A vanquish Z

 

Some of you guys who want the car to go on a diet need to talk to an engineer AND a bean counter at the same time. The engineer is gonna tell you there only several ways to make a significant weight reduction: 1. Less structural bracing, which equals less safety, less torsional rigidity, less stiffness and thus, poorer handling; 2. Smaller engine, and does anyone want that?; 3. Make car itself much smaller, a la S2000, which I used to own, is no daily driver, and in any event, isn't fit for occupation by those with over a size 28 waist; 4. Use of exotic, weight-saving materials like titanium and carbon fiber, which the bean counter will quickly tell you will add mucho $$$$ to the sticker.

Pick your poison. Too many guys sound like they wanna have it all, but for $25k. That ain't gonna happen. FWIW, if NNA ever makes a carbon-fiber hardtop 'vert version of the GT-R for under $50k, I'll be the first customer, but I'm not holding my breath. Big difference between what we WANT and what is legitimately possible.

 

The new G37 has too many bells 'n whistles, and I don't want to pay for all of that. Now I'm really anticipating on the next generation Z after looking at the dyno graphs and videos of the G37.

http://www.automobilemag.com/multime...7_dyno_videos/

 

did they have any 0-60 and 1/4 times in that long article about the Nismo Z?

 

No, its not impossible to reduce curb wieght without upping the price. at least not when you do a full redesign of the car. Look at the toyota Celica. It dropped about 300lbs for the 2000 model year. The celica was cheap as well, no exotic meterials and it only weighed 2800 lbs to begin with. If toyota can drop 300lbs from a 2800lb car, Nissan can drop 200lbs from a 3200lb car.

 

I did NOT say it was impossible to reduce weight w/o upping the price, but that it was impossible to have it ALL w/o raising the price. In other words, I said that there WOULD be trade-offs. For argument's sake, I'll bite on your apples to oranges, sports car (Z) to sporty 4-banger (Celica) comparison. What did the Toy co. do to lose the weight? Did the dimensions of the car change? Did the safety of the car change in terms of elimination of structural bracing? And did they make an equal profit on the lighter car to the one on the old, heavier car?

Off the top of my head, I recall that the new Celica was significantly smaller than the old one (a friend of mine had both cars); even the new one was a weak sister un-modded. As I said, you could have a much ligher, better handling car by building a Honda S2000-like 4-banger with a smaller body, smaller interior volume, and smaller engine.

On a completely different level of sports car, the 'Vette has more body flex than its competitors, a cheap interior, and plastic body panels, but hey, it's lightweight and blows the doors off some cars which cost twice as much. But you also get an unreliable car, and even then, the Corvette price went up on the new redesign, which had some notable improvements.

 

If Nissan wanted they could use a titanium exhaust, braille battery, lighter weight rims, lighter seats, lighter high flow cats, lighter headers soooo many options. That would easily have the Z down by more than 150-200lbs..really how much would that add to the price of the car a few thousand???I think Ill pay the few thousand...Hell we do that stuff aftermarket....They would be able to do it for cheaper since the parts would be bought in bulk...so I dont see the price going up by that much...

 

370z Sounds Like Fun!!

 

1st of all, I agree with you that the next Z will probably be heavier. However I dont think it HAS to be that way. I used to own a celica and was a pretty active member of the community. I've ridden in many back seats and driven many celica's (including 6th and 7th generation celicas.) The interior volume of the 7th generation celica is really very comprible to the 4th, 5th and 6th gens. They both have little 4 banger engines (between 1.8 and 2.2 liters) and they are both front wheel drive. The difference between the models is not nearly as severe as the difference between the S2k and the Z. All I'm saying is that if engineers are clever and make weight saving a priority they can compromise a little bit from many different places and come up with a lighter car. Sacrifice a little power, a little room, a little comfort, a little safety then add a bit of new technology and you can end up with a much lighter car that seems to sacrifice very little to get that way.

But as I originally said, Nissan wont do it that way. It's far too big of a risk. they're going to spend their money developing other aspects of the car, rather than improving something that only hard core enthusiasts will really appreciate.

 

I don't disagree at all that the weight of the car can be reduced 150-200lbs. for "a few thousand," but if so, they won't make money. Most of the buyers aren't true enthusiasts, and won't pay that much money for that much weight reduction. I would want at least 500 lbs. in weight reduction for "a few thousand" dollars, and I have $15k in mods in my car. And the Feds' emissions standards won't allow for high flow cats.

 

I agree completely; for example, I wouldn't buy the car you propose. I wouldn't give up any safety, any power, any room or any comfort, as I'll admit I already think I've sacrificed those things somewhat with the car I have. I'm an "enthusiast," but my car is a daily driver (65k mi. on my '04), and I think the "hard core" guys are the ones who track their cars.

The folks who want a street-legal race car would agree with your preferences, and I remember the guys on the S2k forums carrying on for thread after thread about how to eliminate 10lbs. here and 20 lbs. there from their cars.

 

There's no way the '08 G37 coupe will have substantially more HP than the the '08 Z. Until the GTR is released, the Z will remain Nissan's flagship sports car and it willl not be topped by it's 2 + 2 Infiniti big brother...it would be bad for business.

The reason the '07 Z was not released until late January was to give more development time to the next gen '08 Z, which will debut at the Tokyo motor show in October and probably hit the dealers here in February of '08.

 

Do you have any sources that it will be at the Tokyo motor show or is it an educated guess? And if it is shown at the show, is it a for sure thing it will be released as a 08 model? I hope so.

 

2009 Z not 2008. The 350z is still going to be made for 2008. But the 2009 Z will hit the dealers in 2008.

 

i've heard this to, probably to compete with the next gen supra that is going to come out some time around 2008 or 9

 

I say leave those options for aftermarket. I wont want to pay a few thousand extra to make my Z a couple hundred pounds lighter. If you need power that badly go get a vett.

 

I'm pretty sure if anything they are referring to the 370Z to be announced in January.

See this thread:

https://my350z.com/forum/2009-370z/275112-new-rendering-from-the-latest-z-magazine-vol-4-a.html

 

How does "geeky white kid with braces" generalize and degrade a particular race? Arrogance and ignorance all in one... bravo.

Sorry for the threadjack guys. His comment probably didn't deserve a response, but I'm sick of people that are looking to be offended. Racism is a nasty thing, and so is slander.

[/endrant]

 

Let me see???How many people in this thread want teh Z to lose weight from the factory vs your cheap azzj/k ???hmmmmm

You will be spending more money than if it was done by the factory....You spend a few thousand at purchase time vs spending many many more thousands later.....Ill take it from the factory besides they can engineer things at its inception that can lead to less weight that you wont be able to do aftermarket for cheap.....

Case in point...Try to make your Z like the 38k Nismo Z they are selling right now......See how much money it will cost you to remove all of you interior just so a shop can seem weld the body/frame for increased rigidity the way Nissan did it from the factory......You would spend way more than the 4-8k premium the Nismo Z is to the regular Z's.....I didnt even mention the Suspension/body kit etc that make up the Nismo Z.....Factory will always be cheaper than if you decided to do it yourself...

 

Shot a corporate meeting for Nissan early May.....this was their plan at the time.