AutoX Practice Day - 8/6/05
. I will try to move my excursion to the next weekend.
08-02-2005, 10:51 AM
#5
So I was talk'n w/ BA Culter one day, and he mentioned an interesting idea that might peak the interest of some of the autoX guys (and others) here on this forum. BA Culter suggested that at one practice day we could have a gentlemen's competition of 350Z's. Something that didn't require class specifications, indexing, formalities and all the other rules of classification that you get in motorsports, it's essentially a "run what you brung" type of thing. He also had a catchy name for it too, I can't recall it right now.
If anything, the only rule that I would see that we should have is to give some guys a time adjustment bonus dependant on experience and car setup to level out the playing field of this "Z-race" we'd sorta have to have a concensus on that. And to top it all off, if we all agreed to it and would be willing to put a couple of bucks in for it, we could even have a big @$$ trophy for the winner.
The trophy thing aside, this could be pretty entertaining. We've always been comparing ourselves to each other from the practice results, why not turn it up a notch to make things more fun.
Input, comments, ideas?
If anything, the only rule that I would see that we should have is to give some guys a time adjustment bonus dependant on experience and car setup to level out the playing field of this "Z-race" we'd sorta have to have a concensus on that. And to top it all off, if we all agreed to it and would be willing to put a couple of bucks in for it, we could even have a big @$$ trophy for the winner.
The trophy thing aside, this could be pretty entertaining. We've always been comparing ourselves to each other from the practice results, why not turn it up a notch to make things more fun.
Input, comments, ideas?
08-02-2005, 12:09 PM
#6
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I would be inclined not to give any "equalizers," simply run what you brung. How about making it a Tri-Athelete series? A/X, Drag Racing and Track racing?
Use F1 points structure, top 8 places earn points, a win is worth 10, 8, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. Make the series include an equal number of each type of event, as to not favor one over the other.
Winner is crowned fastest Z in the Pacific NorthWest. Take the mods, the dollars spent and toss 'em to the wind. Note; at the point in time, my car is stock (to SCCA Solo rules). I think that sense car magazines, sanctioning bodies and other PC factors keep messing it up, we start our own series.
A lot of time is lost somewhere between the bench, the dollars spent, the number of mods and the results... so let's just focus on the fun of pure competition and let the results say what the will?
For A/X: there are plenty of events to designate a couple for points earners. Zs can enter their class as prepared or run "Time Only"... it really won't matter, since we just take the best time (+penalties: cones/gates). For Drag Racing; Test & Tune events seem to be the right venue. The trouble kicks in with the Road Racing. HPDE's usually don't allow "competition" or even time keeping... any ideas?
Each entry could pitch in a small fee to buy the winner's trophy... and then we move East, to devide and conquer Z whole world.
BC
Use F1 points structure, top 8 places earn points, a win is worth 10, 8, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. Make the series include an equal number of each type of event, as to not favor one over the other.
Winner is crowned fastest Z in the Pacific NorthWest. Take the mods, the dollars spent and toss 'em to the wind. Note; at the point in time, my car is stock (to SCCA Solo rules). I think that sense car magazines, sanctioning bodies and other PC factors keep messing it up, we start our own series.
A lot of time is lost somewhere between the bench, the dollars spent, the number of mods and the results... so let's just focus on the fun of pure competition and let the results say what the will?
For A/X: there are plenty of events to designate a couple for points earners. Zs can enter their class as prepared or run "Time Only"... it really won't matter, since we just take the best time (+penalties: cones/gates). For Drag Racing; Test & Tune events seem to be the right venue. The trouble kicks in with the Road Racing. HPDE's usually don't allow "competition" or even time keeping... any ideas?
Each entry could pitch in a small fee to buy the winner's trophy... and then we move East, to devide and conquer Z whole world.
BC
08-02-2005, 12:52 PM
#7
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Well, aren't we energetic!? Here are a few suggestions:
If a series of events is used, I think members ought to able to throw out a small percentage of events, in order to be able to do other things (weddings, bar mitzvahs, dog polishing, Camp Marie, etc.), or not be saddled with their worst performance. For example, if there is four events, you keep your best 3; 9 events, your best 7...
Level-playing-field-wise, the Canadians have a modification points system (which I've always preferred to the usual "these are the allowed mods") that assigns points to specific vehicle mods, which are added to arrive at a given car's preparation points. Then, classes are determined by point totals. Thus, for example, 0-6 points is "A," 7-12 is "B," 13-20 is "C," and so on. It allows greater freedom to personalize without as much penalty for picking one particular part -- like being moved up two tiers for making your Z-car's front camber adjustable.
We might be able to utilize the point totals to generate PAX-like comparative indexes. Just as a discussion starting point:
Each modification point equals .002 index points.
each swaybar = 2 pts
larger tire/wheel combos = 2 pts
aftermarket spring/shock combos = 4 pts
exhaust system = 2 pts
headers = 2 pts
harness = 1 pt
big brakes = 1 pt
Total = 16 pts = .032 = .968 multiplier (which is 1.000 -.032)
Against a bone stock Z running 60 seconds, this modified car would have to turn a 58.08.
Just a thought.
Mark
If a series of events is used, I think members ought to able to throw out a small percentage of events, in order to be able to do other things (weddings, bar mitzvahs, dog polishing, Camp Marie, etc.), or not be saddled with their worst performance. For example, if there is four events, you keep your best 3; 9 events, your best 7...
Level-playing-field-wise, the Canadians have a modification points system (which I've always preferred to the usual "these are the allowed mods") that assigns points to specific vehicle mods, which are added to arrive at a given car's preparation points. Then, classes are determined by point totals. Thus, for example, 0-6 points is "A," 7-12 is "B," 13-20 is "C," and so on. It allows greater freedom to personalize without as much penalty for picking one particular part -- like being moved up two tiers for making your Z-car's front camber adjustable.
We might be able to utilize the point totals to generate PAX-like comparative indexes. Just as a discussion starting point:
Each modification point equals .002 index points.
each swaybar = 2 pts
larger tire/wheel combos = 2 pts
aftermarket spring/shock combos = 4 pts
exhaust system = 2 pts
headers = 2 pts
harness = 1 pt
big brakes = 1 pt
Total = 16 pts = .032 = .968 multiplier (which is 1.000 -.032)
Against a bone stock Z running 60 seconds, this modified car would have to turn a 58.08.
Just a thought.
Mark
Last edited by Lateapex; 08-02-2005 at 01:01 PM.
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08-02-2005, 01:19 PM
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Hey, if the 3 of us are on this thread right this minute, who's steering?.. and my dog is naturally that shiney. 
Last edited by BA Cutler; 08-02-2005 at 01:22 PM.
08-02-2005, 01:31 PM
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I like Lateapex's explanation. I am totally stock so I am on average about 2 seconds slower then drivesolo/BA Culter on slicks and other mods, so indexing would just make me feel better 
. I could care less about the trophy but if everyone wants it I won't go against it.
As far as racing each other in real time we could go here: http://www.traxxracing.com/main.asp which is about 10 min away from Boeing and the winner of the autoX session gets a free ride using the money collected in the beginning.
At any rate, it doesn't matter what we decided on as long as I get to drive fast
.
. I could care less about the trophy but if everyone wants it I won't go against it.As far as racing each other in real time we could go here: http://www.traxxracing.com/main.asp which is about 10 min away from Boeing and the winner of the autoX session gets a free ride using the money collected in the beginning.
At any rate, it doesn't matter what we decided on as long as I get to drive fast
.
08-02-2005, 02:14 PM
#11
I like the way this thread is going. If we do get serious and attempt to do some type of "Fastest Z in the Northwest", do we need to have somebody making sure that it's all leg'it? If so, who would take on that responsiblity? (Note: Drivesolo is barely qualified to keep his checkbook balanced, and therefore should not be considered.)
08-03-2005, 07:25 AM
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I think running the different events will help smooth out the dissimilar set-ups. My set-up will help me a 60 second A/X course, but "7 Eleven" is going to slaughter me on the drag strip... and "Along" is going to do the same to me on the road course. The "equalizer" points make this whole deal more complicated. Do we really want to validate, measure, blah, blah, blah. How many people would participate in this little challenge amongst the brotherhood of Z owners? Which structure would you support: 1) Run what you brung, 2) System of equalizers?
BC
BC
08-03-2005, 08:02 AM
#14
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I'm a big believer in 'simplicity is beauty,' so, fewer rules is almost always better. Nonetheless, in a RWYB (acronym I just coined: Run What You Brung -- feel free to give me credit for it) scenario, a stocker like Glenn's will get smooshed in all venues. (Unless we include a concours, where yellow cars invariably get just-because votes from me.)
Here's a totally different suggestion: two-car teams.
1) Rank all attendees cars (let's pretend there are eight) by consensus
2) Team together 1&8, 2&7, 3&6, 4&5
2a) Pick humorous/ironic/cool team names
2b) Vote on best team name and give that team some kind of bonus
3) Add each team member's best time to that of his teammate's to establish the team score
Yeah, an odd number of participants would require more resourcefulness.
Your witness, counselor.
Here's a totally different suggestion: two-car teams.
1) Rank all attendees cars (let's pretend there are eight) by consensus
2) Team together 1&8, 2&7, 3&6, 4&5
2a) Pick humorous/ironic/cool team names
2b) Vote on best team name and give that team some kind of bonus
3) Add each team member's best time to that of his teammate's to establish the team score
Yeah, an odd number of participants would require more resourcefulness.
Your witness, counselor.
08-03-2005, 08:51 AM
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Well, Glenn, as an accomplished autocrosser, I expect you will "over-perform" in a relatively stock car but, as a starting point for establishing fair competition, my suggestions pertain to the vehicles themselves. Once that is agreed-upon, we can entertain driver adjustment.
And, of course, were we to adopt the three-venue plan of BACutler, you (and me and others) would be SMOOSHED by 7Eleven, for one, in the other two activities.
And, of course, were we to adopt the three-venue plan of BACutler, you (and me and others) would be SMOOSHED by 7Eleven, for one, in the other two activities.
08-03-2005, 09:39 AM
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I'm thinking tires are going to be a huge factor in this... Simply changing from track slicks for autoX to drag slicks for a 1/4 mile run is going to be quite the advatage. Not sure how you'd even out the field with that.
Perhaps we should just stick to run what you brung and see what happens....then modify it from there.
Perhaps we should just stick to run what you brung and see what happens....then modify it from there.
08-03-2005, 10:21 AM
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We could also have sub groups: Those with race tires and those without...cross compare, etc etc...who knows.
Huge props to Brian (Rahtok) for helping me put on my stillen sways last night.
Man, these things rock...I should have done this mod first...what a difference!!!
Huge props to Brian (Rahtok) for helping me put on my stillen sways last night.
Man, these things rock...I should have done this mod first...what a difference!!!
