Noisy lifter question?
02-23-2013, 04:11 PM
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Noisy lifter question?
I have ticking in my engine, and took it to a trusted mechanic. They said it's noisy lifters, and I should try chemicals, like SeaFoam, in my oil to minimize the noise. I tried that, but the noise hasn't gone down. I did a Google search and now it has me worried that the lifters are bent. How can I tell if my lifters are bent, and it's not just something else? Thanks.
02-24-2013, 01:52 PM
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He is not in the wrong forums. The VQ has hydraulic lifters. Mine makes a ticking noise as well and started at 65k miles.
Ive done the research and came up with nothing. Unless someone says otherwise, you are gonna have to get the lifter replaced.... and its a big job.
Its estimated at around a 8-10 hour job. Dealer is gonna charge around 2.5k-3.5k to get it done.
I'm driving around with the noise, and its annoying as hell. Saving up now, though haven't decided if I will fix it/or just sell it and get something else.
Anyone else with experience on this please chime in.
Ive done the research and came up with nothing. Unless someone says otherwise, you are gonna have to get the lifter replaced.... and its a big job.
Its estimated at around a 8-10 hour job. Dealer is gonna charge around 2.5k-3.5k to get it done.
I'm driving around with the noise, and its annoying as hell. Saving up now, though haven't decided if I will fix it/or just sell it and get something else.
Anyone else with experience on this please chime in.
02-24-2013, 04:27 PM
#5
obviously you have not taken one apart, the vq35 does not have lifters, let alone hydraulic ones, on top of that it dosnt use a hydraulic system AT ALL to adjust lash it is mechanical lash adjustment. go ahead show me a lifter for vq35de and ill show you that someone made you look stupid. it goes valve, spring, retainer, spring bucket/shim, cam there is nothing hydraulic in the system at all nor any sort of lifter.
you pay someone to change lifters and they are either idiots themselves or they tell you they are changing them and your paying them hundreds of dollars if not over a thousand to park your car in there parking lot for a couple days while they scam you. the fact that it is mechanical is WHY cams are noisy they dont adjust themselves like a hydraulic system would. next time comment on things you actually know about instead of what someone trying to scam you is telling you.
op you cannot tell because those parts dont exist in this engine.
edit:your probably looking at the spring buckets and thinking thats a lifter, its not its a shim to change the distance between the cam and the valve, its not hydralic or anything its just a bucket that sits over the spring and has a little *** on the inside that rests on the valve and they are various thicknesses to ensure the valve lash is in spec. its not a lifter of any sort, a lifter is a solid chunk or steel or a body with end caps and oil channels that pump up with oil pressure that rides on the cam and transfers the movement to pushrods and then rocker arms to actuate the valves. or in the case of the gm ecotec they are mini versions of the same thing that set valve lash with a rocker arm that mounts over the lifter and the valve and the cam then actuates the rocker directly. either way this engine has no such devices the cam actuates the valves directy.
you pay someone to change lifters and they are either idiots themselves or they tell you they are changing them and your paying them hundreds of dollars if not over a thousand to park your car in there parking lot for a couple days while they scam you. the fact that it is mechanical is WHY cams are noisy they dont adjust themselves like a hydraulic system would. next time comment on things you actually know about instead of what someone trying to scam you is telling you.
op you cannot tell because those parts dont exist in this engine.
edit:your probably looking at the spring buckets and thinking thats a lifter, its not its a shim to change the distance between the cam and the valve, its not hydralic or anything its just a bucket that sits over the spring and has a little *** on the inside that rests on the valve and they are various thicknesses to ensure the valve lash is in spec. its not a lifter of any sort, a lifter is a solid chunk or steel or a body with end caps and oil channels that pump up with oil pressure that rides on the cam and transfers the movement to pushrods and then rocker arms to actuate the valves. or in the case of the gm ecotec they are mini versions of the same thing that set valve lash with a rocker arm that mounts over the lifter and the valve and the cam then actuates the rocker directly. either way this engine has no such devices the cam actuates the valves directy.
He is not in the wrong forums. The VQ has hydraulic lifters. Mine makes a ticking noise as well and started at 65k miles.
Ive done the research and came up with nothing. Unless someone says otherwise, you are gonna have to get the lifter replaced.... and its a big job.
Its estimated at around a 8-10 hour job. Dealer is gonna charge around 2.5k-3.5k to get it done.
I'm driving around with the noise, and its annoying as hell. Saving up now, though haven't decided if I will fix it/or just sell it and get something else.
Anyone else with experience on this please chime in.
Ive done the research and came up with nothing. Unless someone says otherwise, you are gonna have to get the lifter replaced.... and its a big job.
Its estimated at around a 8-10 hour job. Dealer is gonna charge around 2.5k-3.5k to get it done.
I'm driving around with the noise, and its annoying as hell. Saving up now, though haven't decided if I will fix it/or just sell it and get something else.
Anyone else with experience on this please chime in.
Last edited by jerryd87; 02-24-2013 at 04:36 PM.
02-24-2013, 06:54 PM
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Okay so it's not noisy lifter, but I did get results on this site about replacing lifters, a bit odd. I trust the mechanic I go to as they tell it to me truthfully and told me just to use seafoam to solve the problem of noisy lifters. If they are mistaken and that noise isn't lifters, or even hydraulic lifters then what is that knocking noise?
02-24-2013, 07:56 PM
#7
read again and i already said it, the engines use mechanical lash to adjust the space between the spring buckets and the cams you change the lash by changing the spring buckets. they will always make alot more noise then a system with hydraulic lash adjustment, increased noise(if it actually is coming from the cams) would come from decreased oil film from switching to a oil with a thinner viscosity or thinner pour point(two seperate issues you will notice that different oils of the same viscosity pour easier or appear thicker thats the pour point) and also sea foam is also going to lower both slightly hence why your supposed to change the oil after a few hundred miles of sea foam in the oil. another possibility could be worn spring buckets or worn cams, noisy injectors would also make pretty much the exact same noise.
without hearing it for myself theres no way to know for sure though, top end noise isnt a knock its a tick, if its knock then a pulley could be off or a rod could be knocking indicating a spun bearing. i definitely wouldnt trust that mechanic though since he has no idea what he is talking about and makes crap up instead of simply looking at alldata which every shop ive ever seen has.
without hearing it for myself theres no way to know for sure though, top end noise isnt a knock its a tick, if its knock then a pulley could be off or a rod could be knocking indicating a spun bearing. i definitely wouldnt trust that mechanic though since he has no idea what he is talking about and makes crap up instead of simply looking at alldata which every shop ive ever seen has.
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02-25-2013, 12:01 AM
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obviously you have not taken one apart, the vq35 does not have lifters, let alone hydraulic ones, on top of that it dosnt use a hydraulic system AT ALL to adjust lash it is mechanical lash adjustment. go ahead show me a lifter for vq35de and ill show you that someone made you look stupid. it goes valve, spring, retainer, spring bucket/shim, cam there is nothing hydraulic in the system at all nor any sort of lifter.
you pay someone to change lifters and they are either idiots themselves or they tell you they are changing them and your paying them hundreds of dollars if not over a thousand to park your car in there parking lot for a couple days while they scam you. the fact that it is mechanical is WHY cams are noisy they dont adjust themselves like a hydraulic system would. next time comment on things you actually know about instead of what someone trying to scam you is telling you.
op you cannot tell because those parts dont exist in this engine.
edit:your probably looking at the spring buckets and thinking thats a lifter, its not its a shim to change the distance between the cam and the valve, its not hydralic or anything its just a bucket that sits over the spring and has a little *** on the inside that rests on the valve and they are various thicknesses to ensure the valve lash is in spec. its not a lifter of any sort, a lifter is a solid chunk or steel or a body with end caps and oil channels that pump up with oil pressure that rides on the cam and transfers the movement to pushrods and then rocker arms to actuate the valves. or in the case of the gm ecotec they are mini versions of the same thing that set valve lash with a rocker arm that mounts over the lifter and the valve and the cam then actuates the rocker directly. either way this engine has no such devices the cam actuates the valves directy.
you pay someone to change lifters and they are either idiots themselves or they tell you they are changing them and your paying them hundreds of dollars if not over a thousand to park your car in there parking lot for a couple days while they scam you. the fact that it is mechanical is WHY cams are noisy they dont adjust themselves like a hydraulic system would. next time comment on things you actually know about instead of what someone trying to scam you is telling you.
op you cannot tell because those parts dont exist in this engine.
edit:your probably looking at the spring buckets and thinking thats a lifter, its not its a shim to change the distance between the cam and the valve, its not hydralic or anything its just a bucket that sits over the spring and has a little *** on the inside that rests on the valve and they are various thicknesses to ensure the valve lash is in spec. its not a lifter of any sort, a lifter is a solid chunk or steel or a body with end caps and oil channels that pump up with oil pressure that rides on the cam and transfers the movement to pushrods and then rocker arms to actuate the valves. or in the case of the gm ecotec they are mini versions of the same thing that set valve lash with a rocker arm that mounts over the lifter and the valve and the cam then actuates the rocker directly. either way this engine has no such devices the cam actuates the valves directy.
Alright, I may have been mistaken on the hydraulic part, but I've seen the part in question being called lifter/shim/bucket. Alldata calls it a lifter and I believe the Nissan manual calls it a lifter as well, but I'm not sure. You seem to know your stuff so what would you suggest?
Here's a link where it refers to it as a lifter when checking clearance. http://www.alldatadiy.com/alldatadiy...28684/72630739 Its for an 09 altima but its still listed as a VQ35DE so I dont know if there would be any difference engine wise.
Here's a video (not mine) of what mine sounds like: http://smg.beta.photobucket.com/user..._0031.mp4.html
OP does yours sound like this? It ticks faster when revving up. Mine developed the noise around 65k miles. I've never over revved it and always changed the oil around 3k miles. I don't have any oil consumption and my mods are basic plenum spacer and intake.
02-25-2013, 07:59 AM
#9
i wouldnt worry about it, its not that bad if its about that loud and ive heard far worse using mechanical lash systems from less cams(in block cam engines) its simply something you have to deal with its the clearances opening up. you can replace the buckets to tighten the clearance but as time goes on they are going to open up again its nothing to worry about as long as they are in spec. i can tell you my engine is built loose so its alot louder then that and after 6500 miles on my built engine now i checked my clearances and the same as when i built the engine.
the noise has guaranteed always been there it just wasnt loud enough for you to notice it, you can try a heavier weight oil to try and lessen it but again its all bandaid's to try and fix a non existent problem, that type of noise is the downside of mechanical lash systems, hydraulic systems eliminate it but have issues above 6500-7000 rpms depending on lifter,oil,engine. unless your going to design and build a custom cylinder head your SOL
the noise has guaranteed always been there it just wasnt loud enough for you to notice it, you can try a heavier weight oil to try and lessen it but again its all bandaid's to try and fix a non existent problem, that type of noise is the downside of mechanical lash systems, hydraulic systems eliminate it but have issues above 6500-7000 rpms depending on lifter,oil,engine. unless your going to design and build a custom cylinder head your SOL
02-25-2013, 11:24 AM
#11
again show me one, and show me anything hydraulic associate with the springs and lash there isnt any ive had 2 of these engines apart now and pulling apart the third. seriously just go look at a picture of one, heck look at the fsm oil system theres no pathway for oil to even go to them. this is off a camery but its identical to what the vq35de uses.
you can argue all you want but there is 0 hydraulics associated with the springs and valves, the only hydraulics involved with the cams period is oil for the journals and the vvt system.
this picture is even better point out a single point oil to travel to the spring bucket, or how it would get oil inside to pump them up. the only oil that gets on there period is what flows out of the cam journals.
dont see how people who have never had one of these engines apart seems to think they know better then people who have built them...... probably why the FI guys dont frequent in here. not even sure where you got "hydraulic lash adjuster" from because thats not even in the fsm or any parts resource anywhere for this engine.
you can go get ripped off if you want but the noise will be back, nothing you can do about it.
this is what an actual hydraulic lifter looks like, down side is at high spring pressures the oil is just pushed right back out or at high rpms they pump up from higher pressure and increase lift causing bent valves. why race motors go to solid lifters.
you can argue all you want but there is 0 hydraulics associated with the springs and valves, the only hydraulics involved with the cams period is oil for the journals and the vvt system.
this picture is even better point out a single point oil to travel to the spring bucket, or how it would get oil inside to pump them up. the only oil that gets on there period is what flows out of the cam journals.
dont see how people who have never had one of these engines apart seems to think they know better then people who have built them...... probably why the FI guys dont frequent in here. not even sure where you got "hydraulic lash adjuster" from because thats not even in the fsm or any parts resource anywhere for this engine.
you can go get ripped off if you want but the noise will be back, nothing you can do about it.
this is what an actual hydraulic lifter looks like, down side is at high spring pressures the oil is just pushed right back out or at high rpms they pump up from higher pressure and increase lift causing bent valves. why race motors go to solid lifters.
Last edited by jerryd87; 02-25-2013 at 11:28 AM.
02-25-2013, 11:41 AM
#12
Lol that's what other posts on the forum have called them. They are very similar in style to HLA's except they are hollow/no oil hole.
Anyways, use the regular oil and add a quart of lucas. I wouldn't be too worried about it. My buddies car has been doing it for 2-3 years now and that's all it does is make noise.
Anyways, use the regular oil and add a quart of lucas. I wouldn't be too worried about it. My buddies car has been doing it for 2-3 years now and that's all it does is make noise.
02-25-2013, 11:52 AM
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Adjust the valve lash back within spec, while you are in there inspect the springs, seats and shims.
A good video of the car running, with the camera being moved around the engine bay, would help immensely.
A good video of the car running, with the camera being moved around the engine bay, would help immensely.
02-25-2013, 12:27 PM
#15
I could see that it would make a more apt description still a little off from finger followers like ecotecs and hondas use. Honestly though a lifter lifts and nothing like that in our engine. But in all honesty its nothing but a bucket with a **** inside. Its not worth bothering with this though because after a little time its just going to happen again and. It has 0 impact on reliability or function.
02-25-2013, 12:35 PM
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So its not worth replacing? Aside from research on the forums and my car, I've never heard another Z or any car with a VQ for that matter sounding like it. I know its just a noise as I havent noticed any power loss and its as smooth as ever. Although the noise is getting to me a bit. Driving around parking lots/near buildings makes it bounce around making it louder.
When people look over at me driving I dont know if they are just admiring the car or looking at because it sounds funny. I dont know what could cause it though. In frequent oil changes/low on oil perhaps? Im the second owner of mine.
I would hate to drop a couple of grand just to fix a noise. I guess maybe I will look into thicker oil + lucas and a louder exhaust to drown out the sound.
When people look over at me driving I dont know if they are just admiring the car or looking at because it sounds funny. I dont know what could cause it though. In frequent oil changes/low on oil perhaps? Im the second owner of mine.
I would hate to drop a couple of grand just to fix a noise. I guess maybe I will look into thicker oil + lucas and a louder exhaust to drown out the sound.
Last edited by dubbingt; 02-25-2013 at 12:36 PM.
02-25-2013, 01:14 PM
#17
if its a ticking like what the video posted earlier is then no dont worry about it, ive heard plenty ticking like that, mine is by far the worst ive heard and is significantly louder then that and like i said when i replaced my valve cover gaskets i checked and the clearances where still what i set them too after 6500 miles, and thats with bc spring and retainer kit requiring more force to open. if thats what it is then it gets quiter when the engine is warm vs cold? not quite but quiter? if so then yah dont worry about it, if it stays the same its something else going on. its annoying but thats just the way the system works.
start at 30 seconds you can here mine and this is warm after its quited down a little and using thick 15w40 oil
start at 30 seconds you can here mine and this is warm after its quited down a little and using thick 15w40 oil
So its not worth replacing? Aside from research on the forums and my car, I've never heard another Z or any car with a VQ for that matter sounding like it. I know its just a noise as I havent noticed any power loss and its as smooth as ever. Although the noise is getting to me a bit. Driving around parking lots/near buildings makes it bounce around making it louder.
When people look over at me driving I dont know if they are just admiring the car or looking at because it sounds funny. I dont know what could cause it though. In frequent oil changes/low on oil perhaps? Im the second owner of mine.
I would hate to drop a couple of grand just to fix a noise. I guess maybe I will look into thicker oil + lucas and a louder exhaust to drown out the sound.
When people look over at me driving I dont know if they are just admiring the car or looking at because it sounds funny. I dont know what could cause it though. In frequent oil changes/low on oil perhaps? Im the second owner of mine.
I would hate to drop a couple of grand just to fix a noise. I guess maybe I will look into thicker oil + lucas and a louder exhaust to drown out the sound.
Last edited by jerryd87; 02-25-2013 at 01:17 PM.
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