Z Car Garage Osiris Tune - Mostly stock DE
07-17-2011, 11:41 AM
#1
Z Car Garage Osiris Tune - Mostly stock DE
If anyone is interested here is some before and after tuning at Z Car Garage
2005 Touring 6MT
Popcharger
5/16" motordyne spacer
motordyne MREV2
Totally stock exhaust
Osiris Tuner - Custom tune
91 octane
Don't have AFR numbers plotted here but Rob stated the target was approx. 12.8:1 , I thought it's a little rich but can't complain with results/performance. He set it a little rich to be safer on a track in intense heat, which is exactly where the car went the day after the tune.
The numbers are pretty comparable to when I had an Emanage Ultimate installed, but the car feels a lot better especially at partial throttle. I can actually pass people in 6th gear again on the highway.
Attachment 1
2005 Touring 6MT
Popcharger
5/16" motordyne spacer
motordyne MREV2
Totally stock exhaust
Osiris Tuner - Custom tune
91 octane
Don't have AFR numbers plotted here but Rob stated the target was approx. 12.8:1 , I thought it's a little rich but can't complain with results/performance. He set it a little rich to be safer on a track in intense heat, which is exactly where the car went the day after the tune.
The numbers are pretty comparable to when I had an Emanage Ultimate installed, but the car feels a lot better especially at partial throttle. I can actually pass people in 6th gear again on the highway.
Attachment 1
Last edited by Wired 24/7; 07-17-2011 at 11:44 AM.
07-17-2011, 01:19 PM
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Good result! especially for low octane, interesting you think its a bit rich, a high compression N/A engines usually make the best power at 12.2-12.4 AFR so 12.8 IMO is a little lean, do you not see any knock at that AFR with 91 octane? or is there a lot of timing pulled?.
I am interested in how you managed to get EMU to work as all the adjustments are made after the std ECU, so unless you can control the std lambda feedback, the ECU will just readjust out any fueling adjustment you make in the closed loop areas, which effectively a large part of the load/RPM range.
I am interested in how you managed to get EMU to work as all the adjustments are made after the std ECU, so unless you can control the std lambda feedback, the ECU will just readjust out any fueling adjustment you make in the closed loop areas, which effectively a large part of the load/RPM range.
Last edited by Tricky-Ricky; 07-17-2011 at 01:39 PM.
07-17-2011, 01:55 PM
#6
I am interested in how you managed to get EMU to work as all the adjustments are made after the std ECU, so unless you can control the std lambda feedback, the ECU will just readjust out any fueling adjustment you make in the closed loop areas, which effectively a large part of the load/RPM range.
07-17-2011, 02:27 PM
#7
I already had Cipher - for Cipher owners the Osiris upgrade is currently $300, tune was something like 2 hours of Rob's time, plus dyno fee, plus the $300. I don't have an exact number since I had other work done at the same time.
No ping after the tune at all.
Tricky Ricky you might want to search more about what a ECU reflash is. The last time the car was tuned it made best power around 13.1 AFR, not all N/A engines are created equally. There was not a lot of timing pulled on this tune, no. Rob said he pulled timing in some places and added timing in other places. I haven't done a complete datalog on Cipher yet to see what he did.
All in all it was very worthwhile just to have a car that is more of a pleasure to drive and safe on the track, the added power is just a bonus.
No ping after the tune at all.
Tricky Ricky you might want to search more about what a ECU reflash is. The last time the car was tuned it made best power around 13.1 AFR, not all N/A engines are created equally. There was not a lot of timing pulled on this tune, no. Rob said he pulled timing in some places and added timing in other places. I haven't done a complete datalog on Cipher yet to see what he did.
All in all it was very worthwhile just to have a car that is more of a pleasure to drive and safe on the track, the added power is just a bonus.
Last edited by Wired 24/7; 07-17-2011 at 02:40 PM.
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07-17-2011, 04:31 PM
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07-17-2011, 04:44 PM
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I already had Cipher - for Cipher owners the Osiris upgrade is currently $300, tune was something like 2 hours of Rob's time, plus dyno fee, plus the $300. I don't have an exact number since I had other work done at the same time.
No ping after the tune at all.
Tricky Ricky you might want to search more about what a ECU reflash is. The last time the car was tuned it made best power around 13.1 AFR, not all N/A engines are created equally. There was not a lot of timing pulled on this tune, no. Rob said he pulled timing in some places and added timing in other places. I haven't done a complete datalog on Cipher yet to see what he did.
All in all it was very worthwhile just to have a car that is more of a pleasure to drive and safe on the track, the added power is just a bonus.
No ping after the tune at all.
Tricky Ricky you might want to search more about what a ECU reflash is. The last time the car was tuned it made best power around 13.1 AFR, not all N/A engines are created equally. There was not a lot of timing pulled on this tune, no. Rob said he pulled timing in some places and added timing in other places. I haven't done a complete datalog on Cipher yet to see what he did.
All in all it was very worthwhile just to have a car that is more of a pleasure to drive and safe on the track, the added power is just a bonus.
While i quite agree that all N/A engines are not equal, it does seem that post 2000 ECU design seems to advocate and thrive on leaner AFRs, i would be interested t see just how running 13.1 AFRs compared with 12.2 AFRs on the DE, and it was also my reason for asking about the amount of timing pulled especially using 91 octane fuel on a relatively high compression motor.
07-17-2011, 05:25 PM
#13
I understand perfectly what an ECU re-flash is thank you, i have also had a lot of experience with using piggybacks and PFC, and in particular the EMU, hence my questions, and i was genuinely interested to know how you where accomplishing overcoming the std ECUs tendency to re tune any post injector adjustment out, without the use of trimming the lambda feedback.
While i quite agree that all N/A engines are not equal, it does seem that post 2000 ECU design seems to advocate and thrive on leaner AFRs, i would be interested t see just how running 13.1 AFRs compared with 12.2 AFRs on the DE, and it was also my reason for asking about the amount of timing pulled especially using 91 octane fuel on a relatively high compression motor.
While i quite agree that all N/A engines are not equal, it does seem that post 2000 ECU design seems to advocate and thrive on leaner AFRs, i would be interested t see just how running 13.1 AFRs compared with 12.2 AFRs on the DE, and it was also my reason for asking about the amount of timing pulled especially using 91 octane fuel on a relatively high compression motor.
For whatever that's worth, the car's ECU did not like it when I tried to advance timing with Emanage ultimate. It was possible to pull timing but not to advance timing. At the time I advanced timing 2 degrees using cipher which did result in power gains.
The emanage worked well at adding fuel and the tune remained stable everytime I checked it with cipher multiple times over multiple months on the road. The car always read 13.1 under WOT.
Overall the osiris option is clearly the best thing to happen to tuning these cars since their inception. Unless your specific application needs a higher resolution map.
91 octane - welcome to California. We have plenty of Z's here and they all handle 91 just fine. Not optimal but not unsafe at all for mostly stock cars. If you're really going for higher numbers we do have some locations with E85 and 100 octane but I chose to go with a good safe 91 map... no sense for me to spend the extra money for maps I'm pretty much never going to use.
is this a rev up engine??
)
Last edited by Wired 24/7; 07-17-2011 at 05:31 PM.
07-17-2011, 06:31 PM
#15
Excellent question. Someone who uses their brain around here
And here's your answer: my car was one of the first test cars (if not the first) for the MREV2 (the thread still exists if you search for threads started by me). At first Tony at Motordyne didn't know if the MREV2 would make power on a stock DE non-revup. So we did a few dyno pulls bone stock, then installed MREV2 and ran the dyno a few more times, and it very clearly made power.
The next thing to try was adding a 5/16" spacer and trying again. It also made power but came up as diminishing returns.
On other DE non-revup cars, the 5/16" spacer was shown to make power comparable to MREV2 by itself.
Since the 5/16" spacer is cheaper than MREV2 and gave comparable gains it became well known on the forums that it was a better idea to buy a spacer only (for the non-revup).
But, MREV2 definitely makes good gains on a DE non-revup, so it stayed on my car since then. It only helps to have both the spacer and MREV2. MREV2 is just a flow-optimized stock lower plenum, so there's no way it can hurt.
The other motordyne goodies are nice too, the good quality gasket material and coolant cutoff valve keep the plenum and TB cooler on the road. Too bad other companies making aftermarket parts are nowhere near as diligent as Tony.
Last edited by Wired 24/7; 07-17-2011 at 06:34 PM.
07-18-2011, 07:02 AM
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Okay, it was not clear at all you were talking about the Emanage Ultimate.
For whatever that's worth, the car's ECU did not like it when I tried to advance timing with Emanage ultimate. It was possible to pull timing but not to advance timing. At the time I advanced timing 2 degrees using cipher which did result in power gains.
The emanage worked well at adding fuel and the tune remained stable everytime I checked it with cipher multiple times over multiple months on the road. The car always read 13.1 under WOT.
Overall the osiris option is clearly the best thing to happen to tuning these cars since their inception. Unless your specific application needs a higher resolution map.
91 octane - welcome to California. We have plenty of Z's here and they all handle 91 just fine. Not optimal but not unsafe at all for mostly stock cars. If you're really going for higher numbers we do have some locations with E85 and 100 octane but I chose to go with a good safe 91 map... no sense for me to spend the extra money for maps I'm pretty much never going to use.
For whatever that's worth, the car's ECU did not like it when I tried to advance timing with Emanage ultimate. It was possible to pull timing but not to advance timing. At the time I advanced timing 2 degrees using cipher which did result in power gains.
The emanage worked well at adding fuel and the tune remained stable everytime I checked it with cipher multiple times over multiple months on the road. The car always read 13.1 under WOT.
Overall the osiris option is clearly the best thing to happen to tuning these cars since their inception. Unless your specific application needs a higher resolution map.
91 octane - welcome to California. We have plenty of Z's here and they all handle 91 just fine. Not optimal but not unsafe at all for mostly stock cars. If you're really going for higher numbers we do have some locations with E85 and 100 octane but I chose to go with a good safe 91 map... no sense for me to spend the extra money for maps I'm pretty much never going to use.
I thought about running an EMU at first, but when i saw how the std ECU handled the fueling i thought better of it, also talked to some well respected tuners here and they where of the same opinion, that the CU will keep re adjusting any modification's made to the injector DC/duration to keep fueling within the pre set map values,
it also readjusts to the average driving style, if you just cruse or do lots of highway work, then run on a dyno, it usually take up to 6 pulls to get the performance back up to what it should be, and the resulting graph will show up to 15BHP and similar torque gain between the first and last pulls, this seems to apply to both narrow-band and wide-band fitted cars.
07-18-2011, 07:08 AM
#18
Depends on what year Z but yes this one has a wideband. It's not a "real" 0-5V wideband but works well enough for most purposes. I believe the adjustment made was adding duration or duty cycle to injectors but I don't remember as it was about 4 years ago.
Don't know what else to tell you other than what I've already told you, tune remained stable for months and over a year minimum. If you are paranoid about your tune wandering around then use cipher or periodic dyno runs to check it.
I kept it this way mostly because I've never seen serious gains on the exhaust side on a non-revup DE. My suspicion is that this is because we don't have variable timing on the exhaust cam.
Don't know what else to tell you other than what I've already told you, tune remained stable for months and over a year minimum. If you are paranoid about your tune wandering around then use cipher or periodic dyno runs to check it.
I kept it this way mostly because I've never seen serious gains on the exhaust side on a non-revup DE. My suspicion is that this is because we don't have variable timing on the exhaust cam.
Last edited by Wired 24/7; 07-18-2011 at 07:15 AM.
07-18-2011, 02:54 PM
#19
Registered User
[IMG]
[/IMG]
2003
Invidia Dual
KN Cone
2-3 hrs pretending I know how to polish upper plenum.
Maybe previous owner tuned it?
Debating headers+tune. Headers mostly for sound and seeing them when I open the hood. Have to install myself or its not worth it
[/IMG]2003
Invidia Dual
KN Cone
2-3 hrs pretending I know how to polish upper plenum.
Maybe previous owner tuned it?
Debating headers+tune. Headers mostly for sound and seeing them when I open the hood. Have to install myself or its not worth it
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