Dave 90TT

iTrader: (4)

I've got Hawk HT-60's for the rear for race pads, so yes, all 4 corners.

I can always change them at home on friday, bed them in Friday afternoon, and let them cool Friday night. It all depends on what the wife says, though! (She is out of town until Friday, so we haven't talked about it yet)

Anyways, I might take you up on the garage offer. I'll let you know. Thanks for the offer.

Dave

GaryM05

Sounds good - just let me know.

If it were me, I'd change & bed them the night before the event. You can easily drive to and from a track day on those pads without many problems, just remembering that they won't stop as well when they're cold, and that it's best to apply the brakes a little later/harder than usual when using track pads on the street, in order to build up some heat and keep from riding them against the rotor. Some pads are known to be abusive to rotors when they're cold, but the compunds that you've got should be fine (Hawk Blues are really the notorious ones for being brutal to rotors when they're cold).

dkmura

iTrader: (64)

Amen to that!

funkymonkey1111

i'd be interested in going to this event with you guys. i see they require a tech inspection--is anyone going to the early inspection times (namely this thursday?)

any idea how many cars are registered? i see they limit this to 50 cars total.

myspivey

iTrader: (5)

Ill second that one. My buddy has Orange pads on his Audi and they are doing about the same. Think he is going to go through two sets of rotors before those pads are up.

shushikiary

I'm considering going, but I dont have any pads other than the stock brembo bads (it's an 03 track model), think those would be ok?

I'm pretty stock on the car other than a popcharger and borla TD, but I do have summer tires on it (245-40-18 fronts and 275-40-18 rears BFG KDW's). I am running stock brake fluid, etc. So if there is anything you think I should change out let me know.

myspivey

iTrader: (5)

You can go on all that xept maybe the fluid, since it will be a hot day, id probably say a fluid flush would be good for you. Real easy job though.

Dave 90TT

iTrader: (4)

I ran stock brakes and pads at PMI (a 2.2 mile, 10 turn roadcourse), and my brakes would last about 3-4 laps before the fade was too unsafe to drive anymore. That was on my TT G35, which is faster and heavier than a stock Z. Based on what was said about this course, the stock brakes will work, although certainly, there is room for improvement. Bleed the lines, and maybe get some higher performance pads (although it might be too late to find good pads)

Dave

dkmura

iTrader: (64)

It's been said before, but bears repeating. Valvoline Synpower DOT 4 brake fluid is cheap and readily available (I think Autozone has a quart for about $6-7). Bleed your brake lines and master cylinder completely and you can thank me later...

Mudd

iTrader: (2)

I won't be there guys after all. I completely forgot about my brakes until this afternoon. My brake pads are nearly shot and new ones have been on order for some time but have been on backorder. I hope to have them soon. They are fine for driving, but one day at the track and I know they won't last.

Sorry for the false alarm. It's possible that I may go to spectate and hang out for a few.

dkmura

iTrader: (64)

Brian- Give me a call. I have some used Brembo Cobalt Friction GT-Sport pads that you could use. They still have plenty of material left and would see you through your ZCCC track day.

David Muramoto
Senior Editor
Nissan Sport Magazine
(303) 752-9777

GaryM05

If you can make it to the early tech, I would recommend doing it, as that's one less thing to have to worry about doing at the track (not to mention the fact that it gives you more time to fix anything that comes up during the inspection). I'd go to the early tech if I could, but there's no way I'll be able to get there in time after work...I'll just have to deal with it at the track if I end up going.

I don't know how many cars are registered, but I'd be very surprised if they came anywhere close to their limit of 50.

GaryM05

One more thing to mention, as it's always surprising how many folks show up to a ZCCC track day without having read the entry form: in addition to a helmet meeting the required specs, you'll also need to have long pants and long sleeves in order to be allowed on track. It's going to be pretty hot on Saturday, but the club seems to enforce these rules pretty strictly.

myspivey

iTrader: (5)

Starting to really loose faith in this event...

Darrel

Have you ever been to a z club track event? What is the reason you are losing your faith? Not enough 350zs? The z car line has been around since 1970. 240z, 260z, 280z, 280zx, 300zx(z31), 300zx(z32), 350z(z33). My 240 has parts from 4 different yr z's.

The z club puts a lot of time and effort making a safe and fun track day. The safety rules are there to keep insurance costs down.

Why don't you put on your own track event. You might get a half dozen cars to show up and split the $1600 cost of the track, IF you can find a track. La Junta doesn't allow open test and tune days any more. Pueblo requires the class certification for their open days. Maybe David can answer this, how long is the pueblo certification good for? A year?, 2? Lifetime? You won't need the certification if you are scca, nasa, pca, maybe bmw. But for the rest they need it. All for safety after what happened at La Junta last year.

The z club has been putting on at least 2 track days a year since 1990, maybe longer. People from other clubs that make it have said they really enjoy the z club track events.

Tech early to avoid the backup on track day.

There will be burgers, hot dogs and maybe brauts at the end of the track event. There will also be a CSP driving instructor giving a demonstration after the event.

Was I ranting?

Dave 90TT

iTrader: (4)

Yes, you were ranting. And in return, here's my rant:

I've been involved in two ZCCA groups, one in San Diego, and one in Maryland.

Both experiences were very poor. If you weren't a 240/260/280Z (not ZX!) owner, you were not part of the elite in crowd, and were relatively ostracized. I've owned 4 Z cars, an 83 280ZX, an 84 AE, a 90 Z32, and now my G35 (which I consider a 2+2 350Z). At the MD club, I had the 84 AE, and at the San Diego one, my Z32TT. Both times, I only went to a couple of the meetings, because it was a very exclusive group, and it was obvious that I would never be part of the club, just a bystander that happened to go to meetings.

Thus, based on those two experiences (both over 7 years ago, in the mid/late 90's, I admit), I don't have a very good taste about ZCCA's. So, that is one reason I would consider not attending this event. I didn't want to mention it, since I have no experience with the ZCCA here in Colorado, and who knows, you all might be completely different. You all might be a ZCCA group that is accepting of all years of Z's, rather than just the early ones. However, based on the tone of your rant, I have my doubts.

Good luck, and maybe I will see you this weekend, and maybe not.

Dave

myspivey

iTrader: (5)

Yes you were ranting and here is mine:

Why do you think i started MileHighZ? Maybe its becuse as Dave has said it, if your not in one of those old school cars or already part of the inner circle your not trully welcome. I attended plenty of meetings and was very intrested in making friends and being a big part of ZCCA and all i got in return was nothing. Scott was the only one who ever knew who i was and thought i should be there. Dont get me wrong, everyone was real nice, and i have nothing personal against the club, but car groups are for everyone and should be open and inviting to everyone. Thats my goal with Mile High, no dues, no pressure, just a big group of people who all really like what they do and get together to do it. Sure they spent a lot of time putting this weekend together, David spends less time putting together a bigger event at PMI that shows it has value to me, and has offered to do another. We get one a year from ZCCA, and no other events minus a drive to an ancient car museam? Davids event was worth 200 to me, if i cant see the value in a 50 dollar track day why would it matter? I never say no to track time but recalling what ive seen from ZCCA i dont want to be that guy on the track who keeps getting into everyones mirrors driving one of those damned 350z's which seems to be the retarded step child of Nissan to some ZCCA members. Sounds like your included. You think i need only 350's. Your far from the truth, i want car people who are friendly, i dont care what they drive, its the people that make a club, not the cars...

I give you all the best and im sorry you feel like im against the ZCCA club, but maybe that means ZCCA needs to reform how it does some things if more people like myself are going to feel welcome. Until then, Mile High Z will be around and hopefully one day we can co-run an event. If none of that happens, we still have our mountian drives to enjoy our cars. All the best to you but to be honest, now i really rather not go since that rant just reaffirms the feeling i have about not being welcome.

myspivey

iTrader: (5)

Oh, and sorry to bring you into this rant david, i just realized i really shouldnt have so im sorry, its not my place to put your events up against ZCCA since they are both unique in their own ways and good for their own reasons. They are two different tracks with two different groups. Sorry David! Just wanted to highlight why this track day does not have the value of other track days, and yours is the one i remember most since it was so good! (And it was my latest.)

funkymonkey1111

I went to a ZCCC "car show" at Tynan's last year and couldn't get anyone to talk to me about the club. it is truly an elitist group of dinosaurs wed to the 240/260/280 crowd.

of course, the social aspects of the club probably don't interest most on this board--the winery tours, the ski museum, wine tastings, etc. this looks more like a social clique whose common element is some sort of nissan product, not an enthusiast's club.

GaryM05

All I wanted to do was find out if I'd see some familiar faces this weekend at the track, and it's turned into another 'new vs. old' argument? Wow.

Everyone has their own set of opinions, and most have apparently already made up their minds as to where they stand. That's fine, and I don't pretend to be able to change that, but I can't help but post up my own opinion, even though I usually stay out of this argument.

The reasons for this disagreement ever happening have always confused me, as I think that most of those on both sides have more commonalities than differences, but those of us who have been on this board for awhile have heard most of this before, and it seems to me that both sides have their reasons for feeling as they do (although I really don't think that Darrel intended his post to be quite as inflammatory as it's been perceived):

- some of the 'old' guys think that the 350Z owners see their own cars as being 'the new hotness', and that they look down on the owners of older Z's as being 'old and busted' without recognizing that the new Z wouldn't exist without the long history established by the Z's that have come before

- some of the 'new' guys see the old ones as being a closed, social clique that doesn't want to admit that the world has moved on, and isn't interested in welcoming new members

Like any experience with stereotypes, the perceptions of some get unfairly assumed to be the attitude of the entire group.

My experience has been that the group of people within ZCCC that organizes and attends their track days is very open, and happy to have owners of new Z's show up, as they see it as a chance to meet new people who share a unique, common interest. However, this group is actually a very small percentage of the overall ZCCC membership, and isn't necessarily indicative of what you'll encounter at other types of ZCCC events (official meetings, car shows, winery tours, etc). In my opinion, this actually reflects what we've seen in our 350Z group, as those who come to the track days that dkmura organizes represent a very small percentage of those who come to other events, such as mountain drives, happy hours, etc. (not that there are dramatic differences of personality within the 350Z group, but there are certainly differences between those of us who are more into the track days, and those who are more interested in a dive-bombing canyon run, just to take one small example.) And something to keep in mind is that we've had several of the 240Z owners from ZCCC (including Darrel) become enthusiastic supporters of (and participants in) the track days that dkmura puts together, and I think that those events are better because of it.

As to the value question of one track event vs another, everyone has to make the decision for themselves as to what their time and money are worth in pursuit of their hobbies, but a quick overview of some of the track time options out there might help put a ZCCC event into perspective:

- The largest sports car club in the country (SCCA) charges around $300 for a typical club racing weekend. That $150 per day gets you 3 track sessions per day (20 minute practice, 20 minute qualifying, 30 minute - 45 minute race)

- NASA charges between $200 and $300 per HPDE/race weekend. That $100 - $150 per day typically gets you 4 track session of 20 minutes each for HPDE/Time Trial, or a 20 minute practice, 20 minute qualifying , and 2 races of 20 - 40 minutes each for the race groups

- ZCCC charges between $45 and $65 per day, and gives about 4 20 - 25 minute sessions (for those like me who hate to do math, that's roughly the same amount of track time that NASA provides, at 1/2 to 1/3 the cost)

- A dkmura event costs anywhere from $35 (in the good old days of La Junta) to $150 (for a full-on licensing school at Pueblo), and offers a significant amount of track time (believe it or not I've never actually recorded the amount of track time that we get at one of these events). We all know that these are becoming less frequent and more involved to plan & coordinate as track availability is drying up, and track management is putting more restrictions on what they'll allow. We've been spoiled to have these events (which are pretty much unheard of anywhere else in the country), and it's an unintended side effect that they offer so much value for money that they can make even a $50 track day, offering almost an hour and a half of track time (which is more than it sounds like to those who have never done a track day), seem like a waste to some.

That's a much longer post than I planned on (and it's probably not even very coherent or useful), but since this is my thread, I figured I'd offer my opinion.

Smile everyone - it could be worse...we could all be driving single-generation econoboxes, but instead we're proud members of a sports-car line that has revolutionized & shaped the industry for almost 40 years. Not many others can say that.