mdepena

Heads up, Nissan is 40%+ owned by the French (Renault)!

During these trying times it pains me to no avail to realize this truth. It's a real shame, too. Built and engineered by Japanese and Americans, but managed out of mediocrity by the Brazilian-born Renault exec - Carlos Gohn.

My 2 cents.

mdepena

Correction:

Carlos Ghosn

TJZ

no ****. nissan would have gone bankrupt if it wasnt for renault and there would be no 350z.

ares

iTrader: (2)

I believe he was more reffering to the car having ties to france who is not backing america in the war.

this would pose a problem for me perhaps if I myself was not particularly keen on war. I dont feel it has been properly justified.

none the less, I live here, and I will support my country in whatever way nescessary. for those reasons I find myself right in the middle neither happy nor troubled by french ties to my beloved Z.

we ourselves are a democracy, I find it hipocritical to resent france for voicing their own opinion, however selfish their reasons may be. they have more of a right to be against us in the UN then we do completely ignoring them and 90% of the UN to attack on our own.

UFO

Tell ya what...I'll boycott France's crappy food and wine (don't drink wine) if I can have my Z.

sbz77

hey, if any of you guys want to get rid of your Z out of disgust, I'll take it

And don't forget to boycott those french fries.

D'oh

Hear, hear!

I agree completely with this (especially the hypocritical part). Seems like these days you can't say anything bad about the way the US handles its affairs without people calling you un-American or a traitor, when what you are really doing is expressing something the founding fathers of this country thought was a critical right, worthy enough to commit treason and risk death to preserve.

All I know is that thanks to the French, I now have a Z. To me, that is a cause for celebration (whether it be "champagne" or "sparkling wine" or good, old, crappy, all American Budweiser, hmm, maybe Rolling Rock would be more appropriate...oh, I know, Moonshine, the real American likker.)

-D'oh!

drake3

The French have a right to say and feel whatever they want. But I think the thing most people resent is the fact they are trying to stop an action by us that would "probably" be in our best interest in protecting the US. Saying they will veto any proposed UN resolution that leads to the use of force against Iraq if they fail to disarm is a little extreme. (my opinion)

There are too many Americans buried on Normandy for me to feel any differently. We came to their aid in the past when France was in trouble, our nation faces trouble today with a different enemy.

I don't feel people are un-patriotic or traitors if they are not for war. I am not for war. It is an evil, dreaded and disgusting action. However, I do feel the risk of non UN supported military action is warranted as opposed to the risk of no action which could lead to weapons of mass destruction being used on American civilians.

I have thought about the course of no-action. We don't disarm Iraq and they sell a nuclear weapon to a terrorist group which sets it off in downtown Chicago, NY or LA. Or Smallpox is spread accross the country killing many, many people. Is the risk of waiting for scenarios like this to play out in the future worth not going in and removing the source of the problem now?

LA-Z

What about Germany, Russia, China and others? Many countries, governments and people feel that the war is not a great idea. I hate this B.S. about how you can't disagree with the president or you are not a patriot. While I'm not a huge supporter of French politicks in the least, I'm not running out and ordering Freedom Fries and Freedom Toast either. Bottom line without critisim in times that are tough who knows when the Vietnam war would've ended.

dc350z

Since we are taking sides today...

Nixon was the one that got the US out the mess started by Democrats. NO ONE mentions that, EVER!

BTW, before we get into badgering Nixon and me for what he did on the domestic front, know this: His record and talent for foreign policy was one of the best the US ever had.

dc350z

And in regards to the original statement, indicating the "discovery" that the Regie owns part of Nissan...

Duhhh!!!
Welcome to 1999.

richZ

This is good news for me!

My company car list has reduced considerably following the downturn in the UK/US economies. So, my company, a US Multinational, has limited the car selection to a few manufacturers...

Ford Group, incl. Jag, Range Rover
Renault Group, possibly including Nissan TBD

So, for me, if I can buy and maintain my Z for a year, when my Company Car renewal comes up next year, I can sell it off (maybe for a profit?) and maybe get one as a Company Car

richZ

jj1814

George "dubbya" is rolling over everything the dang UN was created for! America is going to get enough of sticking their nose in everybody's business. LET THE UN handle it! "Dubbya" hasnt proven anything or given any proper justification in my eyes that this war is warranted. He is stirring up more attempts at US-directed attacks. How is Dubbya gonna just up and jump all over Iraq and didnt do **** about North Korea? I'M TELLING YOU....IT'S FISHY! Sounds like another Vietnam War (in which the gov't lied and got all those US troops killed for no reason.....damn shame too).

Forget Freedom Fries...throw mine in the trash, thank you. But I support the troops 100%. I have uncles and a father in the military. I just dont give a **** about our current administration.

Im not able to edit this as pleased..I have a meeting with my manager now. *dust*

m'sZ

iTrader: (1)

I agree 100% that this majority - American vs minority - UnAmerican is getting nuts these days. This country is about Freedom. Even though you say something I don't agree with, you have the right to say it, and that is what makes this country great.

Now for the protestors of any war. Leave the troops out of it. Do not spit on them or shout at them. They are just doing their jobs, and should be respected for that, end of story. Protest the decisions made by the administration, it's your right, but just leave the troops out of it.

The American Flag is a symbol for freedom, but it is also a symbol for the men and women who have died fighting for this country, so leave the flag out of your protests and be respectful. There are many, many avenues you can use to protest what you want, but leave the flag out of it.

I initially thought this as well for a while, but it is not George W. It's actually any of those countries who keep stalling the resolutions and threatening a veto for any action that are actually undermining the U.N.

The French just proved it for him. yesterday, they French basically said that if Saddam uses chemical or biological weapons, their stance would take on a whole different story. Sounds like proof-positive to me, no?

jackwhale

The governments of France/Germany/etc are objecting to ONE important decision which is being made by the US government...We plan to go to war now rather than wait. Our countries and the people of each country do not have to hate each other over this.

The decision to go to war is a very important decision but we shouldn't allow this to affect our future relationship...We'll continue to be allies down the road.

I find it reassuring for France to say that "if we are wrong and Iraq does have WMD then we will join the war".

kakey

Oh you mean like the USA and any UN resolution regarding Israel?

The fact is anyone with a veto has been actively undermining the UN including both France and the USA.

Regards,
Kevin

m'sZ

iTrader: (1)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by kakey
Oh you mean like the USA and any UN resolution regarding Israel?

I don't know enough about the Israel resolutions to argue about them.

Good point. Has the U.S. vetoed anything though? The fact that there is 5 permanent members is probably helping it too.

We should move this debate to a different forum or to a pm.

ethan84ae

Ghosn is an amazing manager, if it wasn't for his efforts and the success of the Nissan Revival plan, we probably wouldn't have a 350Z.

mcduck

First off, I am not picking on Ares... his was just the easiest quote to lift, but I want to address some of the more common themes running in this thread.

My preference would be that war would not be a necessity in any circumstance. That said, I agree with what some others have pointed out... we've tried for months... nay... years to work through the UN. Here lately, France has given the "we'll veto any resolution" stance to this situation.

If you and a group of friends (save one) agreed to drive to the beach and there was a big debate on how best to get there, would you not go because one person said "I don't care which way is decided upon, I'll vote to cancel trip no matter what!" Okay.. stupid analogy, but the point is... at some point, you have to take matters into your own hands and hope you have considered all consequences and that your are doing what's best.

I feel those in power are doing just that... they are, in my opinion, doing it poorly. They could have handled many diplomatic roadblocks better, but they are taking the course they feel is necessary. (for one, I think there should have been clearer disclosure of evidence indicating the necessity for an invasion)

If Iraq uses weapons of mass destruction or if weapons of mass destruction are found after a conflict, then I feel everyone will breathe a collective sigh of relief and say, "it was best that something was done". If nothing is found, the administration in power now will have lots of questions to answer.

Regardless, I will support and pray for our troops no matter what and will support our governments decisions if there is proper justification. May not like the decisions, but I will support them.

As for the French and Germans... they are being very self-centered about this. A lot of protestors claim the US is doing this because of oil. Those that are should check and see where the US gets most of its oil and where most of the Iraqi oil actually goes.

You can probably guess where I'm going with this... yep, the US gets very little of its oil from Iraq. On the other hand, France and Germany get a GREAT deal of their oil from Iraq. In particular, France gets something like 40% of their oil from there through exclusive contracts with several Iraqi oil companies. Guess what... these contracts are null and void if there is a change of regimes. That's the real reason the French are on their veto high horse.

Seems they don't have very good memories. If they did, they'd recall the reason they are even able to need gas these days is thanks, in large part, to the US. Below are the 10,943 reasons France should be supporting us...

(for those not familiar... the picture is the Normandy cementary where US soldiers who died during D-Day are buried...)

mcduck

Normandy...