ReV2Red

iTrader: (9)

What's going on with this website?!?!? The search function is about as useful as a chocolate fireman, and it looks like all the old posts about brakes and suspension have been removed!!!

I'm going to be tracking the car about 4-5 times a year in the amateur series of the Spanish TIMEATTACK, and am wondering how well the stock brembos hold out. I've got axxis ult pads, braided lines and motul 5.1 brake fluid (it's still my DD), and DIY brake ducts. Still using stock rotors.
I'm also considering upgrading to the wilwood 6/4 pot combo with 14" front and 13" rear rotors. I heard a couple of guys liking them, but would they really perform that much better than the Brembo setup i have at the moment?
I'm especially impressed with the price. I think this would be the only BBK setup i would go with for now.
The only other option would be to get slotted rotors and more aggressive pads, but even then would the Wilwood kit work better?

Thanks guys

Z04

iTrader: (15)

hit up Todd at TCE.

ReV2Red

iTrader: (9)

Will do.

It would still be nice to hear other peoples thoughts.

Anyone?

burntZ

iTrader: (1)

i've wilwoods f & r and love them but feel they probably only equal the brembos.

they do have very good pad selection though which may be your issue

prior to the wilwoods i would go thru a set of the axxis ult pads in 1 track day (stock nissan calipers) they are only rated to 900degrees which - depending on your track/ session times - is pretty easy to overheat (melt to the backing plates!) with higher temp pads you should be fine,
i'd try that first unless those euros are really needing to be spent

maybe the porterfield R4 pads? they are good to 1200 - should be enough!

Good Luck!

terrasmak

iTrader: (8)

+1 thats what i did.

josesantigo57

iTrader: (4)

I never had brembos, but i did get the Wilwood 6pot front kit only and it performs great. Pair it with some brake ducts and forget about fade forever. Pads are freaking cheap too.

ReV2Red

iTrader: (9)

Anyone else? Todd still hasn't got back to me.

OnADimePBS

iTrader: (15)

I'll send you a PM here shortly

got556

iTrader: (5)

^^^Alex is the man...which reminds me I need to PM him lol. I've got a 13" 4piston front kit from him and love it.

OnADimePBS

iTrader: (15)

I appreciate ya boss! Glad you still like them. Shoot me a PM whenever you're ready, I'll be here.

ReV2Red

iTrader: (9)

Still no reply from Todd.
Anyone have any technical info?

Kraize05_Z

iTrader: (3)

The website is being updated we are changing the way it looks. New search options etc its going to be way better than the old one.

ReV2Red

iTrader: (9)

So how long will that take?
Still need help with brakes

terrasmak

iTrader: (8)

what info do you need ???

Kraize05_Z

iTrader: (3)

You can always call (805)388-1188 and talk to a technical representatives they can answer any questions you have about the product Monday through Friday, from 7:30am to 5:00pm (PST).

ThE_JacO

The difference in stopping power would be pretty limited, if any at all.
What you might see as a consequence of bigger rotors, bigger contact area and more pistons, is fading kicking in later, more uniform pad wear, and a more predictable and longer curve of decay in braking.

If you track something hard enough and have a heavy foot on the brakes, fading will always be an issue unless you're ready to spend a fortune.
The good thing about what you plan to do is that the expense is pretty small.
Especially if you're planning to change rotors and pads. OEM brembos always sell timely, and just the calipers in those kits, once you factor out rotors, lines and pads, are actually quite cheap.
No first hand experience on my side, but I've been researching a lot, and they seem to be very good value for money.

I'm thinking of the wilwood kit myself (my brake upgrading story is a pretty long and painful one, and anything car in Australia is a pain in the ****), but if you go for it and want to sell the brembos let me know, I'd buy the calipers and mounts for sure, braided lines too if they're decent.

ReV2Red

iTrader: (9)

That seems to be what i'm hearing. The stopping power is about the same, but you will get better fade resistance, which i think in my case isn't really that important, as i will be using the car for timeattack, and if i cook the brakes, then i just do a couple of slow laps to cool them down before doing another couple of fast ones.
However, if the wilwoods do actually provide a slightly better stopping power, and reduce unsprung weight, then i definitely think they would be worth it. The resistance to brake fade would just be a bonus i suppose.

ThE_JacO

Resistance to fade and high temperature efficiency is 99% of the point of a BBK and related components.
The difference in stopping power between cheap-**** pads, rotors and stock 2003 calipers, and a BBK kit below 6 grands, on a single hard brake from 200, is something you can measure in feet, usually single digit, and probably below 3 .
The people saying that since they upgraded to a bbk they can see their car stopping in half the space are usually those who haven't got over placebo effects

Speaking of cold brakes, the slightly bigger contact area might get you a iota more of stopping power, but I'd be surprised if it was anything more than a handful of centimeters between the track brembos and the wilwood upgrade.

More to the point though is that just a few really hard brakes on small flat rotors with oem pads will start cooking the back of the pad, make the liquid boil, and warp the rotor (exagerating a bit here), while a good kit can operate at much higher temperatures, and takes much longer to reach those anyway.

2 quiet laps are not enough to cool everything and "reset the fade counter" btw. They might get close to if they are at high speed with crossdrilled rotors, but I wouldn't be relying on that for more than a handful of resets.
Similarly, running 30min and stopping 30min is still short enough for brake degradation to show up harsher every time you pick up the car again.

Of course driving without braking at all is much better than just stopping to cool things down, but it's still not as quick as a couple laps in my experience (which is mostly on cars other than my Z at this point to be honest, but fading and braking are the same all over in nature).

ReV2Red

iTrader: (9)

Ok, so lets assume that the stopping power will be the same, you don't think the brembo setup with race pads, fluid, upgraded rotors, braided lines and brake ducts would be able to handle three or four hard laps, and that a couple of cool down laps wont bring the temps back down to do another few of hard laps?
If that's the case then they must be pretty crap brakes. I've heard of plenty of people tracking their car with upgraded pads and fluid with no fade, although i don't know how hard they were pushing there brakes.

I appreciate all the comments and help by the way!

ThE_JacO

On the countrary, I think the brembos, with decent rotors, pads, lines and fluid will be fine dealing with a few hard laps.
The difference between those and the upgraded wilwood would only become more obvious (if there is much) a fair bit farther in than a couple laps.

I made a bit of a mess of my post rambling left and right, but you can shrink it down to a handful of points:
1) bigger kit will not net you any more stopping power
2) it's always possible to get brakes to fade (unless you have an indecent amount of money and are a really good drive), so it's mostly a matter of what use you make of them.
3) bigger kits with the right components tend to behave better and recover better from higher temperatures than smaller ones (which might be the interesting bit for you)
4) factoring in new rotors and pads that you'd need to buy anyway, and how easily OE brembos sell, the wilwood kit isn't too much of an investment if you need 3 and/or looks.

At this point it would also be nice to have somebody pitch in that does time attack on their Z with comparable kits. My experience is in a different direction, so I'm mostly stating the obvious in my posts.