My visit to the BAR smog referee
10-28-2003, 01:18 PM
#1
....for your health
Thread Starter
My visit to the BAR smog referee
As most of you may know I was written up for vc. 27156 violation (gross polluter) this weekend. I was dinged on my CAI and exhaust. I knew I didn't stand a chance on the CAI since Injen is scheduled to receive their CARB EO# in January. Replaced the stock air box (with K&N) and that's it.
Showed up to the BAR referee today and had the smog done on my car. I asked the techs about having an aftermarket catback exhaust and whether CHP could issue a vc. 27156 violation for the exhaust. It seems to be a very gray area, but from researching heavily over the last few days I found enough info to support that the case that only a smog official can truly determine whether a aftermarket catback exhaust is in violation on vc. 27156.
I found out from numerous exhaust manufacuters that CARB does not issue any EO#'s for any aftermarket exhausts since they rarely have anything to do with emissions. An aftermarket exhaust will pass visual but may fail the "sniffer". In this case the vehicle can be found in violation of vc. 27156 by the smog tech.
The only thing that a law enforcement official should issue a citation for is vc. 27150 (adequate muffler) or vc. 27151 (modication of exhaust to alter noise >96dB). Since I was not cited for noise the BAR referee did not have to test my exhaust dB levels (although I think I would have passed).
My car was thoroughly inpected visually, the car was then placed on the dyno and sniffed at 15 and 25 mph as well as idle. I passed on all tests
. Ticket was signed off and I'm sitting pretty.
Here is a link to a recent CHP bulletin addressing the sound issue:
http://www.tunerxtreme.com/chp_exhaust_bulletin.htm
From the web site:
"Aren't all exhaust system modifications prohibited?
No. Section 27151 VC prohibits the modification of the exhaust system to amplify or increase the noise emitted by the vehicle, making the vehicle not in compliance with Section 27150 VC or exceeding the noise limits established in Sections 27201-27206 VC. Section 27151 VC does not prohibit all modifications to an exhaust system. It also does not prohibit all modifications that increase the noise level of the exhaust system over that of the original, factory-installed exhaust system (as it did until 1980). It only prohibits modifications that result in a noise level higher than those specified in Sections 27201-27206 VC. Accurately determining compliance with Sections 27201-27206 VC for enforcement purposes is generally impractical. Enforcement personnel must make an informed professional evaluation to determine if excessive noise statutes are being violated."
Please note that I'm not a lawyer and do not pretend to be one. Take this advise and make your own decision. I just wanted to let people know the outcome of my experience as I found it incredibly difficult to find any information in regards to catback aftermarket exhaust in regards to smog laws.
Hope this info helps anyone who is hassled by CHP for exhaust in the future.
Showed up to the BAR referee today and had the smog done on my car. I asked the techs about having an aftermarket catback exhaust and whether CHP could issue a vc. 27156 violation for the exhaust. It seems to be a very gray area, but from researching heavily over the last few days I found enough info to support that the case that only a smog official can truly determine whether a aftermarket catback exhaust is in violation on vc. 27156.
I found out from numerous exhaust manufacuters that CARB does not issue any EO#'s for any aftermarket exhausts since they rarely have anything to do with emissions. An aftermarket exhaust will pass visual but may fail the "sniffer". In this case the vehicle can be found in violation of vc. 27156 by the smog tech.
The only thing that a law enforcement official should issue a citation for is vc. 27150 (adequate muffler) or vc. 27151 (modication of exhaust to alter noise >96dB). Since I was not cited for noise the BAR referee did not have to test my exhaust dB levels (although I think I would have passed).
My car was thoroughly inpected visually, the car was then placed on the dyno and sniffed at 15 and 25 mph as well as idle. I passed on all tests
. Ticket was signed off and I'm sitting pretty.Here is a link to a recent CHP bulletin addressing the sound issue:
http://www.tunerxtreme.com/chp_exhaust_bulletin.htm
From the web site:
"Aren't all exhaust system modifications prohibited?
No. Section 27151 VC prohibits the modification of the exhaust system to amplify or increase the noise emitted by the vehicle, making the vehicle not in compliance with Section 27150 VC or exceeding the noise limits established in Sections 27201-27206 VC. Section 27151 VC does not prohibit all modifications to an exhaust system. It also does not prohibit all modifications that increase the noise level of the exhaust system over that of the original, factory-installed exhaust system (as it did until 1980). It only prohibits modifications that result in a noise level higher than those specified in Sections 27201-27206 VC. Accurately determining compliance with Sections 27201-27206 VC for enforcement purposes is generally impractical. Enforcement personnel must make an informed professional evaluation to determine if excessive noise statutes are being violated."
Please note that I'm not a lawyer and do not pretend to be one. Take this advise and make your own decision. I just wanted to let people know the outcome of my experience as I found it incredibly difficult to find any information in regards to catback aftermarket exhaust in regards to smog laws.
Hope this info helps anyone who is hassled by CHP for exhaust in the future.
Last edited by failsafe; 10-28-2003 at 03:48 PM.
10-28-2003, 03:16 PM
#5
....for your health
Thread Starter
No this was a result of being stopped at the intersection of Hwy 9 and Hwy 35 (Santa Cruz Mountains) at around midnight on Friday. Apparently the CHP disagrees with people who want to drive up there at night and showed their disapproval by writing me fix it tickets.
10-28-2003, 03:26 PM
#6
so they pulled you over and started looking for anything they could find? they used to do that kind of thing at places where they thought racing might be going on, but they didn't pick on a solitary car. A lot of trouble for you to go through. I guess that was thier idea.
10-28-2003, 03:36 PM
#7
....for your health
Thread Starter
I was with longbowe and one of his buddies in an STI- they were both stock so they couldn't get them for anything. They had me pop my hood and wrote me a ticket for the cold air intake, which is currently illegal (Injen will be releasing CARB EO# in Jan, making it legal). Also wrote me a ticket for the exhaust which they cited incorrectly.
As you mentioned they did it to be a pain in the a$$. We were not cited for speeding or any other moving violation.
As you mentioned they did it to be a pain in the a$$. We were not cited for speeding or any other moving violation.
Last edited by failsafe; 10-28-2003 at 05:19 PM.
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10-28-2003, 03:46 PM
#9
....for your health
Thread Starter
Yes- no front plate as well but that's a simple sign off. Yes, I'm planning to run the stock intake until the Gruppe-M is received. I'm then planning to use the Injen upper piping with the Gruppe'M filter (if it works).
10-29-2003, 04:46 AM
#11
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Sucks to hear about having to go to a state ref. Glad it worked out. Is it possible for you to have brought the car with the Injen on for them to test as well? Perhaps if the car still passed the actual smog test they wouldn't trip on the intake.
10-29-2003, 07:14 AM
#12
failsafe,
I just installed a JWT POP charger in anticipation of racing that mouthy s2000 guy who doesn't want to race. they (JWT) says this is CARB approved, but do you think I should get some verification in writing to keep in the car? I am going to attach a wide inlet like I had on my Grand National intercooler to duct cold air up to it and it seems to have made a big difference over the KN drop in as is. Won't know until tonight I guess. S2000 guy said he can't make it, but waited until the last minute.
I just installed a JWT POP charger in anticipation of racing that mouthy s2000 guy who doesn't want to race. they (JWT) says this is CARB approved, but do you think I should get some verification in writing to keep in the car? I am going to attach a wide inlet like I had on my Grand National intercooler to duct cold air up to it and it seems to have made a big difference over the KN drop in as is. Won't know until tonight I guess. S2000 guy said he can't make it, but waited until the last minute.
10-29-2003, 11:01 AM
#14
....for your health
Thread Starter
SJTrackZ- Air intakes are clearly defined under smog laws and cannot be altered without a CARB Executive Order # (EO#). According to Injen, they currently waiting on their CARB EO# for the 350Z intake which is expected in January.
Once the CARB EO# is issued for the Injen CAI it can be installed and the EO# provides exemption from the smog laws. Injen will provide a placard which needs to be installed on the intake. The placard will have the CARB EO# stating that the intake has been tested and approved by the California Air Resource Board. Injen should also provide some paperwork for the glovebox that contains the same info.
Since Injen does not yet have the EO# I knew I could not pass visual. Aftermarket exhausts are not so clearly defined under smog guidelines so they can pass visual and if they pass emissions then they are OK.
Fowlman- If the JWT popcharger is indeed CARB approved then JWT should have provided the placard and paperwork. Sometimes the intakes are sold and the CARB approval is done at a later date. As in the case of my Injen intake- once the CARB EO# is issued to Injen I will be able to contact them and show them proof of purchase of the CAI. They can then send me the CARB exemption placard and paperwork. You should contact JWT to find out if they have a CARB EO# on the popcharger, if they do have them send you the necessary paperwork and placard.
Once the CARB EO# is issued for the Injen CAI it can be installed and the EO# provides exemption from the smog laws. Injen will provide a placard which needs to be installed on the intake. The placard will have the CARB EO# stating that the intake has been tested and approved by the California Air Resource Board. Injen should also provide some paperwork for the glovebox that contains the same info.
Since Injen does not yet have the EO# I knew I could not pass visual. Aftermarket exhausts are not so clearly defined under smog guidelines so they can pass visual and if they pass emissions then they are OK.
Fowlman- If the JWT popcharger is indeed CARB approved then JWT should have provided the placard and paperwork. Sometimes the intakes are sold and the CARB approval is done at a later date. As in the case of my Injen intake- once the CARB EO# is issued to Injen I will be able to contact them and show them proof of purchase of the CAI. They can then send me the CARB exemption placard and paperwork. You should contact JWT to find out if they have a CARB EO# on the popcharger, if they do have them send you the necessary paperwork and placard.
10-29-2003, 11:11 AM
#15
Thanks failsafe!
It kind of sounded like you needed somethiing printed that the donut man could look at. I will contact them and get that. All I have now is an email that says it is and I don't think the CHP will go for that. I have been trying to get my Z as fast as I can get it and still be 'legal". I don't want to put a front plate on though. I guess I will get one of those tow hook plate holders to carry around in the car and try the dumb a$$ approach when I get stopped and hope it works.
It kind of sounded like you needed somethiing printed that the donut man could look at. I will contact them and get that. All I have now is an email that says it is and I don't think the CHP will go for that. I have been trying to get my Z as fast as I can get it and still be 'legal". I don't want to put a front plate on though. I guess I will get one of those tow hook plate holders to carry around in the car and try the dumb a$$ approach when I get stopped and hope it works.
10-29-2003, 11:18 AM
#16
....for your health
Thread Starter
I hate front plate as well. Last time I got a "no front plate" violation was 4-5 years ago. It was a simple sign off and $10 fee. Not sure if the fee has changed but I'll let you know since I got dinged on no front plate as well.
10-29-2003, 03:27 PM
#17
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It's supposed to be the same fee. First thing I did when I stopped was to prop my plate up on my dash. Got a "go home" and that's it. I guess only SF cops are **** about that.
Then again, I think they were a little hesitant about pulling me over in the first place. It was only when I turned into the vista point that they herded me over.
Then again, I think they were a little hesitant about pulling me over in the first place. It was only when I turned into the vista point that they herded me over.
10-30-2003, 08:22 AM
#20
Originally posted by yobri
He!! yeah they are! But CHP can be just as bad too...
He!! yeah they are! But CHP can be just as bad too...