Sold my 350Z, bought a C5 Z06...comparisons inside
02-23-2006, 05:27 PM
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Sold my 350Z, bought a C5 Z06...comparisons inside
This is a post I made on www.z06vette.com. I had mentioned on this forum a few times that I bought a Z06, and a number of forum members seemed to be interested in hearing some impressions and comparisons to the 350Z...so, here they are. I've added in a few more comparisons in italics for this forum. I want everyone to realize that some of my comments are not meant to be harsh on the 350Z. I still love the 350Z, and will always value my 3 1/2 years of ownership experience with it.
Headlights
Okay, let me get this out of the way first. Who the decided to put these headlights on this car?!?! I almost drove into or over about 17 different objects the first time I tried driving this car in the dark. As some people would say, I was really ah-scared. In a city environment with glare and backlighting, visibility is horrible. My 350Z came from the factory with some sweet HID's, and the difference between the lights on these two cars is amazing. I constantly feel like I'm outrunning the headlights on the highway, and I think the pop-ups look terrible to boot. I can forgive a lot of deficiencies in a car, but these lights feel downright unsafe to me compared to many/most other cars I've driven. Skimping on interior plastics is one thing, but throwing a couple of fireflies in a jar on the hood would probably have been a more effective solution. These headlights are embarrasingly ineffective for a $50k car, period.
350Z is FAR superior in this area.
Now that we have that ugliness out of the way...on to the good stuff.
Engine
Acceleration is strong in every gear. Torque is tremendous. The engine has great flexibility, and I’m really looking forward to getting it on the racetrack. I’m guessing that I’ll have to shift a bit less than I did in my 350Z. I think stock power levels will be more than adequate for the foreseeable future on the street and track. As it stands, you can’t even accelerate hard on the street around town. The tires will just spin. In fact, the engine seems a bit wasted on the street. I use about 1/3 throttle most of the time on the way to work. When you stand on it in any gear, you’re almost instantly breaking the law.
Throttle response is great.
The engine note strikes an outstanding balance between mechanical symphony and angry noises. You can hear the valves tapping away, and the car sounds rather sedate when just bumbling around town. When you get into it, the volume is near perfect. It really thumps, and makes me smile every time. It’s not ear-splittingly loud, but you sure know you’re driving aggressively. No droning on the highway, and I never felt fatigued from the noise on my 20 hour trip. IMO, an outstanding balance of sound for a stock system.
The fuel economy is incredible for an engine that performs in this manner...better gas mileage than my 350Z and my 4 cylinder Subaru wagon.
Did I mention that the engine is massively flexible and has a lot of torque?
Overall, the engine is in a different league than the VQ. It is exactly what I always wished I had on tap when I had the 350. It is very poweful, and I'm guessing it's a lot more similar to a turbo'd 350 than an NA when. For reference, the prior owner of my car dyno'd it at 365whp...can't remember the torque...but it's up there. I know there are a TON of faster cars on the road (and I've driven or ridden in a bunch of them), but it really does push you back in the seat for a stock car. The fact that it gets slightly better gas mileage is a bonus. I'm gettin 21mpg around town and high 20's on the highway. My only obvious concern is reliability, but my research showed that they're pretty darn reliable. We'll just have to wait and see.
Transmission
Clutch is light and easy to use. Take up is fine. The shift throws are loooooong. After owning a bunch of Japanese cars, I feel like I’m rowing a boat when I shift. That said, it feels pretty good after you get used to the long throw. Gear engagement is fairly smooth and not too notchy, and they generally do slot home very nicely. I haven’t had a single problem finding a gear cross gate…it all works pretty seamlessly, and I don’t foresee any problems under aggressive driving conditions. I actually like a slightly heavier duty, mechanical feel to a gearbox like this car has. The Hondas have a great shift throw, but to me they always lack a little in mechanical feel when you actually slot them into gear. It’s more like you’re moving the stick to a certain position, rather than actually putting the car into a gear (if that makes sense). I’m finding reverse is a bit of a pain to get into at times. I sometimes have to clutch out, put it in another gear, then back to reverse...I'll probably live though.
I definitely prefer the shifter throw on the 350Z. It was much shorter, and only needed a flick of the wrist. I like the 350Z shift **** better. I prefer the feel of gear engagement on the Z06 however. The 350Z was a bit more notchy. Reverse was easier to get into though. In terms of feel though, they aren't terribly different. The throw on the Z06 is like my brother's old F150 truck.
Handling
As other owners know, this car has massive grip. 295 tires do that sort of thing to a car. When I first drove the car, it felt very large vs. my last car. The long hood and wide body contributed to that feeling. The rear end, despite it’s massive size, goes unnoticed when driving. As I get more comfortable in the car, it continues to shrink around me. I’m getting a good feel for where the tires are, and I don’t think I’ll have any trouble placing it through turns. At this point however, I do prefer the stubby feeling of the 350Z with its short overhangs. Unfortunately, I haven’t had the opportunity to drive the car through turns at the limit. I’ll have to wait for the track to do so, since the grip levels are so high. So, I’m unfortunately going to have to take the 5th on commenting on chassis feel, etc. until I can get the car to the track.
What I will say that turn in seems good, but again the front tires are huge. The car feels very neutral through fast highway on ramps, etc. Much less understeer than the stock setup on the 350Z, and more like the $5k suspension I had on my 350Z. My initial impression is that steering feel is not as good as the 350Z. The steering wheel is HUGE. I feel like BJ Mackay when I’m driving this thing. It makes me want to reach up and honk a big horn for the kids pumping their fists on the sidewalk. I would kill for the smaller diameter three spoke Momo in my Subie wagon. I imagine the wheel will not be particularly nice on the track. I’m hoping it’s better than I think it will be. Steering is fine for parking, and fine at speed on the highway. Again, I’m going to have to wait to comment too much on steering. It’s easier to judge controllability sliding through a turn than puttering around on the street.
The differential seems to work fine. I haven’t had any inside tires lighting up, and no clunking or popping when parking. Again, no major comments until I can push it a bit.
Handling on the Z06 is much more neutral than the 350Z was stock. Around town, onramps, and quick street driving, the capabilities feel similar to my Unitech/Truechoice coilover setup I had on my 350. The Z06 is a little cushier I think. For a stock suspension, it is very impressive thus far. I'll have to give some more feedback after I've had a chance to push it.
The steering wheel in the Z06 is awful with its four spokes. The 350Z with its massive three spokes wasn't that much better, but it was a smaller diameter. I wish I had an S2000 wheel in this car!
Ride Quality
I’m very impressed with the ride quality. I thought it would be much more harsh than it is. It almost feels cushier than the aftermarket suspension I had on my 350Z (which wasn’t even harsh). It soaks up bumps and dips, and generally feels pretty civilized. Response is about what I expected out of the car. The rear end seems a bit more active than in my last car, but by no means problematic. At first I thought the car was going to give up rear grip, but now I'm learning to trust it.
The one thing I didn’t really like on my trip was the car’s propensity to wander on the highway. The ruts left by semi-trucks drag the car all over the place. I need to get it in for a good alignment and hopefully this issue will be relegated a bit. I’m guessing this may be something to live with having steamroller sized tires.
Headlights
Okay, let me get this out of the way first. Who the decided to put these headlights on this car?!?! I almost drove into or over about 17 different objects the first time I tried driving this car in the dark. As some people would say, I was really ah-scared. In a city environment with glare and backlighting, visibility is horrible. My 350Z came from the factory with some sweet HID's, and the difference between the lights on these two cars is amazing. I constantly feel like I'm outrunning the headlights on the highway, and I think the pop-ups look terrible to boot. I can forgive a lot of deficiencies in a car, but these lights feel downright unsafe to me compared to many/most other cars I've driven. Skimping on interior plastics is one thing, but throwing a couple of fireflies in a jar on the hood would probably have been a more effective solution. These headlights are embarrasingly ineffective for a $50k car, period.
350Z is FAR superior in this area.
Now that we have that ugliness out of the way...on to the good stuff.
Engine
Acceleration is strong in every gear. Torque is tremendous. The engine has great flexibility, and I’m really looking forward to getting it on the racetrack. I’m guessing that I’ll have to shift a bit less than I did in my 350Z. I think stock power levels will be more than adequate for the foreseeable future on the street and track. As it stands, you can’t even accelerate hard on the street around town. The tires will just spin. In fact, the engine seems a bit wasted on the street. I use about 1/3 throttle most of the time on the way to work. When you stand on it in any gear, you’re almost instantly breaking the law.
Throttle response is great.
The engine note strikes an outstanding balance between mechanical symphony and angry noises. You can hear the valves tapping away, and the car sounds rather sedate when just bumbling around town. When you get into it, the volume is near perfect. It really thumps, and makes me smile every time. It’s not ear-splittingly loud, but you sure know you’re driving aggressively. No droning on the highway, and I never felt fatigued from the noise on my 20 hour trip. IMO, an outstanding balance of sound for a stock system.
The fuel economy is incredible for an engine that performs in this manner...better gas mileage than my 350Z and my 4 cylinder Subaru wagon.
Did I mention that the engine is massively flexible and has a lot of torque?
Overall, the engine is in a different league than the VQ. It is exactly what I always wished I had on tap when I had the 350. It is very poweful, and I'm guessing it's a lot more similar to a turbo'd 350 than an NA when. For reference, the prior owner of my car dyno'd it at 365whp...can't remember the torque...but it's up there. I know there are a TON of faster cars on the road (and I've driven or ridden in a bunch of them), but it really does push you back in the seat for a stock car. The fact that it gets slightly better gas mileage is a bonus. I'm gettin 21mpg around town and high 20's on the highway. My only obvious concern is reliability, but my research showed that they're pretty darn reliable. We'll just have to wait and see.
Transmission
Clutch is light and easy to use. Take up is fine. The shift throws are loooooong. After owning a bunch of Japanese cars, I feel like I’m rowing a boat when I shift. That said, it feels pretty good after you get used to the long throw. Gear engagement is fairly smooth and not too notchy, and they generally do slot home very nicely. I haven’t had a single problem finding a gear cross gate…it all works pretty seamlessly, and I don’t foresee any problems under aggressive driving conditions. I actually like a slightly heavier duty, mechanical feel to a gearbox like this car has. The Hondas have a great shift throw, but to me they always lack a little in mechanical feel when you actually slot them into gear. It’s more like you’re moving the stick to a certain position, rather than actually putting the car into a gear (if that makes sense). I’m finding reverse is a bit of a pain to get into at times. I sometimes have to clutch out, put it in another gear, then back to reverse...I'll probably live though.
I definitely prefer the shifter throw on the 350Z. It was much shorter, and only needed a flick of the wrist. I like the 350Z shift **** better. I prefer the feel of gear engagement on the Z06 however. The 350Z was a bit more notchy. Reverse was easier to get into though. In terms of feel though, they aren't terribly different. The throw on the Z06 is like my brother's old F150 truck.
Handling
As other owners know, this car has massive grip. 295 tires do that sort of thing to a car. When I first drove the car, it felt very large vs. my last car. The long hood and wide body contributed to that feeling. The rear end, despite it’s massive size, goes unnoticed when driving. As I get more comfortable in the car, it continues to shrink around me. I’m getting a good feel for where the tires are, and I don’t think I’ll have any trouble placing it through turns. At this point however, I do prefer the stubby feeling of the 350Z with its short overhangs. Unfortunately, I haven’t had the opportunity to drive the car through turns at the limit. I’ll have to wait for the track to do so, since the grip levels are so high. So, I’m unfortunately going to have to take the 5th on commenting on chassis feel, etc. until I can get the car to the track.
What I will say that turn in seems good, but again the front tires are huge. The car feels very neutral through fast highway on ramps, etc. Much less understeer than the stock setup on the 350Z, and more like the $5k suspension I had on my 350Z. My initial impression is that steering feel is not as good as the 350Z. The steering wheel is HUGE. I feel like BJ Mackay when I’m driving this thing. It makes me want to reach up and honk a big horn for the kids pumping their fists on the sidewalk. I would kill for the smaller diameter three spoke Momo in my Subie wagon. I imagine the wheel will not be particularly nice on the track. I’m hoping it’s better than I think it will be. Steering is fine for parking, and fine at speed on the highway. Again, I’m going to have to wait to comment too much on steering. It’s easier to judge controllability sliding through a turn than puttering around on the street.
The differential seems to work fine. I haven’t had any inside tires lighting up, and no clunking or popping when parking. Again, no major comments until I can push it a bit.
Handling on the Z06 is much more neutral than the 350Z was stock. Around town, onramps, and quick street driving, the capabilities feel similar to my Unitech/Truechoice coilover setup I had on my 350. The Z06 is a little cushier I think. For a stock suspension, it is very impressive thus far. I'll have to give some more feedback after I've had a chance to push it.
The steering wheel in the Z06 is awful with its four spokes. The 350Z with its massive three spokes wasn't that much better, but it was a smaller diameter. I wish I had an S2000 wheel in this car!
Ride Quality
I’m very impressed with the ride quality. I thought it would be much more harsh than it is. It almost feels cushier than the aftermarket suspension I had on my 350Z (which wasn’t even harsh). It soaks up bumps and dips, and generally feels pretty civilized. Response is about what I expected out of the car. The rear end seems a bit more active than in my last car, but by no means problematic. At first I thought the car was going to give up rear grip, but now I'm learning to trust it.
The one thing I didn’t really like on my trip was the car’s propensity to wander on the highway. The ruts left by semi-trucks drag the car all over the place. I need to get it in for a good alignment and hopefully this issue will be relegated a bit. I’m guessing this may be something to live with having steamroller sized tires.
02-23-2006, 05:28 PM
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Seating Position / Interior / Ergonomics
I think the seating position suits me well at 6’4”. The sills are actually lower than the 350Z, so it doesn’t feel as claustrophobic inside. My guess is that shorter people will be more comfortable in the Z06 than in the 350. The view out of the cockpit is also better, and blind spots are not nearly as bad in the Z06. I really like cozy feeling of the cockpit. I guess the best way to put it is that it actually feels more like a cockpit than the 350. Not quite like an S2000…it seems better suited for normal sized human adults compared to the knome-sized cabin on the S2000. The seat itself was great on the long trip and offered comfort and adequate lumbar support. The range of adjustment is solid, and I didn’t have any problem getting comfy for cruising or more focused driving. The side bolsters…wait, what side bolsters? A new seat will be near the top of my mod list for the track. I can’t believe they put these seats in this car. Without harnesses, I predict lots of left knee bruising on a track that has any right turns of note. They should have just put some sliding bench seats in and accomplished the same thing.
Seats in both cars are rather average. If I had to choose...hmmm...tough call. I'd probably take the 350Z seats for their additional side bolstering. The electric seats are nice for small adjustments, and lumbar is better on the Z06. Side bolstering on the Z06 is non-existent.
Controls are all within reach. They are laid out logically, and I didn’t need to read the owners manual to use them. Content is good as well. The HUD is great as a safety tool, and I imagine it will be a nice addition on the track. The computer is nice…lots of good info and easy to use. HVAC is fine. Radio controls make sense. The cup holder is the silliest thing I’ve seen in a while. If the cup is taller than 5 inches, it’s bound to tip over. Fortunately, I bought this car to drive, not as an accessory to my tall, skinny, foo foo latte drink.
2 accessory outlets are a nice thing to have…much better than one. That said, on my trip I had a GPS, Radar, phone charger, and Ipod. I could have used a couple more!
The interior materials on this car are comical…nothing new to report here. The controls came straight from the Cavalier parts bin. They are more Fisher Price than $50,000 wannabe supercar. The holy S#@t handle on the passenger dash seems senseless…the passenger can’t reach that when they’re pinned in the seat! My 350Z interior was much more modern looking and feeling. My fiancee’s RSX was worlds nicer. Our Subaru Legacy GT Wagon is light years ahead in terms of materials and composition. Just about every car I’ve owned or ridden in has a nicer looking interior. Fortunately, none of these “problems” bother me in the slightest. If I want a nice interior, I’ll drive my other car.
While the 350Z isn't exactly luxurious in terms of interior materials, I think the look is much nicer than in the Z06. All of the buttons and controls in the Z06 have this ugly rounded off look to them. They look super cheap. The plastic looks terrible...not terribly uniform in look or texture.
Cargo
The car seems to have plenty of luggage space. Interior cabin cargo is sparse to non-existent…no good cubby holes in which to stash stuff. The center console looks like I can probably squeeze a chiclet and some pocket lint in there.
Because of the strut bar in the 350, the Z06 has a larger, more useable trunk space. The cabin has no useful storage at all however.
I think that’s about it. It's probably obvious based on my comments, but I'm very excited about the car. The Z06 is killer. For me, the shoddy interior, headlights, etc. don't really diminish my enjoyment of the car...performance is what matters most to me. So far it’s even better than I hoped it would be, and I've really only had the chance to drive it like a pansey. For the price I paid, I don't believe there's anything even remotely close in terms of performance (stock). I was looking hard at the Lancer Evo and Subaru WRX STi. This car fell in between those two on price, and it's a 2003 with only 9,500 miles on it. PWith the release of the C6, and the C6 Z06, prices took an initial dive. They now seem to have stabilized in the low to mid $30k range for a nice example of an '02 or '03 model year with reasonable miles (about the same price as many of the 350Z models brand new). I've seen some slightly higher mileage '02's and '01's dipping into the high $20k's. I’m so glad that I stuck with my instincts and got a RWD sportscar however. I really enjoyed the driving experience of the 350Z, and the Z06 seems to be more of the same to the next level. I was a bit concerned that the car would be some sort of beast that wasn’t very civil or comfortable on the street (had a Viper in mind)…definitely not the case. The car is completely accessible and driveable, despite not being all that useable on the street (in terms of reaching its limits). I am painfully counting the days until I get it on the track.
I prefer the looks of the 350Z, although I think the C5 is a fairly timeless shape. The bulging fenders, etc. do it for me on the 350. Some of these design cues can be seen on the C6 Z06.
I didn't talk about things like image, owner profiles, etc., because that doesn't really interest me. I like all types and makes of cars as long as they are fun to drive. I used to buy into some of the stereotypes, etc., but I think working in the aftermarket has really changed my perception. Car guys are car guys, and real enthusiasts will talk shop with ANYONE about cars...even those that don't want to listen (girlfriends, innocent bystanders, etc.).
I hope that was useful to some of you that have considered this car, may be interested in learning more about them, or didn't realize that they were so affordable or useable as a daily driver. I'm sure that I'll be seeing some of you out at the track, etc., and I'll be happy to give anyone a ride in the car, or tell you more about the buying experience, what to look for, etc.
The one thing that's really nice about going from a 350Z to a Z06 is that I can still say, "I'm taking the Z out for a drive."
I think the seating position suits me well at 6’4”. The sills are actually lower than the 350Z, so it doesn’t feel as claustrophobic inside. My guess is that shorter people will be more comfortable in the Z06 than in the 350. The view out of the cockpit is also better, and blind spots are not nearly as bad in the Z06. I really like cozy feeling of the cockpit. I guess the best way to put it is that it actually feels more like a cockpit than the 350. Not quite like an S2000…it seems better suited for normal sized human adults compared to the knome-sized cabin on the S2000. The seat itself was great on the long trip and offered comfort and adequate lumbar support. The range of adjustment is solid, and I didn’t have any problem getting comfy for cruising or more focused driving. The side bolsters…wait, what side bolsters? A new seat will be near the top of my mod list for the track. I can’t believe they put these seats in this car. Without harnesses, I predict lots of left knee bruising on a track that has any right turns of note. They should have just put some sliding bench seats in and accomplished the same thing.
Seats in both cars are rather average. If I had to choose...hmmm...tough call. I'd probably take the 350Z seats for their additional side bolstering. The electric seats are nice for small adjustments, and lumbar is better on the Z06. Side bolstering on the Z06 is non-existent.
Controls are all within reach. They are laid out logically, and I didn’t need to read the owners manual to use them. Content is good as well. The HUD is great as a safety tool, and I imagine it will be a nice addition on the track. The computer is nice…lots of good info and easy to use. HVAC is fine. Radio controls make sense. The cup holder is the silliest thing I’ve seen in a while. If the cup is taller than 5 inches, it’s bound to tip over. Fortunately, I bought this car to drive, not as an accessory to my tall, skinny, foo foo latte drink.
2 accessory outlets are a nice thing to have…much better than one. That said, on my trip I had a GPS, Radar, phone charger, and Ipod. I could have used a couple more!
The interior materials on this car are comical…nothing new to report here. The controls came straight from the Cavalier parts bin. They are more Fisher Price than $50,000 wannabe supercar. The holy S#@t handle on the passenger dash seems senseless…the passenger can’t reach that when they’re pinned in the seat! My 350Z interior was much more modern looking and feeling. My fiancee’s RSX was worlds nicer. Our Subaru Legacy GT Wagon is light years ahead in terms of materials and composition. Just about every car I’ve owned or ridden in has a nicer looking interior. Fortunately, none of these “problems” bother me in the slightest. If I want a nice interior, I’ll drive my other car.
While the 350Z isn't exactly luxurious in terms of interior materials, I think the look is much nicer than in the Z06. All of the buttons and controls in the Z06 have this ugly rounded off look to them. They look super cheap. The plastic looks terrible...not terribly uniform in look or texture.
Cargo
The car seems to have plenty of luggage space. Interior cabin cargo is sparse to non-existent…no good cubby holes in which to stash stuff. The center console looks like I can probably squeeze a chiclet and some pocket lint in there.
Because of the strut bar in the 350, the Z06 has a larger, more useable trunk space. The cabin has no useful storage at all however.
I think that’s about it. It's probably obvious based on my comments, but I'm very excited about the car. The Z06 is killer. For me, the shoddy interior, headlights, etc. don't really diminish my enjoyment of the car...performance is what matters most to me. So far it’s even better than I hoped it would be, and I've really only had the chance to drive it like a pansey. For the price I paid, I don't believe there's anything even remotely close in terms of performance (stock). I was looking hard at the Lancer Evo and Subaru WRX STi. This car fell in between those two on price, and it's a 2003 with only 9,500 miles on it. PWith the release of the C6, and the C6 Z06, prices took an initial dive. They now seem to have stabilized in the low to mid $30k range for a nice example of an '02 or '03 model year with reasonable miles (about the same price as many of the 350Z models brand new). I've seen some slightly higher mileage '02's and '01's dipping into the high $20k's. I’m so glad that I stuck with my instincts and got a RWD sportscar however. I really enjoyed the driving experience of the 350Z, and the Z06 seems to be more of the same to the next level. I was a bit concerned that the car would be some sort of beast that wasn’t very civil or comfortable on the street (had a Viper in mind)…definitely not the case. The car is completely accessible and driveable, despite not being all that useable on the street (in terms of reaching its limits). I am painfully counting the days until I get it on the track.
I prefer the looks of the 350Z, although I think the C5 is a fairly timeless shape. The bulging fenders, etc. do it for me on the 350. Some of these design cues can be seen on the C6 Z06.
I didn't talk about things like image, owner profiles, etc., because that doesn't really interest me. I like all types and makes of cars as long as they are fun to drive. I used to buy into some of the stereotypes, etc., but I think working in the aftermarket has really changed my perception. Car guys are car guys, and real enthusiasts will talk shop with ANYONE about cars...even those that don't want to listen (girlfriends, innocent bystanders, etc.).
I hope that was useful to some of you that have considered this car, may be interested in learning more about them, or didn't realize that they were so affordable or useable as a daily driver. I'm sure that I'll be seeing some of you out at the track, etc., and I'll be happy to give anyone a ride in the car, or tell you more about the buying experience, what to look for, etc.
The one thing that's really nice about going from a 350Z to a Z06 is that I can still say, "I'm taking the Z out for a drive."
02-23-2006, 06:05 PM
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if the previous owner hasn't done it already, go ahead and order the brass gear kit for the headlights... GM in all their infinite wisdom chose plastic gears that will go out on you leaving you with the famous one headlamp up one down look... LOL Also go ahead and get the skip shift eliminator kit or go schedule an LS1 edit tune at a local speed shop to get rid of it and pick up some extra HP
They are badass rides for sure glad you're enjoying it, I couldn't stand the interior after driving my bro's C5 for a week...
They are badass rides for sure glad you're enjoying it, I couldn't stand the interior after driving my bro's C5 for a week...
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02-23-2006, 06:07 PM
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Yeah a 5.7L V8 vs a 3.5L V6, what would you expect? The vette is indeed a wanna be supercar and the 350Z is a sports car/sporty coupe. Would you buy a Z if it were priced at 51K with better performance? Probably not, so most people go to the next best alternative, performance upgrades. Anyways gearing is better on the Vette. The Vette will top out at 3rd Gear stock in the 1/4 mile while a 380HP twin turboed Z will top out hitting 5th at the last few secs at 110 mph. Vette Z06 will get a better jump off the start but rolling a well tuned FI'ed 350 will take a stock Z06 at about a similar cost. Anyways one thing overlooked is that the Z06 will still be under warranty.
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