My 350Z Review on AudiWorld...
07-25-2002, 01:26 AM
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My 350Z Review on AudiWorld...
I read some of the comments here and I am glad that most of you seemed to enjoy my writeup and photos of the Z vs. TT comparison.
I read a couple of remarks that said "Audi owners think they are the ****" and such and let me say that I went into this with a completely open mind and I think the remarks were honest and I tried hard not to have a bias one way or the other.
We Audi owners probably gripe a lot more than you think, and the remark that the Z will spend less time in the shop is probably correct (though you never know for sure about a first year model).
Just to respond to a couple of other comments, the TT does not share the Beetle platform. It does share the A3/Golf platform, but that's not such a bad thing. 80% of the parts are actually unique, and my TT has been modded with H&R coilovers, different control arms, a Neuspeed chip and such. So the ride is very sporty and certainly nothing like a Beetle or Golf.
Audi and Porsche are seperate companies, just to clarify. Someone made a comment about TT owners wanting to race, and I think our experience as owners is mostly the opposite. That is, other owners are constantly wanting to race us! Usually, I decline but every now and then I'll give it a shot!
Anyway, I liked the Z, I liked the color, I liked the performance and I liked the price. There are a few things I wasn't crazy about, but you're always going to have that. I think that most of you will be very happy with your cars!
You're probably going to want to check out Car Magazine when their article is released (I think Sep '02). Their photographer was hanging out of the back of a TT while I drove behind him in the Z, and the Road Test Editor drove inches from me in the TT.
In many cases, the photographer was hanging inches from the ground at 30 mph, I was inches behind him, and he would motion for me to get closer! Glad no one had to hit the brakes!
Anyway, the Car write up and pics should be great! Feel free to let me know if you have any other comments or questions! Oh and enough with the gay and girlie car remarks! (not that there's anything wrong with that!).
Brad Willis, Founder
SoCal TT Club
http://www.socalttclub.org
I read a couple of remarks that said "Audi owners think they are the ****" and such and let me say that I went into this with a completely open mind and I think the remarks were honest and I tried hard not to have a bias one way or the other.
We Audi owners probably gripe a lot more than you think, and the remark that the Z will spend less time in the shop is probably correct (though you never know for sure about a first year model).
Just to respond to a couple of other comments, the TT does not share the Beetle platform. It does share the A3/Golf platform, but that's not such a bad thing. 80% of the parts are actually unique, and my TT has been modded with H&R coilovers, different control arms, a Neuspeed chip and such. So the ride is very sporty and certainly nothing like a Beetle or Golf.
Audi and Porsche are seperate companies, just to clarify. Someone made a comment about TT owners wanting to race, and I think our experience as owners is mostly the opposite. That is, other owners are constantly wanting to race us! Usually, I decline but every now and then I'll give it a shot!
Anyway, I liked the Z, I liked the color, I liked the performance and I liked the price. There are a few things I wasn't crazy about, but you're always going to have that. I think that most of you will be very happy with your cars!
You're probably going to want to check out Car Magazine when their article is released (I think Sep '02). Their photographer was hanging out of the back of a TT while I drove behind him in the Z, and the Road Test Editor drove inches from me in the TT.
In many cases, the photographer was hanging inches from the ground at 30 mph, I was inches behind him, and he would motion for me to get closer! Glad no one had to hit the brakes!
Anyway, the Car write up and pics should be great! Feel free to let me know if you have any other comments or questions! Oh and enough with the gay and girlie car remarks! (not that there's anything wrong with that!).
Brad Willis, Founder
SoCal TT Club
http://www.socalttclub.org
07-25-2002, 01:36 AM
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Hey Brad - dont know if you remember me, I've been to a few of the TT club meetings in San Diego (lunch at Carl Strauss).
Anyway, I appriciate your posting these comments - very classy.
I will be switching from a TT to a Z in about 2 months, and will post my own comparisons of course at that time.
I think some of these Z folks need to actually meet a few TT owners instead of making their pat generalizations. How about we do a goodwill drive later this year?
Cheers,
Jason
Anyway, I appriciate your posting these comments - very classy.
I will be switching from a TT to a Z in about 2 months, and will post my own comparisons of course at that time.
I think some of these Z folks need to actually meet a few TT owners instead of making their pat generalizations. How about we do a goodwill drive later this year?
Cheers,
Jason
07-25-2002, 01:41 AM
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My brother owns a TT Roadster, the first year. While this car needs more power, it's still one hell of a great ride. I think the TT is a great car, but not for everyone. I personally feel it's overpriced for the performance it gives you. If the car came up to the Z's power levels it would probably get more expensive. But I can say this, when you get into the TT you can see and feel the quality and luxury put into the car.
Brad...Great write-up.
Brad...Great write-up.
07-25-2002, 01:51 AM
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Brad, I doubt that a there is a single person here that does not GREATLY appreciate your review and pics! You're a good guy that I remember from way back on AW as I've been there since '99. I vividly recall all of the sh*t you went through with the 180 NM TT. Glad you were able to finally get one that treats you right. I also know that you're aware that AW does have it's share of clueless clowns who do tend to tarnish the image of the Audi marque. We've got some of our own over here as well.
Regardless, thanks for the write-up and thanks for the pics!
Regardless, thanks for the write-up and thanks for the pics!
07-25-2002, 01:53 AM
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Re: LowFuel...
Hey Jason, of course I remember you! Sure, I'd love to have some of the Z guys (and gals) get together one day for a drive and such.
Sometimes I think we get into too much of an "us against them" mode. The reality is that these are both pretty bitchin' cars and we'll all have a hell of a lot of fun driving them.
Each has its own strengths and weaknesses, but so what? Usually, you'll find that the owners are mostly pretty cool once you get to know them.
I used to hear all of the jokes about Porsche drivers being a bunch of arrogant pric$s, but then I went to one of their rallies and just about everyone was way cool and really not so different from the TT owners.
In fact, the owners' similarities are usually much greater than the differences. We all like sports cars that look good, go fast, corner flat, don't spend too much time in the shop, and won't break the bank to buy one!
I think you'll really like the handling and power of the Z. I especially liked the way the torque came on almost instantly when upshifting from 2nd to 3rd for example.
Good luck and keep in touch!
Sometimes I think we get into too much of an "us against them" mode. The reality is that these are both pretty bitchin' cars and we'll all have a hell of a lot of fun driving them.
Each has its own strengths and weaknesses, but so what? Usually, you'll find that the owners are mostly pretty cool once you get to know them.
I used to hear all of the jokes about Porsche drivers being a bunch of arrogant pric$s, but then I went to one of their rallies and just about everyone was way cool and really not so different from the TT owners.
In fact, the owners' similarities are usually much greater than the differences. We all like sports cars that look good, go fast, corner flat, don't spend too much time in the shop, and won't break the bank to buy one!
I think you'll really like the handling and power of the Z. I especially liked the way the torque came on almost instantly when upshifting from 2nd to 3rd for example.
Good luck and keep in touch!
07-25-2002, 02:15 AM
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Brad,
Thanks for the info and pics...and for stopping by. Don't pay any mind to those who generalize and slander owners of a specific marque of car. Thanks again, and welcome.
Thanks for the info and pics...and for stopping by. Don't pay any mind to those who generalize and slander owners of a specific marque of car. Thanks again, and welcome.
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07-25-2002, 04:27 AM
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I don't know why there is any animosity towards the audi tt. The Z may have a passing resemblance to the tt, but tha't it. The two cars have little in common. The TT is more about style first and performance second. I think it is a very interesting car. The Z is more about performance first and style is second.
If you want more performance and less stlye look at the american pony cars.
If you want more performance and less stlye look at the american pony cars.
07-25-2002, 04:45 AM
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sorry I just read your "review" of he Z and can see where some anomosity comes from. First of all looks are subjective, and you obviously are quite taken with the tt.
The areas you give praise to the Z are obvious and beyond a doubt. Such as resonable price, fast, powerful engine, etc...
For subjective you seem to think the Z is OK, but lacks a soul, lacks class, not in the same league as the tt, will look commonplace compaired to the tt.
If you would take your head out of the sand you will find that the tt is not as fresh today as it was 3 years ago. I happen to love the tt, but a lot of people (and I don't mean Z people, I mean ordinary people) do not find it as much of a timeless classic as you. Have you ever heard "it looks like a bug (beetle) that somone sat on"?
Anyway to me your pictures of the 2 side by side give me a true indication of the real winner. I'm sure real aluminum and carbon fiber would be neat, but given the choice between a 287 hp V6 and a 180-225 hp four, I'll take the power.
The areas you give praise to the Z are obvious and beyond a doubt. Such as resonable price, fast, powerful engine, etc...
For subjective you seem to think the Z is OK, but lacks a soul, lacks class, not in the same league as the tt, will look commonplace compaired to the tt.
If you would take your head out of the sand you will find that the tt is not as fresh today as it was 3 years ago. I happen to love the tt, but a lot of people (and I don't mean Z people, I mean ordinary people) do not find it as much of a timeless classic as you. Have you ever heard "it looks like a bug (beetle) that somone sat on"?
Anyway to me your pictures of the 2 side by side give me a true indication of the real winner. I'm sure real aluminum and carbon fiber would be neat, but given the choice between a 287 hp V6 and a 180-225 hp four, I'll take the power.
07-25-2002, 05:25 AM
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Re: RAI
You are certainly entitled to your opinions, but there seems to be a trend of lashing out at anything written that isn't to one's liking.
I like the Z and I think that it will be a winner. I do believe that the TT has advantages in some areas. The Z has advantages in other areas.
I'm sorry that I can't see everything in the way that you want me to, but those are my sincere opinions. Even the Editor from Car made some comments similar to mine.
Don't take things so personally. People often see things in differing ways and that's okay. People intentionally flame the TT all the time, and I could care less. If that's their opinion, so be it. Of course what really matters is your opinion.
Rather than focus on the negative, you ought to focus on the many positive comments that I wrote, and understand that I spent many hours driving this car, assisting with the Car evaluation, taking the photos, uploading the pics, and writing my review. I knew some prospective Z buyers would check it out, and I figured they'd appreciate the effort.
Cheers, and enjoy your Z!
I like the Z and I think that it will be a winner. I do believe that the TT has advantages in some areas. The Z has advantages in other areas.
I'm sorry that I can't see everything in the way that you want me to, but those are my sincere opinions. Even the Editor from Car made some comments similar to mine.
Don't take things so personally. People often see things in differing ways and that's okay. People intentionally flame the TT all the time, and I could care less. If that's their opinion, so be it. Of course what really matters is your opinion.
Rather than focus on the negative, you ought to focus on the many positive comments that I wrote, and understand that I spent many hours driving this car, assisting with the Car evaluation, taking the photos, uploading the pics, and writing my review. I knew some prospective Z buyers would check it out, and I figured they'd appreciate the effort.
Cheers, and enjoy your Z!
07-25-2002, 06:52 PM
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EighTT
I may have been a little too hard on your review, I know the 350Z is not perfect, but like they say: "for the money...."
There is not a car out there that is perfect, but I don't think the Z is as bad as you make it out, such as: "lacks class, lacking soul, and not in the same league as the tt".
You said yoruself the tt is in need of an engine upgrade, but for some people the engine is the soul of a car, and so far the Z seems to have a good start in that catigory.
Well let's keep up the frendly rivalry.
Phil
There is not a car out there that is perfect, but I don't think the Z is as bad as you make it out, such as: "lacks class, lacking soul, and not in the same league as the tt".
You said yoruself the tt is in need of an engine upgrade, but for some people the engine is the soul of a car, and so far the Z seems to have a good start in that catigory.
Well let's keep up the frendly rivalry.
Phil
07-25-2002, 08:30 PM
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Thank you
EighTT, thanks for the feedback. That's what many of us here can hang our hats on until we actually get in our cars. Good, bad or indifferent, we love the feedback. Articles like yours give us something to pat ourselves on the back for, or raise hell in dibelief of the commentary. Either way, we're passionate about our cars on order and react accordingly...
I do believe your write-up certainly was biased. Why wouldn't it be, you're a TT guy?! I'd be biased too. All in all, you gave your honest opinions on the Z in comparison to the TT, and we should appreciate an opinion. Even though you're waaaay off...
Thanks again...
I do believe your write-up certainly was biased. Why wouldn't it be, you're a TT guy?! I'd be biased too. All in all, you gave your honest opinions on the Z in comparison to the TT, and we should appreciate an opinion. Even though you're waaaay off...
Thanks again...
07-25-2002, 08:34 PM
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rai, I'm glad you came back to post that follow up.... restored my faith a bit that the Z community is not going to build a bad reputation of its own (which would be ironic considering how much we've been bagging on the personas that drive other marques).
Friendly rivalry, couldn't have said it better myself.
Friendly rivalry, couldn't have said it better myself.
07-25-2002, 09:14 PM
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It's too easy to fly off the handle and start to *****, I know the "not in the same league" remark was directed at the interior of the Z, and not the whole car. I wish it had a better interior, but if you go for A++ in every catigory you end up with a car like the NSX, but you can't do that for $27-34K.
07-25-2002, 09:53 PM
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I for one thought the review was very well done. Not one of us would be able to compare a car to the one we own without some about of bias. I mean you have to have a bias to pick out a car in the first place!
I don't think anything was said that we haven't heard before. The interior didn't hold up against the Adui's. Well no kidding. Audi has been getting kudos for a long time on their interiors. They are very high quality and richly appointed. Nissan stated from the beginning they wanted to create a car with the Z DNA. A NO FRILLS sports car. No frills means plain appointments.
I was really glad to see side by side pictures of the cars. It really points out the differences. Both have pluses and minuses. The back of the Z and the front of the Audi are the weak points IMHO.
All in all the review felt very honest and genuine, and I am glad it was posted. Once I get my Z, maybe someone in San Diego with a TT will let me do my own comparison for posting on this site!
I promise to be honest, and would love the oppertunity to drive a TT. I have heard alot about them, but dont want to come to any conculsions unless I have personal experience.
I don't think anything was said that we haven't heard before. The interior didn't hold up against the Adui's. Well no kidding. Audi has been getting kudos for a long time on their interiors. They are very high quality and richly appointed. Nissan stated from the beginning they wanted to create a car with the Z DNA. A NO FRILLS sports car. No frills means plain appointments.
I was really glad to see side by side pictures of the cars. It really points out the differences. Both have pluses and minuses. The back of the Z and the front of the Audi are the weak points IMHO.
All in all the review felt very honest and genuine, and I am glad it was posted. Once I get my Z, maybe someone in San Diego with a TT will let me do my own comparison for posting on this site!
I promise to be honest, and would love the oppertunity to drive a TT. I have heard alot about them, but dont want to come to any conculsions unless I have personal experience.
07-25-2002, 10:15 PM
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I also liked the review, but I was puzzled with one thing. In the review you mention that most of the pieces in the Z that look like aluminum are actually plastic which isnt true. The interior and exterior door handles, the grab bar on the door, and other aluminum bits are just that - real aluminum. I think a lot of people are getting the idea that Nissan used cheap materials in the Z, and IMO, this is definitely not the case. Now, the Z doesn't have quite an Audi-esque interior, but it is still a very nice place to be. I think many people will be pleasantly surprised the first time they see one in person.
07-25-2002, 10:53 PM
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Originally posted by Alang
I was really glad to see side by side pictures of the cars. It really points out the differences. Both have pluses and minuses. The back of the Z and the front of the Audi are the weak points IMHO.
I was really glad to see side by side pictures of the cars. It really points out the differences. Both have pluses and minuses. The back of the Z and the front of the Audi are the weak points IMHO.
07-26-2002, 03:22 AM
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Re: Re: My 350Z Review on AudiWorld...
Originally posted by VQracer
Are you sure about that? I have read in many car magazines that they do share the same platform with the Beetle.
Are you sure about that? I have read in many car magazines that they do share the same platform with the Beetle.
VQ you are the man. goes to show what you can accomplish when you set your mind to it. Keep up the good work.