CptWiggles

I've been doing some searching, and was wondering why I hadn't seen a Bilstein Sport shock option when I came accross the link below.

http://z1auto.com/prodmore.asp?model...ng&prodid=4226

I contacted z1auto via email, and they confirmed that they do indeed offer both Bilstein HD and Sport shocks for the 350z. Anyone think this might be beneficial?

guitman32

iTrader: (15)

Beneficial in what sense?


To follow up on my previous post in this thread where I said they are not inverted...I just went to the Bilstein site and their dampers seem to have incorporated "upside down technology" -quoted from their site - I wonder what this entails, because from the pictures it looks like a huge piston and possibly internals (mass) moved up in the piston out of the body, making it a sprung weight.

Im not sure they apply to the 350z, although they do have new and old p/ns if you drill down in their catalog. I wonder if this will have implications in classes where shock piston diameter is regulated.

This must have changed somewhat recently because I was in their catalog not too long ago and did not notice. Or have I been living under a rock lol.

thekinn

iTrader: (18)

Sorry to go OT for a moment - but you might want to stay away from Z1Auto - https://my350z.com/forum/2003-2009-n...uto-in-ny.html

public service announcement over.. back on topic..

kilogram

iTrader: (1)

Shocks built with Bilstein inserts are pretty popular, actually. Pretty sure H&R use them exclusively. It's easy enough to tell if they're inverted by looking under the dust boot. If the "shaft" looks like it's about 40mm in diameter, it's inverted. That is actually the body of the damper. The real shaft is down inside the shock body, sealed off from the outside world, usually with motorcycle-style fork seals. I've never seen a set of Bilsteins for a Z in person though, which is why I was asking.

For the average user it probably makes no difference, I'm just curious about this stuff..

guitman32

iTrader: (15)

My point was that they switched to the inverted piston relatively recently...and thanks for elaborating on what I said, but you cannot be sure exactly how they have deployed this technology in the actual damper, which is why I was vague in my description. I do not like to assume* when the conversation is very specific. You shouldn't either.

I run Bilsteins myself fyi, and mine do not have the inverted piston.

guitman32

iTrader: (15)

dup.

JMSpeed

iTrader: (1)

It was discussed previously, but just so I'm clear, the HD's are a different shock than the what's provided in the B12 pro-kit? If I wanted to buy the pro-kit, sell the Eibach springs and replace them with the swift springs in this review, I should most likely expect different results correct?

yellowspecv

the shocks in the "b12" kit are re-valved to match the springs rates on the prokit springs .............

i hope i get this right but here is my understanding-- please call me out if i'm wrong !!!
======================================================
"b12 prokit" = Eibach prokit springs + "re-valved" b6 HD /// drop 40mm
"b12 sportline"= Eibach sportline + b8 HD "short shock" /// drop 50mm
======================================================
BILSTEIN B8 sp = short shock !!
BILSTEIN B6 HD = Regular Shock !!
======================================================
really there is crap load of miss information and the "sportline kit was discontinued" and they don't show the "b6" on there website anymore...................................... and apparently they are 2 kinds of "B8" and HD version and SP ????? this is madness !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

=====================================================

idk what's with them a 30mm kit with linear springs too much to ask !!!!

guitman32

iTrader: (15)

Lmao, nice post, your breakdown seems pretty accurate to me. I dunno about the b12 assumptions but for the lay person this is a great guideline.

yellowspecv

thanks dude, bored at work ...... i'm not trying to steer away from Zswickliffe original thread and i still believe the swift springs are better just the fact that the are linear.

but for the price of the b12 is very tempting.

JMSpeed

iTrader: (1)

Thank you. Seems odd that they wouldn't include the B8 short shock with the pro-kit version. 40mm is already fairly low relative to stock.

I wonder if I should get the sportline version of the B12 before selling the sportline aprings for the swift springs.

zswickliffe

iTrader: (2)

Bilstein told me if you're not dropping any more than 40mm, there's no reason to get the B8 shocks. Swift springs don't drop that low so it doesn't really matter.

yellowspecv

no no no no no ----- nonononono ........ .. i believe there is a good reason why they discontinued the sportline b12 kit ... you want the pro kit!!... :check this out!: a car that uses linear spring is more predictable because you get the same spring feel and load through the entire stroke, this is how your stock suspensions are set-up there is no change in load therefore being more predictable...... "BUT NO!!!" we want stiff stiff stiff!!! "TRACK DAY" bro.. and to lower the car, so you can say to that one dummie friend of yours that doesn't know anything about cars "the one you told him that you got the same engine of the GT-R on the 350z but it so happens that is not boosted" that your car is stanced !!!!!! -- so to get around this problemo spring companies tend to use progressive springs meaning that the use "two" different spring rates with in the same springs the initial load is soft comfortable and civilized, but the second you turn that corner hard so hard in fact that you load the to the bottom of the spring,, is gonna be incredible stiff so stiff in fact that is gonna feel like you bottom out.... so yeah a i'm not saying that a progressive spring is a bad idea as long as the initial spring rate is small difference from the final rate..........

how i know this from experience.. my brother has sportlines on his 07 sentra spec V, and those suckers drop his car a massive 2 inches .. and it kills shocks like a fatty boy that just bought 2 boxes of Twinkies "and he just found out that there are gonna close the factory so he has an excuse to go buy more " not only that, they don't make any aftermarket Short shocks nobody buddy !!!


OOOOOOOOOOH this is the revise suspension rates "the golden child" that all suspensions should be measure up to lol
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
2004.5 - 2008 (suspension revised midway into 2004 production, revision increased rear spring rate, revised shock damping front and rear, stiffer front sway bar and revised rear dustshield/bumpstops)
314/427
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
350Z oem spring rates 2003-2004
314/342
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Eibach 350Z progressive springs 1”/1”
Spring rates in LBS initial/final front 296/384 initial/final rear 316/421

Eibach 350Z sportline progressive springs 1.2"/1.2"
F: 239/400 R: 257/435 "look at those changes in rates ..stupid"

Swift 350Z linear springs .8”/.6” drop
Spring rates in LBS 336/364

Swift 350Z Spec-R progressive springs 1.2”/1”
Spring rates in LBS intial/final Front: 291/392 Rear: 280/448

yellowspecv

true that !!! the even call there shocks "40mm" so there is no need to use a shorty shocks ,

JMSpeed

iTrader: (1)

Thank you guys. I think I'm going to go for the b12 pro-kit for value and think about selling the Eibachs. I don't want more than a 1in drop so the packaged shocks should be good if I replace the packaged springs for something similar.

JMSpeed

iTrader: (1)

You guys must have called at just the right time, because when I called twice, both reps had conflicting information.

One said only the b8s exist but were not valved to match the Eibachs if I got the kit. The other said I couldn't get the shocks alone, but that the shocks were in fact valved to match the springs.

We'll see. Only $75 more than Tokico kit so worth it for the brand reputation.

yellowspecv

Call Tirerack those guys are far more knowledgeable in bilstein , heck buy from them , and yes the shock on the kit are valves specifically for the prokit but I don't think you can buy the alone .....

JMSpeed

iTrader: (1)

When you installed the shocks, did you install the rear with nut on top, followed by the included washer and then the OE upper mount assembly?

Also, how did you torque the top nut down? I could only hand tighten it and I think that or the wrong order above is causing me to rattle in the rear. I think the instructions say different amounts of torque based on size of the nut.

kilogram

iTrader: (1)

Actually, that is how they do all their inverted strut applications. There is no reason to believe they would do something drastically different in a redesign on a car that's out of production (frankly, there's no reason they would do a redesign at all). In fact, I believe it's more likely that bit of their site is just generic information and probably doesn't apply to the Z.

We'll find out soon enough. I ordered a set, and they're currently on backorder from Germany, so they should be the new style, if there is a new inverted style. Probably won't see them until February.

guitman32

iTrader: (15)

Yes, but they haven't ALWAYS offered an inverted strut application for the Z. Did you miss the part where I say I run Bilstein shocks myself?

My comment re: the change was based on what I observed in this thread, and since I have first hand experience I know they weren't always inverted for the Z. I never made any assumptions, other than what we observed in this thread, about why, or if they even actually are different.

Good luck with your Bilsteins! Feel free to share and tell when you get them in.