crazy fluid dynamics prototypes set up in their system from designing their plenum and I'd like to see something along the line of that for a shoot out. (plus it helps us to understand the tuning required on really high end builds using these products).
03-04-2009, 07:22 PM
#38
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gonna hang around to watch this. Mainly because (so far) it has stayed a friendly banter between companies. I like factual arguments more than name calling anyway....this could prove to be good.
03-05-2009, 08:30 AM
#39
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Skunk2Tony,
Would you still like to meet up at a independent dyno shop?
No hard feelings at all. A fair, friendly and open test session. Where everyone is invited.
Thank you,
Tony Colette
Motordyne
-------------
Who here has an 05 350Z or G35 with the REVUP engine that would like to volunteer for this independent dyno?
I'll donate a free spacer and MREV to the cause.
Thank you,
Tony
Would you still like to meet up at a independent dyno shop?
No hard feelings at all. A fair, friendly and open test session. Where everyone is invited.
Thank you,
Tony Colette
Motordyne
-------------
Who here has an 05 350Z or G35 with the REVUP engine that would like to volunteer for this independent dyno?
I'll donate a free spacer and MREV to the cause.
Thank you,
Tony
No need to find a third party dyno to do a fair and friendly open test....we are more then happy to do any of the dyno testing at your Motordyne facility and use your dyno to run our spacer. I am fairly confident that our spacer makes the amount of power that we say it will since we R&D and Dyno every product we have here in house. I would like to see what type of dyno you run there for your testing to see the gains of our spacer. If anyone would like to come out to Motordyne and check this out they are more then happy to only if Tony C would permit us.
To also further clear things up we were never personally invited to join the plenum spacer shootout that you keep speaking of. We never received any e-mails nor phone calls regarding this matter. If this was mentioned on the forum this was not a formal invitation to us. We are more then happy to test our spacer against any other spacer on the market.
Thank You,
Tony
